Engine: 200R4 to 170 6 cyl adapter

[stuuder]

I'm looking for someone who has done this swap and knows someone who sells and adapter for this conversion. I love the 6, just really leary of the Borg especially when the convertor locks up making strange noises. Plus my rearend gears are quite low ( at least 4:10 and maybe more) at 60 the ol six is screaming. I've tried Meyers, Cathcart, Steeltech, Levesque.............any others?

Thanx

[Leosnake]

A few years ago I asked the same thing!...Contacted the same people and a few others who make adapters for other applications...problem was they needed a block for mock up and the shipping costs and labor made this too costly to do. Although there was a club member who did the conversion himself. I contacted him for details for him to make an additional adapter...Unfortunately his wife had major health issues whch prevented him from doing any projects...and I lost contact with him!

[StudeRich]

There is no reason to fear a good Borg Warner CAST IRON CASE Flight-O-Matic Automatic Transmission, they are one of the strongest most dependable Trans. ever made.

However when you talk about a converter "locking up" I have to wonder what is going on, do you have an old '50 to '55 Studebaker Automatic 3 band Detroit Gear Trans. with a lock-up converter behind a newer OHV 170 6?

Or maybe you have that cheap Aluminum case Borg Warner AS8-35 or AS30-35 "Rambler" Automatic used on '63 & '64 6 Cyl. cars, if so you need to get a '62 Lark 6, Flight-O-Matic Trans.

A lockup converter as in a GM Turbo Hydramatic, is just something else to wear out and break, which they do a lot!

You are probably just experiencing a cracked Converter flex plate issue, because constant drive converters almost never give any trouble at all.

If you install 3.54 gears in the axle it should be fine.

[stuuder]

Yup its the big old cast iron BW with 1st gear start, in my 53 HT, yup its an early 170........ actually shifts quite nicely 1st-2nd, and then the convertor locks up into direct drive, you can actually hear mechanical "happenings" when it does this. If going up a good short hill, if I keep backing out of the throttle it will stay engaged down to I think about 12mph...maybe 15, if I peg the throttle it downshifts fine but has a tendency to "slip" under full throttle. And theres the leaks, so far no convertor leak though.
Wish my son was still working for Listo Plastics, we could carve out an adaptor in no time, like I did for my electric truck I built...........but thats another story :-)

PS: I have been using Mercon in it............type F very scarce.......



Know what?? Now I'm a little cornfused.........think I'll throw it on the hoist................Detroit Gear..................hmmmmmmmmm......Back again ........20 min delay :-) it is INDEED a Detroit Gear Div with Borg Warner Corp on the red and silver oval tag on the left side of the case. Model DG 150 serial # S-CH-43521.
thanks guys.

Ian

There is no reason to fear a good Borg Warner CAST IRON CASE Flight-O-Matic Automatic Transmission, they are one of the strongest most dependable Trans. ever made.

However when you talk about a converter "locking up" I have to wonder what is going on, do you have an old '50 to '55 Studebaker Automatic 3 band Detroit Gear Trans. with a lock-up converter behind a newer OHV 170 6?

Or maybe you have that cheap Aluminum case Borg Warner AS8-35 or AS30-35 "Rambler" Automatic used on '63 & '64 6 Cyl. cars, if so you need to get a '62 Lark 6, Flight-O-Matic Trans.

A lockup converter as in a GM Turbo Hydramatic, is just something else to wear out and break, which they do a lot!

You are probably just experiencing a cracked Converter flex plate issue, because constant drive converters almost never give any trouble at all.

If you install 3.54 gears in the axle it should be fine.

[stuuder]

Yup its the big old cast iron BW with 1st gear start, in my 53 HT, yup its an early 170........ actually shifts quite nicely 1st-2nd, and then the convertor locks up into direct drive, you can actually hear mechanical "happenings" when it does this. If going up a good short hill, if I keep backing out of the throttle it will stay engaged down to I think about 12mph...maybe 15, if I peg the throttle it downshifts fine but has a tendency to "slip" under full throttle. And theres the leaks, so far no convertor leak though.
Wish my son was still working for Listo Plastics, we could carve out an adaptor in no time, like I did for my electric truck I built...........but thats another story :-)

PS: I have been using Mercon in it............type F very scarce.......



Know what?? Now I'm a little cornfused.........think I'll throw it on the hoist................Detroit Gear..................hmmmmmmmmm......Back again ........20 min delay :-) it is INDEED a Detroit Gear Div with Borg Warner Corp on the red and silver oval tag on the left side of the case. Model DG 150 serial # S-CH-43521.
thanks guys.

Ian

UPDATE::::::;
Well I picked up a 200-4R the other day with the lockup converter, looks like its from an 84 buick, dual bolt pattern, no history on it but pretty black sludge in the pan bottom, no big chunks but looks like friction material........ got it for $100.

I keep looking at the Meyers kit and just wonder if one could redrill the plate for the 170. Anyone have specs as far as crankshaft flywheel flange OD (seal area) and bolt pattern(studs) as to whether the 259-289 is the same as the 170??

[klifton1]

Try Bendtsen's Transmission adapters. (763) 767-4480 Ham Lake, Mn.
Klif

[sweetolbob]

Posted by stuuder
Well I picked up a 200-4R the other day with the lockup converter,

Don't forget that you need a TV cable to control shifting and a way to lock up the converter. http://www.southernrods.com/categori...oduct-632.html

Bob

[stuuder]

Try Bendtsen's Transmission adapters. (763) 767-4480 Ham Lake, Mn.
Klif

Yup I did, a couple of times actually. Ballbark $1200...........but they have one already for the Hudson 308!!:-0

[royvaldez]

I have been looking for a person to do this to my 245 stude commander motor. I called Bendtsen's Transmission adapters. (763) 767-4480 Ham Lake, Mn about a year ago, he would not do it.

[stuuder]

Just wonder how close all these bellhousing bolt patterns are??? Have to line 'em all in a row to see......:=) Unfortunately I did have a couple of sixes in my stuff, but when I moved all was sold.........always the way.........

[royvaldez]

I called Bendtsen's today. They would make an adaptor plate to place an up dated trans. To make a adaptor plate for my 245 stude motor he wants $750 - 1500.00 Now he wants me to ship a motor to Mn. Now I have to find someone in the same town who has a 245 motor with crank, bell housing , and flywheel. Anyone have short block I can use in Ham Lake, Mn.

[stuuder]

yup basically the same answer as I got,Roy. I talked to Jon Meyers yesterday, he said one MAY be able to use his adapter plate and redrill the holes to mate to the 6, also he said the crank flange od's were different and one would have to make a different "locating ring" to center the adapter plate and also maybe redrill the chebbie flex plate, the same ford starter could be used......... doesn't sound to hard to me...........:-) Maybe Jon should think about making a uni-plate that fitz all engines :-)

[royvaldez]

I would buy a plate.

[stuuder]

So.....carrying on.............does anyone in our Studedom have the block bellhousing bolt patterns for the 170,185,245, sixes and the 259-289 v8's?? Surely there must be some drawings and dimensions somewhere?? Also crankshaft flange diameters and bolt pattern??
Heres a site I found in my travels for SBC bellhousing pattern which in turn would be any TH auto with the chevy, not BOP pattern.....my 200-4R has both patterns, also I have found that the chevy crankshaft flange bolt pattern is 3.580"(pre '85)'86 up is 3" bolt pattern , and that the common flexplate is 168Tooth 14" dia.

Update: Thanks to Bob Johnstones web sit I found the Stude V8 crankshaft flange OD is 3.8095-3.8105", bolt circle diameter is 3.1245", bolt hole diameter is .374-.37525, center pilot hole is .9365-.9375 and that the bolt spacing is uneven, 6 bolt holes spaced @ 64 degrees,56degrees,60 degrees. Anyone have a 6 banger crank flange they would care to measure the next time they are in the garage.. :-)

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php?showtopic=59858

[r1lark]

So.....carrying on.............does anyone in our Studedom have the block bellhousing bolt patterns for the 170,185,245, sixes and the 259-289 v8's?? Surely there must be some drawings and dimensions somewhere?? Also crankshaft flange diameters and bolt pattern??
Heres a site I found in my travels for SBC bellhousing pattern which in turn would be any TH auto with the chevy, not BOP pattern.....my 200-4R has both patterns, also I have found that the chevy crankshaft flange bolt pattern is 3.580"(pre '85)'86 up is 3" bolt pattern , and that the common flexplate is 168Tooth 14" dia

http://forums.hybridz.org/index.php?showtopic=59858

If you have the part numbers for either the block or the engine plate that fits between the block and bellhousing, you can see if the Studebaker National Musuem can provide a copy of the blueprint. From the blueprint you can get the pattern and dimensions. Same thing for the crankshaft. Might be kinda pricey depending on how many blueprints you need tho.......