Problems installing Tremec TKO

[okc63avanti]

What GibbsR1 said.....I had the very same thing happening with my TKO 500 behind my R4, took me 4 removals of the trans and measuring to realize the bearing retainer snout was too long and rubbing the disk hub, once I figured that out had it machined back for clearance and every thing fit and worked great......Keep on Studebakering

Was it a TKO with Ford 10 spline input shaft or was it TKO with GM 26 spline input shaft? How much was it machined back?

[okc63avanti]

John, I would say the max length of the bearing retainer is 3.5" A flanged pilot bearing is not off the shelf, a machine shop could make it, or i sell them.

Alan, I think the bearing retainer snout is rubbing the clutch disc hub, not allowing it to release properly. Not the clutch fingers hitting the bearing retainer. All of the s10 collars I have seen were stubby. Also, they are 3.750" dia so make sure it has a a bushing to center it properly, the stock stude is 1.500"

John, it you don't have any luck, ship it down to Cincinnati and we'll get it figured out.

Dan the Tremec TKO we installed is part no. TCET5009 This is the TKO 600 with GM 26 spline input and OD ratio of 0.64. Attached to this post is a image file of the TKO dimensions. Dimension "C" bearing retainer length for the Ford spline is 4.48" the length for the GM spline is 3.19". Yesterday you said we needed to be under 3.5" so what do you think?

[Starlight]

Was it a TKO with Ford 10 spline input shaft or was it TKO with GM 26 spline input shaft? How much was it machined back?

It was a TKO with Ford 10 spline, and so help me, I can't remember how much we machined off, sorry, by that last time pulling the trans I didn't care how much we took off, just that it finally worked.....Keep on Studebakering

[okc63avanti]

Thanks John. It seems most people have used the Ford T-5 or TKO trans versus the GM (Muncie) trans. The latest on what we are doing is as follows:

The transmission will be pulled off tomorrow and we are going to compare all the measurements of the input shaft (length, engagement distance into pilot bearing, length of where splines begin from tip of shaft and the length of the throw out bearing retainer front the transmission face) against the measurements of a Studebaker BW T-10 4 speed. As Dan has suggested we may adjust the bearing retainer snout or maybe machine back where the splines start (Mike did this to a T-5 once and it worked). I am confident we will get it figured out and using a Studebaker T-10 that originally fit into the Stude bellhousing will be a good comparison.

[Skybolt]

I was not going to mention this because I am not sure of measurement of this conversion. What I have done is not specifically related to your transmission. I have in the past, and am in the process right now, of a Ford Toploader conversion. During this conversion I have had the center hole of the flywheel machined to take a 17mm bearing. This supports the input shaft. If you cant get the distance to the back of the crank it should not be a concern. Many cars these days use bearings in the flywheel so it's nothing new. I'm not saying this is for you or even that it might be possible given your application, just that it is a piece of information that might be of some interest.

[okc63avanti]

Here's the latest on our progress. The input shaft on the Tremec TKO 600 with GM 26 spline shaft was longer than we thought and actually embeds inside the pilot pushing about 1 inch. However, the place on the shaft where the taper starts for the splines was rubbing the end of the crank shaft. Michael is having a machine shop turn down the splines about 1/8" on a lathe while maintaining the same angle of the taper. It will be ready for him to pick up tomorrow and hopefully by the end of the week the clutch, 5 speed and car while be driving.

[Bob Andrews]

John, did you look at this? One of the best tech threads ever, anywhere:

http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?8204-Studebaker-Avanti-TKO-5-speed-install-how-to

[okc63avanti]

Yes Bob that thread is for using a Tremec TKO (Ford Box) 10 spline input shaft. Using the Tremec Ford box requires an adapter plate from Dan Giblin (shown in the thread you mentioned). Most people use a Ford box because they can't find an early 61~62 Stude bellhousing with GM bolt pattern. Michael found me a Stude bellhousing with GM pattern so we used a Tremec TKO (GM or Muncie Box) it uses a 26 spline input shaft. Even Bob Johnstone's excellent web resource site with many T-5 or Tremec TKO installation notes seem to go with the Ford Box.

We attempted something different and I believe we are real close to getting it right. But thanks for the thought.

[okc63avanti]

FINAL - GOOD NEWS !!!

63-R2386 is driving with clutch and Tremec TKO 5 speed working. In a short summary Here is what was done to make the combination bellhousing, 5 speed and clutch work.

1. Used early Studebaker Borg Warner T-10 4 speed bellhousing (the one with GM bolt pattern)
2. Used Tremec TKO 600 5 speed transmission (has GM 26 spline input shaft)
3. Milled (cut down) the input shaft bearing retainer plate collar (on front of trans box) diameter to fit inside the opening on the Studebaker bell housing.
4. Machine pilot bushing
5. Used throwout bearing assembly and AMS Automotive Rhino Pac diagphram clutch kit (Chevy, GM)
6. The input shaft embedded into pilot pushing in the end of crank almost an inch.
7. The distance from pilot bushing end of input shaft to where the taper of splines start after embedding into pilot busing was too close to the crank and the spline taper was rubbing, hitting the end of the crank shaft.
8. Pulled input shaft from trans and had machine shop mill about 1/8" of the splines off while maintaining the angle where the taper of the splines start.
9. Bolted it all back up and the car is shifting easily and correctly as it should.

[bezhawk]

Glad it worked out! As I mentioned in our conversation a couple of weeks ago, I ran into this problem before.