Cool/Heat: Putting AC into my 1961 Lark 4 door wagon

[ajalstude]

Hey everyone!

Well the New Mexico summers are finally getting to me, and I've had a couple of friends recently put AC into their classic cars, so of course now I have the itch to do the same for mine.

I've been researching the market, and looking up past tech tips on the forum in order to get an idea of how to set my system up. I'm currently leaning towards installing a vintage under the dash unit that a fellow club member gave me - it's off of a 1964, but appears to be the same unit used since 1962 and I think it will fit under the dash of my 61. The unit is in working order, but I intend to give it a through cleaning and flushing out of the system.

Now that I have the evaporator/blower, I need to get all of the other parts. I'm leaning towards buying the rest of my components from Vintage Air - Sanden compressor, condenser, drier, and all necessary lines and fittings - this company also offers a bracket and pulley set for the Studebaker 259 V-8 with power steering which seems quite convenient.

Has anyone here installed this set up on their car before, and if so what tips might you have in regards to condenser size, compressor model, connecting a modern system to a vintage blower/evaporator, as well as tips on mounting and running the lines through the firewall?

Another important question - what should I do to keep the car from running hot? I like using parts that are stock or "of the era" when practical, and I was wondering if a five-bladed Avanti fan would suffice, perhaps connected to the clutch that was used in that set up. Would such a set up mount easily to a 259 V-8 in a 61 Lark?

Thank you everyone for your tips!

Best,
Albert

[mbstude]

I installed AC on a '61 Lark last year. The evaporator was OEM Studebaker while all of the other components were "modern". I'll list the break down of the parts I used and how it went together.

Compressor mount - Aftermarket 1980's era York compressor mount with an adapter to bolt on a Sanden. The mount & drive setup from Vintage Air should also work fine, I just used what I had on hand.

Condenser - There is very little room between the radiator and the grille on a 61 Lark, so mounting the condenser was a bit of a chore. The one I used was UAC brand, # 70007C. I made my own mounting brackets.

Drier and hoses - Vintage Air kit # 547000. This came with most of the various hose fittings I needed, though I still had to buy a few additional ones. Don't forget you'll need to buy a pressure switch for the compressor and plumb that into the system as well.

All of your modern components will use O-Ring fittings, and your vintage evaporator will use Flare fittings. Flare fittings for the hoses are still readily available, just buy the ones you need and crimp them onto your new hoses.

I should mention that I bought my own AC hose crimper, and made up the hoses as I went along. Much easier than trying to figure it out and take the hoses and fittings elsewhere for crimping. A basic hydraulic crimper isn't that expensive and it's always fun to buy new tools.

I would suggest that you install a new expansion valve on the evaporator. Old Air Products has a large assortment of new valves for vintage evaporators. Just find the one that matches up to yours. https://www.oldairproducts.com/produ...20valve&mainc=

Holes in the firewall - I ordered a copy of the 61 Lark Air Conditioning Installation Instructions (AC-3113) from the Studebaker National Museum Archives. The instructions include a template for the correct hole locations. BTW, a "punch out set" works significantly better than trying to drill a hole that big.

Cooling system - I had rebuilt the engine and the coolant passages in the block were spotless. I also bought a new aluminum radiator from CGJ in Alabama. The stock 4 blade fan works fine, as long as the rest of the cooling system is in good condition.

I think that's pretty much it. If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.

[ajalstude]

Mbstude, thank you for this excellent write-up. Going through what you wrote, I have a couple of questions:

The UAC brand, # 70007C Condenser - online, it notes that it's a 12 x 21" unit, but I read in the comments that at least one person who purchased it found it to be 12 x 18." Do you recall how large the condenser was? Also, how large were the brackets and where did you mount them to?

For the Vintage Air kit # 547000, you noted that you needed to buy a few more fittings - about now many more should I pick up? Are they the same sort of O-ring fittings that came with the kit? And how many flare fittings will I need? I do have access to a crimper, thankfully!

Out of curiosity what expansion valve did you use on your evaporator? I didn't see a valve for a Studebaker evaporator - I'm planning on using an evaporator that came off of a '64, which seems to be the same type used between 1962-1964.

Which Sanden unit are you using? I'm looking at either a 508, which pumps 8.4 cu. in. per revolution, and a 709, which pumps 9.5 cu. in. per revolution.

One final question, I notice that you are still using your generator. I've had a few people tell me to switch to an alternator, but I'm willing to stick to my generator for now if the addition of AC doesn't interfere too much with charging.


Thank you again for the very informative response to my original post!

Best,
Albert

[pinehurstbob]

I recently added a shroud on the stock rad for my 60 convert (259 Auto) to lower running temperature and it does work. No air on my car but I do believe that Studebaker used this shroud on air conditioned cars back in the day. Studebaker International has the shroud, not cheap, but likely a good investment. Looks to me like Matt has a higher capacity rad and does not need a shroud.
Bob

[jackb]

Excellent write-up. Now honestly.....what thermostat are you running in that FL car, and what is the honest temperature reading on the dash at road and stop light speeds ?? Also, as I have installed several (stock) AC systems in several cars/trucks in Mass.....don't even try to install without thoroughly cleaning the block !! Your engine temps will never be good in your clime....GL

[mbstude]

Excellent write-up. Now honestly.....what thermostat are you running in that FL car, and what is the honest temperature reading on the dash at road and stop light speeds ?? Also, as I have installed several (stock) AC systems in several cars/trucks in Mass.....don't even try to install without thoroughly cleaning the block !! Your engine temps will never be good in your clime....GL

I've always used 160 thermostats in all of my Studes and typically the temp gauge needle stays right at the halfway point on the gauge, regardless of outside temp or traffic conditions.

I agree, having the car's cooling system in perfect condition is important. Driving around with the coolant passages in the block full of crud and a half-plugged radiator is asking for trouble, with or without AC.

My '53 Commander K-body had AC installed when the car was restored in 1996. Stock 232 with 6 volt electrics, stock 4 blade fan, stock (re-cored) radiator. It's been driven continuously in the Florida summers with the AC on for the last 28 years and has never had an issue with overheating.

When these cars were new, people drove them in the summer and in stop-and-go traffic. No reason why it should be any different today.

[jackb]

my experiences exactly. The block clean is a dirty job, but pays dividends in July traffic or down south....

[mbstude]

ajalstude In response to your "comment" below my previous post - Unfortunately I no longer own that car, and I didn't make note of those other details.

You'll only need two flare fittings, one for each connection on the evaporator. Once you have the holes in the firewall and the evaporator mounted under the dash, you'll be able to figure out what style fittings you need (straight, elbow, etc).

I don't know which of those expansion valves I used on the Lark. The pictures on that site are accurate, just find the valve that looks identical to your old one.

I didn't mention it but I ran R-134 in that car. The old evaporator doesn't care what kind of refrigerant you use.

[ajalstude]

Thank you mbstude!

[ajalstude]

Mbstude, did you include an evaporator temperature switch in your set up? A friend of mine mentioned using one in his non-Studebaker set-up and wondered if I needed one.

[ajalstude]

Also, if I install AC, do I need to switch to an alternator, or will my generator be able to handle everything?

[jackb]

If the generator is in good condition, leave in there. My experience has been good even with lights on at night. I don't recall a different generator for A/C equipped cars in 61' (?).

[ajalstude]

Thank you Jack - that'll save me a few dollars for now. Also hello again! I used to live in Mass and remember you from one of the meets there.

[mbstude]

All of my pre-1963 Studes have always had a generator, even those with AC. The only "downside" with a generator is that you'll have a discharge situation when the engine is at idle.

But if you're driving the car, how much time does the engine spend at idle?