Engine: When should I change from break-in oil to regular oil ?

[BassMan]

Hello All----I have about 45 or 50 minutes of run time on my 289 engine (on the stand). The cam should be broken in by now I would assume. When should I switch to regular oil on the Stude engine?? What brand of oil do folks prefer? BassMan

[yeroldad]

I run break in oil for at least 500 miles. Depending on how dark the oil gets, might even run it longer. I use Redline break in oil. I usually use Castrol 20/50. Most any oil is good, but I do not use Pennzoil or Valvoline under any circumstance. I also do not use 10/whatever oil. I feel 10W is just too thin for earlier engines. Straight 30W is fine also.

[Bud]

If you want, you can change the oil especially if you have either no oil filter or a partial flow filter. Contrary to popular belief, both Valvoline and Pennzoil are excellent oils. I've been using Shell Rotella T4 15W-40 in the engine of my 62 GT for more years than I care to remember with excellent results. Valvoline VR1 oil is also an excellent choice for an older engine as it has a good amount of ZDDP in it which is what I use in my Avanti's engine as that is what the engine rebuilder recommended. If your engine is new and has the proper bearing clearances, I would recommend using 10W-30 as 20W-50 is not necessary for good oil pressure in a new engine and isn't really the best choice since you are in Ohio and you have to deal with cold ambient air temperatures in the winter. SAE 30 is an almost obsolete viscosity as the modern multi vis oils do a far better job of protecting internal engine parts and flow a bunch better at lower temperatures. Bud

[StudeRich]

Oil is THE Most controversial topic here.
Most of us run Valvoline Racing VR1, 10W-30 or 30Wt. in the Silver bottle with 13% of Zinc and 12% of Phosphorus known as ZDDP.

But THEN there are those who do not agree, so they are welcome to do that.

Some believe that Diesel Oil is the way to go, but it's level of ZDDP has also been heavily reduced.

Some believe that the run of the mill "Shelf Oil" is Ok and many have ran a certain Brand for 30 or more years or more with no problem, but they forget that the Low ZDDP is a recent event in the last few years so prior experience does not matter.

However, due to the Low Valve Spring Pressure and other characteristics of our old school Engines it will take a Lot of years & for sure Miles, for Cam and Lifter damage to happen, so take your chances with whichever method that "floats your boat" !

Just run the other way from ANY Oil now in large supply, that contains the Number "0" Wt. or "5" Wt.
Non Multi-weight straight 10 Wt. would not be good, unless you live in Northern Alaska.

[StudeRich]

OH, forgot the length of Time/Miles to run break-in Oil.
That would also have several answers, but I would not change it until a real break-in has been done, like 500 Miles or more of actual Driving if you run an Oil Filter.

[BassMan]

Thanks for your input----yeroldad, Bud and StudeRich. I used Amsoil break in oil . It is a straight 30 weight non synthetic mineral oil. I don't know if it is true or not, but I have read that you can have too much ZDDP. The amsoil had a good amount of ZDDP in it but not the highest available. I believe the Lucas break in oil has huge amounts of ZDDP. It looks like from what everyone is saying that I should run a lot longer than 45 minutes on break in oil. I think I will change the oil and filter and run the engine some more while varying the RPM and then try adjusting the carb after I stop this leak.
I bought this car from the family of a gentleman (his family) that passed away. He lived in the Cleveland area. There was a quart of the Valvoline VR 1 Racing oil in the trunk of the car. The car was off-framed about 20 years ago, and is in excellent condition. He must have kept it in a heated garage because it is not rusted. This car has had a lot of love, and it shows it. The family gave me all the pictures that were taken thru the years. But the engine was very tired and it was blowing water out the right bank and everything was leaking. But I thought the car was worth fixing for sure. I'm a machinist by trade (retired) so I know how to read mics, calipers and other measuring instruments, but it has been more work than I thought. I am hoping it will pay off in the end. I'm just a so-so back yard mechanic so I knew the basics but not much more. This forum has been a life saver for me. It enables me to tap into hundreds of years of knowledge with just a tap of the "enter" button on my computer. That's pretty neat if you think about it! If you have any more input you think might be helpful , don't hesitate to chime in---Thanks again--BassMan

[Bud]

There is truth in the saying that you can have too much ZDDP as in concentrated amounts it can become an abrasive and cause more damage than good. This is why I keep saying that adding those small bottles of supposed ZDDP additive to the oil can cause more damage than good. As an added note I've used Chevron Delo full synthetic 5W-40 several time sin my Hawk with no difference in oil consumption, oil pressure or the way the engine runs. It's my opinion that in an engine that is in good condition, using an oil with a 5W in its rating will not do any damage to the engine. It is the higher number such as a 30 or 40 that is the number that makes the difference when the oil is hot. In reality an oil with a 5 or 10W rating as its lower number can actually be beneficial as those oils flow much better when they're cold getting oil to critical spots much faster than a straight 30 or 40 oil which is one of the reasons why all of the newer cars use multigrade oils. Bud

[enjenjo]

There should be no problem in using multigrade oil in your engine since it is a vintage engine newly assembled to modern specs. If there is some question in your mind you could use a 20-50 oil if you think the clearances warrant it.

[Buzzard]

I am in the midst of building a 21st Century Studebaker V8. With all the modifications and upgrades, I am looking forward to running 0W40 Mobil 1 Synthetic oil in order to replicate the success of the Chryco SRT Hemi boys. The super low viscosity is a secret ingredient in the new performance motors running ultra low drag rings.
It isn't 1960 Dorothy.
Bill

[StudeRich]

Good luck with that, are Bearing and Piston clearances the same as Toyota, Honda?

[BassMan]

Thanks to everyone----good discussion. I have heard and read that these new engines do have much tighter clearances. I have a Toyota Rav 4 (2014) that calls out 0w-20 as the preferred oil for the 4 cylinder engine. I couldn't help but notice what the manual said-your going to like this one!
It specifically says to use 0w-20 unless you drive in dusty dirty conditions OR you are towing heavy loads. Then you should use 0w-30 ! I take that to mean that if you drive in the perfect situation like very clean roads and not towing a load, that 0w-30 is not as good??????????
That just don't sound right to me. I have used 0w-30 Mobile one full synthetic oil since 2014 when I bought it new. It now has 170 thousand on the clock. It does not use oil and runs as perfect as it did the day I bought it. For these tight tolerances on the newer vehicles I think the 0w is the most important number because it pumps fast, but I would not put a 0w -20 or 30 in my Studebaker. I suppose if you built a 289 from the ground up with these tight tolerances you should be able to run thinner oils. What little I know ( and that's not much) it's always a balance between " flow" and "pressure" in the end. Thanks again for the good conversation--BassMan

[Hawklover]

You know one can get a large headache with this topic............I have just about 25K miles on my R-1 Avanti since its rebuild back in 1997. I have utilized many brands of oil, 10-20 10-30 and 10-40. If they had enough zinc I have no idea, when available I have used VR-1 20/50.......as the car is never used in the winter, and limited in spring and summer.......so maybe in a year 300 miles. Hard to believe this used to be my daily driver:-)........... I do have those small bottles of ZDDP, but have not seen fit to add any to my car.

[Bud]

In a fresh engine where the clearances are well within spec, a lighter oil such as a 5W-30, 10W-30 or 5W-40 will not damage the engine and in most cases be beneficial as the lighter oils flows better especially at lower temperatures getting oil to critical moving parts faster. The higher number is the one that is critical as an oil such as a 5W- 30 will have the same viscosity as a straight 30 when it's hot. I've been using Chevron Delo 5W-40 for the last three oil changes in my Hawk and the only difference I can see is a bit lower oil pressure when the engine is cold and it is the same or slightly better than 15W-40 conventional when the engine is warm due to the oil being full synthetic. I wouldn't use an oil such like a 0W-20. While I don't believe the engine will self destruct because of it, there would be lower oil pressure and probably higher oil consumption. I checked the shop manual for bearing clearances in the 5.3 engine in my Silverado and they are the same bearing clearances as what you would see in an earlier engine like our Studebakers. GM specs a 5W-30 oil for the engine and the engine has good oil pressure and no oil consumption. Time marches on and along with that there is a big improvement in lubricants and filtration which are two of the reasons the new engines are lasting well over 200,000 miles and still running well and not using oil. Even engine producers such as Briggs and Stratton now specify a 5W-30 full synthetic oil instead of straight 30 for all of their engines and that number is back speced for their earlier engines. Bud

[jackb]

??? When talking clearances, obviously it is meant "all" clearances not just bearings , right ? Any discussion on upper valve train, etc ?

[JoeHall]

In considering viscosity, IMHO the oil pump should also be considered. For decades, I ran 15W50 Mobil 1 in all Studes, year round, in the desert and here in Kentucky. About 10-15 years ago, I installed a 1980s-90s vintage Olds oil pump in the 56J's Packard motor (thanks to the Packard V8 boys); it had about 75,000 miles since last rebuild, so the increased oil pressure / circulation was not an issue in continuing with 15W50, and it never went above 60 PSI, which is when the PRV opens on the Olds pump. But after a rebuild, now about 10,000 miles ago, the oil pressure ran too high and would nearly peg the gauge when above 2000 RPM, even when fully warmed up (the PRV could not keep up). So I went to 10W30, and it now runs about where I want it, 5-10 PSI higher than an OEM pump, but never above 60 PSI. Not sure what you'd run into with 0W, or 5W in a Stude, but sounds like Buzzard is gonna find out.

[JoeHall]

As for the OP and when to change break in oil, 500-1000 miles IMHO.

[Buzzard]

FWIW I always change my oil and filter after the 1/2 hour break-in period. It gives me chance to visually check the oil for contaminants which you do not want to find.
Bill