Transmission / Overdrive: Transmission Identification

[lanthony2020]

Hello, I purchased a 1949 2R5 in about 2006. One owner/driver, postmaster from OK. He died in 72. His daughter stored it for 30 years. She sold it to an old restorer in Kansas near OK, I was told. This apparently was his last project before he died.

It came with two engines and two transmissions. The one motor was apart and had been cleaned, bored, line bored, head planed, and crank ground, etc.. It came with new assembly parts as well.

One transmission appears to be a three speed, original, I think. The other appears to be an overdrive unit. The OD unit has dissimilar mounts and I am not sure what it came from. Can you tell me by looking at the pics?

LN

[bezhawk]

The non OD transmission looks like a T eighty six. The OD transmission looks like a T ninety six. /sorry I lost my number function on the keyboard....spilled soup

[StudeRich]

The Direct Trans. looks like a T-86 because they are very similar (same Case) as the T-90 Used on 6 Cyl. Trucks, that is likely what it is.

Does your Truck have the O.D. Shift Cable, Wiring Harness, Kickdown Switch and Relay?
The Overdrive was available in Trucks and is a much better choice than a straight stick, due to the probably 4.88 Rear Axle Ratio = 45-50 MPH Top.

Your lightweight T-96 Overdrive is probably for a Car, if you are worried about Rear Engine Mounts they bolt to the Clutch Housing and they or the Housing can be changed.

Possibly you could switch the Housings if the Trans. Bolt Pattern matches.

This would logically be what someone was trying to install. It is not the H.D. Truck T-90 but IF you had or have a TRUCK Clutch housing to match both Engine and Trans. and you do not intend to haul a Load in the truck it MIGHT work.

We are assuming BOTH Engines are the Champion 169 C.I.D. small flathead six that a 2R5 would have, but maybe not?

Note that on the Clutch housing with the T-96 Car Trans. the Starter is on the Left.
On the Clutch housing with the probably T-90 Truck Trans. the Starter is on the Right.

Someone has not been reading his Studebaker Truck Parts Catalog to determine which Parts fit what.

[lanthony2020]

I apologize. Since I've been back to my second home after three surgeries, cannot locate manual. I have all three??? Rented out house placed them where I was sure to find them. That's why I can't find them! I will have to purchase new ones to find the old ones now? Go figure.

Sorry again, just not thinking. I have pulled the numbers off the transmissions and what I believe to be the original engine.

Original Motor:
524807-3
H526989
S3
D427
Original Transmission
T86E - 1
Bell - 663469
Tail - L3981
OD Transmission
T96 1A
WG bIV
OD Tail - R108 - 1E

LN

[StudeRich]

As I said the T-90 has a T-86 Case so the Low and Second gear tooth count would have to be checked to be sure if you have Cruise-n gears or Haul-n gears.

But all you care about is if the Input shaft and bolt pattern work on the 169 Engine & Truck Clutch Housing.

[lanthony2020]

Looks like it was three on the tree.

I inherited a 1950 from my dad. Still in a airport hanger in South Dakota. Was going to retrieve it last year once again, but had major medical challenges once again.

I drove and used this on the farm back in the early eighties. Had the overdrive free wheeling. Didn't remember from back then as to what it looked like as far as the tranny goes. Got the breaks working, tuneup, carb and away I went. First big downhill on a highway really let's you know what free wheeling means! I've attached more pics.

I was thinking about options with gearing in the rear end if not OD. Like to gear it to about where there OD ends up? Any options still available for doing this?

Thanks for the help.

LN

[StudeRich]

That is a very nice, rust free R Series.
If you were "Freewheeling" over 32 MPH, that just means the electrical system was not working, so it never shifted into Overdrive.

[lanthony2020]

Interesting. My dad was honored at the 150th as the youngest known or youngest living Studebaker Dealer. My grandfather was 100% disable during the invasion of the Philippines after the same in Siapan and Guam. Dad was 16. P&B Motors (Park and Bill Motors) 1946

My dad also knew of the "free wheeling" of the Studes. You could not slow it down with the gears. I can remember I had to pump the accelerator once to the floor to enter into this "Free Wheeling," that I thought was overdrive. Can't remember if there was also a pull knob on the dash or not for OD.

I can testify to the wild "Free Wheeling" with no back pressure or gearing to slow down. Just rolling faster and faster. And, much faster than 35 mph. What in the World was I experiencing then?

LN

Update: Had to research this topic. StudRich was mostly right here, according to http://www.fordification.com/tech/overdrive.htm > "When the electrical components of a B-W OD are not functioning this is all that the transmission will do - freewheel. Freewheeling at speed is dangerous and can lead to loss of control due to increased brake use. However a properly functioning B-W OD does NOT freewheel at speeds above 28 mph. In a properly functioning OD engine braking DOES happen. The thought that engine braking is not possible is a major misconception for a B-W OD transmission."

[StudeRich]

Just how OLD a Studebaker are we talking about? There were Freewheeling transmissions in the 1930's, but I thought we were talking about the '49-'53 R Series Truck.

When the O.D. Handle is "OUT" it works like any other 3 Speed with full deceleration when releasing the gas Pedal.

When the handle is "IN" it is IN O.D. so when it reaches about 30 MPH all you do is RELEASE the Pedal not floor it or pump it and it shifts into 2nd O.D. or 3 rd. O.D. depending on which gear you are in.
You can floor it above 30-35 and go back to Direct Gear which is what you would do approaching the top of a high hill and then pull the handle out to have safe deceleration going down the other side.

All you have to do to gain speed to pass is floor it.

Of course when descending a STEEP hill you would not have great deceleration in Overdrive 3rd. but it would still slow quite a bit until it gets down to 30 when it does freewheel only from 30 to a stop.

Now if your Dad had "aftermarket" installed the Overdrive Trans. but never hooked it up electrically to actually function, then YES you would have Freewheeling all the time that the O.D. lever on the Trans. was left in the rearward position with no shift cable or electrical circuit.

So this fully explains WHY, exactly what I said in Post #7 happens.

Was your Dad A.J. Antran in Arbuckle, CA? He was Studebaker's oldest Dealer but not at a certain recent time, I think it would be ALL time.

UPDATE: ok sorry, I was typing this at 4:22 when you posted your rescind update.

[lanthony2020]

Just saw this Rich. I now have changed my settings for email notifications. My identification plates had been painted over so I just got them cleaned off. Here it is!

Model: 2r-c2
Cab# 22367
Trim: T-6033

ID Plate:
2r5 - 12
R5-9071

Engine Stamped Number: 679 4 3I

Tires 16"