289 rebuild cost

[JDP]

Here we go again. The only way I could count on spending even 4K for a rebuild is if I paid someone to rebuild a totally worn out example and go way beyond the shop manual guidelines. Having said that, again that's just my experience, and others may well differ. The only things I would normally add to my rebuild example if the engine were worn badly would be valves, guides, springs, oil pump rebuild and a timing gear if it was fiber, some crank work and odds and ends. That might bring it to $2500 and with shop labor could reach your estimate. I think we've hashed out both sides of the discussion by now and most folks will form their own opinions, and may disagree with both of ours.

JDP/Maryland
64 R2 GT cost to date $55046.57
64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
63 Lark 2 door
58 Packard HT
56 Golden Hawk
52 Starliner
51 Commander
39 Coupe express
39 Coupe express (rod)

[Dick Steinkamp]

quote:Originally posted by JDP
I think we've hashed out both sides of the discussion by now

I guess I don't see "two sides". I think we are in agreement, John. Is that OK ?

I totally agree with you that the low mileage motor you just finished is a bang up job and will give many miles of great service.

It looks like you agree with me that a worn out motor "with shop labor could reach your estimate".

Do we HAVE to pick sides?

[wally]

One comment: the photo of the engine you are installing has nothing covering the intake ports during the process. It is good insurance to cover any openings with duct tape or sheetmetal plates to prevent a wayward fastener, socket or even a critter from entering, and causing "Instantaneous Traumatic Disassembly" when the engine is fired for the first time.[:0]

[JDP]

The manifold was on the engine within a few hours of that picture and I saw no critters running around. If the engine is on the stand for a day or more it gets the tape. BTW, I should fire it tomorrow.

JDP/Maryland
64 R2 GT cost to date $55046.57
64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
63 Lark 2 door
58 Packard HT
56 Golden Hawk
52 Starliner
51 Commander
39 Coupe express
39 Coupe express (rod)

[sbca96]

When I did my couple thousand dollar rebuild, back in the early 90's,
they tested the valve springs, and found them within spec. I find it
very hard to replace things that have life left in them. I guess the
Studebaker claim to fame is expensive engine rebuilds, if we can not
beat the Chevy guys at the stop light, at least we can empty out our
wallets prior to getting to that stop light loss.[xx(][B)]

Give JDP a break, your average Studebaker engine can be rebuilt in the
same way, unless you spin a bearing and drive for another few years, I
think you will find his process will refresh a Stude just fine.

Tom

'63 Avanti, zinc plated drilled & slotted 03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, soon: TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves, 'R3' 276 cam, Edelbrock AFB Carb, GM HEI distributor, 8.8mm plug wires

[PackardV8]

Hi, Tom,

The "expensive Studebaker rebuild" is a result of the no-volume cost of replacement components. Machine time and shop labor is basically the same for any V8. The difference is all about parts and parts-chasing time. This machine shop I mentioned does not charge any desk time for a SBC, because they always have a kit on the shelf and a couple more on the way. For old, off-brand stuff, it might take a couple of hours of phone and internet work, at $50 an hour, just to find and order the stock replacement parts.

When the machine shop I work with rebuilds a SBC, they only re-use the block, crank, cam, heads and rods. The rocker arms, pushrods, all valves, springs, pushrods, lifters, water pump, pistons, rings, bearings and oil pump all come in a EngineTech made-in-China-all-in-one-box-kit for less than $250. Compare this with the same Studebaker parts and you will be spending $1250 and up.

Slightly off-topic, but its about SBC volume versus Studebaker volume; at the height of production, GM was running three engine plants, and the Detroit plant alone was building 500 SBCs a day, about the same number Studebaker built in a good month. GM built millions of SBCs a year for fifty years and thousands are still built in Mexico today. Studebaker built a few thousand Studebaker V8s a year for thirteen years. This is why our rebuilds cost more and always will.

thnx, jack vines


PackardV8

[GTtim]

quote:Originally posted by JDP

Here we go again. I think we've hashed out both sides of the discussion by now and most folks will form their own opinions, and may disagree with both of ours.

JDP/Maryland
64 R2 GT cost to date $55046.57
64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
63 Lark 2 door
58 Packard HT
56 Golden Hawk
52 Starliner
51 Commander
39 Coupe express
39 Coupe express (rod)

John, you may as well change your signature to 'Lighting Rod', don't you think?

Tim K.
'64 R2 GT Hawk

[Laemmle]

Over the many years of Avanti ownership (over 40) I have been told many many times to yank the Stude any go to the bowtie.....I do not care that my R-1 is "only" about 240bhp.....I only want my Studebaker engine to run well and move the car.......I could give a sheet how fast the car goes.....back in 1968 while in college I saw the aftermath of a drag race between an R-2 Avanti and a '64 Vette....the Vette was racing his brother-in-law on Red Road down in Miami Florida........the Avanti was estimated to have hit a Southern Bell telephone pole at well over 100mph......when I saw what was left of that car and the dried blood on the seats.....I never f-ed around with the Avanti again......that dear friends was a SOBERING experience one does not forget.

quote:Originally posted by PackardV8

Greetings, Mr. Biggs,

I concur with everything you said in your last post other than I would clarify the main reason the less-than-hard-core Stude owners choose a SBC; it costs about one-third as much per horsepower.

Just yesterday, the machinist who does most of my Studebaker and Packard V8 work said the same thing. He sees not just Studebaker, but Buick, Ford and everyone else coming to him for bids on an OEM rebuild. Too many of them compare the cost and just drop in a brand-new $1250 SBC 350. For those with even lower budgets, because the SBC is so popular, EngineTech has complete cheapo complete rebuild kits for them for less than the cost of a set of pistons for anything else. To build a Studebaker with the same new parts in the SBC EngineTech kit, the parts will cost at least five times as much.

For those of us who truly love Studebakers, we don't look at the cost or the horsepower, we just want a Studebaker V8 under there.

thnx, jv.

PackardV8

[dave smith]

I'm curious about whats so unique about a stude v8 that it requires a stude expert to assemble one. I haven't been into one recently (40yrs) but I don't remember them being much different from Cad or Olds or other 50's era engines.I also think the terms overhaul,rebuild,and remanufactured are not interchangeable. each has its own meaning.

[Son O Lark]

Where's BP when you need him?

[JDP]

Those prices are way higher then I pay around here. i.e. the boil block and install cam bearings for $425. I got that done, the block bored, the valves ground and guides machined for $650. The gasket kit, rod and main bearing prices are also about double what I paid from Phil Harris. and the "supercharger,water manifold,idler bracket,belt ,pulley, water pump,fuel pump,hoses,bonnet,air filer,
vibration damper grooved and rebuilt r-2 carb 3800.00" just blows me away. Not picking on you, just different vendor choices and local prices I guess. I once priced a rebuilt R2 Nemish engine with all the blower stuff installed at $6500 that was delivered at York just to drive the tire kickers away. No wonder it didn't work.

JDP/Maryland
64 R2 GT cost to date $55046.57
64 Daytona HT/R2 clone
63 Lark 2 door
58 Packard HT
56 Golden Hawk
52 Starliner
51 Commander
39 Coupe express
39 Coupe express (rod)

[Roscomacaw]

From what I see was paid for a gasket set and for the bearings as well - it looks like the machine shop bought the stuff and then marked it up a SIGNIFICANT amount!

Miscreant adrift in
the BerStuda Triangle


1957 Transtar 1/2ton
1960 Larkvertible V8
1958 Provincial wagon
1953 Commander coupe

[StudeRich]

stugatsr2; I see you tried to Reply to a post numerous times with no Reply, after copying a prior post, you can highlight and hit delete key on all or part of the prior post, type YOUR REPLY, then hit "post new Reply" to post it, thanks for joining us!

StudeRich
Studebakers Northwest
Ferndale, WA

[bkz81]

Just got my 289 out of the shop a month ago. Total for all work and parts including balancing and assembling the motor was 2938.38.

[DEEPNHOCK]

Absolutely nothing.
Except for being able to adjust the crank end play, and tighten the wrist pin lock bolts, and cleaning the pressure relief valve...nothing.
But remember....
Technology in rebuilding has changed in the last thirty years.
Studebaker engines have not.
Labor rates have changed.
CASO skill levels haven't changed (for the most part) either.
Parts aquisition cost's have changed.
Attitude's have not.
Stude guys are a stubborn lot.
Draw your own conclusion(s).
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by dave smith

I'm curious about whats so unique about a stude v8 that it requires a stude expert to assemble one. I haven't been into one recently (40yrs) but I don't remember them being much different from Cad or Olds or other 50's era engines.I also think the terms overhaul,rebuild,and remanufactured are not interchangeable. each has its own meaning.