Brakes: Power brake booster conversion

[BrianC]

After the hydro-vac booster failed on my 63 GT Hawk and caused an accident, i am replacing it with a modern conversion from Summit racing. According to the tech there, i don't need a pedal conversion? I cant see how to this possible? Has anyone done this conversion, the brake pedal on the Hawk goes under the floor to the existing master cylinder. What exactly is required to complete the pedal hook-up.
Thanks.

[SN-60]

To: BrianC,--------That's too bad Your brake booster failed, Your definitely not the first person that's happened to though. Could You please describe what this Summit conversion entails?

[BrianC]

This is a 7" power brake booster, dual circuit master cylinder and proportioning valve. It's for front disc/rear drum. It will replace the existing Hydro-vac and master cylinder. It is essentially a modern chevy power brake system. Mounts on the firewall with the linkage to the pedal under the dash. The required linkage configuration is my question, i'm sure there are Hawks out there with this set-up.

[Dan White]

Brian:

I doubt the technician at Summit has a clue as to what a Studebaker brake system on a Hawk is like and that there are different length brake pedals and the master cylinder is under the floor Is this unit to replace an under the floor unit or convert to a firewall setup? If it is for a firewall application you will need to install swinging pedals. Does the kit also include disk brakes? We need more details to give you some pointers. Summit sells lots of brake conversion kits but I am not aware of any that will work on a Hawk without a boat load of reengineering.

How exactly did your Hydrovac fail? I have had them go bad and it results in basically manual, i.e. no power brakes but never a loss of all brakes. The only place that would be apparent are the rubber hoses going from the unit to the brake lines.

[Dan White]

Brian:

I responded while your second post was in progress. There are Hawks with firewall units but none are factory. All Hawks came with under the floor master cylinders. Someone that has rodded their Hawk would be best to answer this.

[sweetolbob]

Brian:

I responded while your second post was in progress. There are Hawks with firewall units but none are factory. All Hawks came with under the floor master cylinders. Someone that has rodded their Hawk would be best to answer this.

Brian

I put a 1989 Camaro IROC pedal setup on my 54K. Several thoughts: First, the firewall is not stiff enough IMHO to provide adequate support for the M/C so it needs to be stiffened, which I did. Secondly, I used all IROC brake components so it matched up well. But in your case, you will need to be sure that M/C you have has the same capacity as the original Stude unit in the 63.

If you don't have the pedal assembly, you could probably get that from Summit or a wrecking yard from a car that Summit recommends but, I think you are going down a difficult road that has several draw backs.

Let me suggest before you go through all of this you contact Jim Turner, Turner Brake - 52ragtop on the forum, and talk to him about what you are trying to do. He knows Studes well, knows brakes and sells stuff that works. He should make your life easier.

Summit is great at taking stuff back.

JMHO, Bob

[Dick Steinkamp]

Brian,
I'd get back on the phone with Summit. Tell them what you were sold, and ask them how it should be installed.

[Captain Billy]

Brian....you could try this set up http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Under-...bly,46286.html

would require mounting mods but is doable

[Dan White]

Depending on your engineering talent and wallet you may want to rethink your approach. As Bob noted above I would suggest you contact Jim Turner and discuss converting to modern front disk brakes, and you can also go with a dual master cylinder under the floor. Also going back to my previous post, are you sure your original master cylinder is not at fault for the accident? If the bore is shot/corroded or the piston rubber is bad you can have total brake failure, which has nothing to do with the hydrovac.

[BrianC]

I was getting brake fluid backing up in the intake manifold, smoking quite badly. No pedal, the Hydro-vac would squeal when the brake was applied. All hoses and lines are good. After many suggestions from Stude forums, rebuilding it is not cost effective.
This unit is to mount on the fire-wall. Summit assured me that they are familiar with the Hawk, but now that the unit has arrived, i'm not so sure???? i only recently learned of Jim Turner, but have no contact info. If i have to return this to Summit and go to Jim Turner, then so be it. I 'm frustrated enough, finding body parts, dealing with body shop and no Hawk for the summer!

[BrianC]

Theres no way that the unit suggested by Captian Billy will give me enough ground clearance.

[BobPalma]

Brian: Does your Hawk have drum or disc brakes in front?

If they are drum, Studebaker International now sells an all-new (NOT rebuilt) Hydrovac units for that application, for only $360.

That is an option for consideration that wasn't available even a couple years ago. BP

[jd-stude]

A new or rebuilt hydrovac is in the $400 price range last time I looked and about 1 hour of simple wrench word to install. Modified stystems might have half the dollar cost but the installation/engineering to get it to work has a price too. I'd bite the bullet and spend the money and be driving the car at the end of the week and know it will work. The hydrovac may seem to be a troublesome unit but they are 40 plus years old in many cases and are due for replacement or service. My project Hawk needs one but I bypassed it until it is road ready and it will get a new one when the time comes.

Ken

[studebaker-R2-4-me]

Brian:

How exactly did your Hydrovac fail? I have had them go bad and it results in basically manual, i.e. no power brakes but never a loss of all brakes. The only place that would be apparent are the rubber hoses going from the unit to the brake lines.

I lost all brake's on my 64 Hawk right in the parking lot during last years spring swap meet in South Bend. The brake pedal went right to the floor. Had brakes one minute and absolutely no pedal the next. What happens is the diaphragm fails and brake fluid is sucked up into the vacuum hose and then into the engine leaving NO brake fluid. Number one reason NOT to use silicon fluid in a hydrovac car!

I replaced my disc brake hydrovac in the 4H fairgrounds with a new production hydrovac from SI. Easy fix and is working well.

I would suggest that Brian rethink his conversion and install the brand new Hydrovac from SI and be done with it.

Allen

[BrianC]

Thanks for the input, very leery about a new hydro-vac, but it does seem to be the simplest solution. Hawk has front disc. I've heard from a couple of Stud owners that the that that they have had not such good luck with new Hydro-vacs, only lasting a couple of years???? So you see my reasoning for a modern unit? How are Summit with refunds???