Transmission / Overdrive: oneoarsman

[oneoarsman]

1952 2R512 - Three speed on column with overdrive - Complete frame off restoration - all new wiring- new relay - new solenoid - rebuilt transmission, engine and rear end. Relay clicks when ignition turned on - vehicle free wheels when overdrive manually engaged. NOT SHIFTING INTO OVERDRIVE WHEN DRIVING OVER 30 MPH AND LETTING FOOT OFF OF ACCELERATOR - not cutting out when accelerator pressed to floor. What am I missing?

[52DW2R5]

Do you have the B-W overdrive manual (free PDF download), or for purchase at sellers like the Fifth Avenue Internet Garage? The kickdown switch wiring is pretty critical as is the set up. But if you bought a new relay from the FAIG, I could never get it to work in my Willys Jeepster. Caused such a backfire from the ignition that I blew out my exhaust.

Make sure the solenoid is wired correctly, too -exchange the terminals as a test.

[52DW2R5]

...forgot to add the most important part: the governor. That is the speed-driven permissive switch that allows the solenoid to pull the dog and engage the sun gear. Very easy bench test with a power drill and a test meter... once it gets to a prescribed RPM the contacts close so therefore zero ohms.

make sure to replace the O-ring and gasket when putting it back in, too. If you have the reverse rail lockout switch, those were later deleted because they were found to be unnecessary - this won't be your problem.

[StudeRich]

The Solenoid may not be properly engaged into the pawl link, it can be inserted 90 degree off.

[r1lark]

As 52DW2R5 mentioned, the B-W Overdrive manual (or the similar section in the Studebaker shop manual) is your friend. It has a very complete step-by-step troubleshooting guide. Most of the time the OD problems are electrical. But since yours was rebuilt, it could be a mechanical/assembly issue as StudeRich mentions. Who did the transmission rebuild?

[Ross]

First up is that the relay should not click the instant the ignition is turned on. Further, when the relay does click on, you should hear a deep click coming from the solenoid on the side of the trans as that relay exists only to turn the solenoid on and off.

All that is to say that your wiring is not connected properly and you will need to trace it all methodically per the shop manual. Quite likely there is nothing mechanically wrong.

[52DW2R5]

The gospel according to B-W....here's the pdf for download.

https://www.oldwillysforum.com/forum/TechData/BWOverdriveManual.pdf

[oneoarsman]

Thank you for sending info..... Have been consumed with other priorities, but will post outcomes.

[52DW2R5]

Thank you for sending info..... Have been consumed with other priorities, but will post outcomes.

Our car should never be our priorities. They function as relief valves for life and stress!

[Warren Webb]

Just a reminder. Check the gear oil in the overdrive unit too. It is separate from the main transmission case. The oil specified is different that what can be used in the differential. I cannot remember the exact term other than the transmission oil ends in 1 while the differential oil ends in 5.

I remember reading Andy Granatelli's book "They Call Me Mr. 500" where he talked about Studebaker's Bonneville speed trials. There was an incidence where one transmission was popping out of gear. Adding some STP took care of the problem!

[jackb]

Funny mentioning STP in transmissions. I once had a T-10 in a GT Hawk that shifted poorly. Pumped in some (?) STP and things increased nicely. I think the same thing is true for the old tranny lubes that I have had. Thickness can be a key. I cannot find 80-140 gear oil easily for my R/A. Currently, my T86/OD shifts better when cold (thick GL-1) then after warming.

[StudeRich]

To add to Warren's Post # 10:

API Rating GL-1 and GL-4 are Non-Hypoid Gear Oil for Transmissions. 85/90 or 90 are the proper weights, NOT 140 Wt.
For our Borg Warner Manual Overdrives, GL-1 Mineral Oil is preferred.

GL-5 is for Differentials WITH Hypoid Gears it has EP (extreme Pressure) Additives and would be Bad for a Transmission.
For transmissions, I always avoid ANY Gear Oil rated GL-5 and other # 's in combination.

[52DW2R5]

To add to Warren's Post # 10:

API Rating GL-1 and GL-4 are Non-Hypoid Gear Oil for Transmissions. 85/90 or 90 are the proper weights, NOT 140 Wt.
For our Borg Warner Manual Overdrives, GL-1 Mineral Oil is preferred.

GL-5 is for Differentials WITH Hypoid Gears it has EP (extreme Pressure) Additives and would be Bad for a Transmission.
For transmissions, I always avoid ANY Gear Oil rated GL-5 and other # 's in combination.

100% correct - we need friction for the OD dogs and sungear rollers to take up correctly! GL-1 is thankfully additive-free.

[oneoarsman]

Thanks to all for your responses. Replaced relay as per testing using BW Tracing and Correction of Electrical Control Troubles. New relay does not click when ignition turned on. Overdrive still not engaging. Worked my way to test section #18 e which says "Ground governor terminal. If no click results, it indicates defective wire or terminal connections between governor and lockout switch. If relay clicks, replace governor UNLESS GOVERNOR DRIVE PINION IS FOUND TO BE MISSING OR GOVERNOR DRIVE GEAR IS SLIPPING. My relay clicks when governor terminal is grounded. I removed the new governor which passes visual inspection. The transmission was rebuilt by Pete"s gears in Hayward, California. Pete has recently retired and sold his business. I expect my next adventure is testing governor......... ANY ADDITIONAL THOUGHTS?
Best Regards, Oneoarsman

[StudeRich]

When the Borg Warner Manual recommends checking terminal connections, one other thing should be done... Clean the Terminals of Oil, Dirt and Corrosion, ALL of them: Kickdown Switch, Relay, Governor and Solenoid.