Transmission / Overdrive: 1950 Transmissions T96 and T86

[Tom Mountain]

What are the differences and are the they interchangable; i have a T96 in my Champion and i bought a T86 from a SDC member believing i could swap them
Thank You

[r1lark]

The T96 is much smaller and lighter duty. There were short tailshaft versions and long tailshaft versions in both the T96 and T86. Pretty much none of the internal transmission parts interchange between the T96 and T86. (Many of the overdrive parts do interchange, however.)

There is a variant of the T86 called the T90. Pretty much the same transmission but the first gear is different (straight cut, usually lower ratio). In fact, the T90s used the T86 case, so it will have "T86" cast into it. You have to pull the top cover to determine if you are looking at a T86 or T90. Studebaker used T90s in Taxi Cabs and trucks.

A quick way to tell a T86/T90 from a T96: the T86/T90 will have six bolts holding the top access cover on, while the T96 will have only four bolts holding the top access cover on.

There are also various transmission case-to-bellhousing bolt patterns that have been used over the years. I'm not positive, but I don't think the T86 & T96 ever used the same trans-to-bellhousing bolt patterns.

In cars, the T86 will have a 1-1/8" diameter input shaft, and the T96 will have a 1" diameter input shaft. The truck/taxi T90 also has a a1-1/8" input shaft.

In postwar cars. the T86 transmissions were used behind Commander 6 cylinder engines and V8 engines, and had the larger input shafts. (There were also T86 transmissions used behind 6 cylinders in Taxi's and other 'heavy duty' cars, but I believe these also used the larger input shafts.)

Trucks used the T90 (see info on T90s above) behind 6 cylinder Champion engines, but without checking the parts manuals I'm not sure if they used the smaller or larger input shafts. The T90 was also used behind some Commander 6 engines in trucks, and behind the 224 V8s in '55 and '56 1/2 ton pickups; these used the larger diameter input shaft. All T90 truck transmissions will be the short tailshaft versions. In addition, the truck T90 transmissions had straight cut first gears and a lower ratio first gear.

As far as interchangeability, they are not easily interchanged. It could possibly be done by redrilling the bellhousing-to-trans case bolt pattern (if there is enough room and thickness in the casting), machining the input shaft, and using a different clutch disk. You would most likely would have to use the T86 shift rods, as well as shortening the driveshaft.

Another way would be to find the engine rear plate for a 6 cylinder taxi or 8E truck 6 cylinder that allows you to bolt a V8 bell housing behind the smaller Champion style 6 cylinder engine. Then you could bolt the V8 T86 behind the 6 cylinder engine. Not sure about the pilot bushing and flywheel, you would have to research that. Also a V8 clutch disc and maybe also a V8 pressure plate would probably be required. The driveshaft would have to be shortened also.

A whole lot of work for little gain unless your Champion engine has been modified to provide a lot more horsepower.

Maybe a better swap to spend your time on would be some type of 5 speed trans swap.

***Corrections to what I have posted are welcome!***

[gordr]

Not in any way interchangeable. Bolt pattern is different, case size very different, input shaft length, diameter, and spline count different. T96 is the Champion transmission, from 1941 on, for sure. T86 is the Commander transmission used behind either the Commander six, or the V8's that succeeded it. About the only part, aside from trivial small parts, that might be common is the drive shaft yoke.

[StudeRich]

Paul, that was a very good explanation of all of the "options" and Trans. Types.

Just one "Correction", the stronger units used on Taxi's and 6 Cyl. Trucks were not actually T-86's, they had a T-86 marked case and most parts, but the Lower Ratio 1st. and 2nd. speed Internal gears caused them to be called T-90, exactly as the T-85/T89.

Of course it is all trivial since it is unlikely the OP will find and use a '63/'64 Truck setup in his Champion, just FYI and a few others.

[jackb]

next question: who on this forum has a spare T96 in the shed/barn....?

[r1lark]

Paul, that was a very good explanation of all of the "options" and Trans. Types.

Just one "Correction", the stronger units used on Taxi's and 6 Cyl. Trucks were not actually T-86's, they had a T-86 marked case and most parts, but the Lower Ratio 1st. and 2nd. speed Internal gears caused them to be called T-90, exactly as the T-85/T89.

Of course it is all trivial since it is unlikely the OP will find and use a '63/'64 Truck setup in his Champion, just FYI and a few others.

Yep, you are exactly right Rich, I knew that but had a brain fart . I'll edit my post. Thank you very much!

[gordr]

next question: who on this forum has a spare T96 in the shed/barn....?

How many do you want? I could probably scare up at least half a dozen, both standard and overdrive. Only have one of the long-tail jobs, though.

[DieselJim]

I did a T86 long tail shaft for a for a M with champ 6.. The owner had a machine shop. He turned the V8 input shaft to match the 6 shaft. drilled and taped the bell housing and installed it. It also had a top loader. Gave him a drive shaft from a 59 Wagon and it fit.

[enjenjo]

AMC used the T96 transmission into the 1960s. The Rambler until 1964 at least. I used to buy Studebaker T96 transmissions to repair my Rambler because they were cheaper than AMC T96s. The tailshaft and extension housing are different but all the other internal parts interchange. At 17 I blew a lot of transmissions. The Ford Falcon also used the T96 with the 144 ci six until 63. International used them in the four cylinder Scouts and Jeep used them in the F head CJs.

There are still parts available for most versions

[PackardV8]

International used them in the four cylinder Scouts and Jeep used them in the F head CJs.

IIRC, back when, we'd use the Jeep top shifter on the Stude T96s.

jack vines

[Johnny Wilcox]

I'm guess I'm looking (from what I read above) for a T-86 for my 1952 2r11 with the Commander six engine so I can do some highway driving without getting run over. Am I on the right path StudeRich or PackardV8? You two have helped me out immensly in the past. Thanks, Johnny

[Skip Lackie]

next question: who on this forum has a spare T96 in the shed/barn....?

I have one. Gears in the trans look good. Condition of the OD unit is unknown.

[Skip Lackie]

I'm guess I'm looking (from what I read above) for a T-86 for my 1952 2r11 with the Commander six engine so I can do some highway driving without getting run over. Am I on the right path StudeRich or PackardV8? You two have helped me out immensly in the past. Thanks, Johnny

I am neither Rich nor Jack, but you are correct -- a 2R11 needs a T-86 with OD. I have one in my 3R6 (Commander engine) and it at least HELPS to keep up with traffic. That said, Commander 6s don't like to rev very high.