Intake manifold, mopar to stude

[imported_n/a]

Somewhere I saw (maybe in an old TURNING WHEELS) where someone has made an adapter to install a modified Mopar intake to a stude v-8,
As I recall it had to be an aluminum intake, and be modified, and off a 318-340-360. I guess another solution would be if I could find a good Aluminum manifold designed for the stude. The 1 I saw on e-bay went for about $400 adn was designed for the old Carter used in 55. Thanks for any help. David

David and Shane Baird
Judith Gap Montana
Just getting started

[Dick Steinkamp]

An aluminum manifold for a late model single four barrel or an aluminum tri power for a Stude might be a little hard to find, but they are out there.

Aluminum dual quad manifolds for Studes using late carbs are repoped as are aluminum 2 x 2 Stude intakes. (I have one on eBay right now)...

http://tinyurl.com/3uugv3

Cast iron Stude manifolds for late single four barrels can be made by several vendors from a late Stude 2 barrel manifold. Also, 63-64 Stude 4 barrel manifolds take an AFB.

What specifically are you looking for? I'll bet the members here can help you.



Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

[Mike Van Veghten]

There has been a coupla different people over the last few years make up adapters...none on a regular basis...none what one might call cheap!

A question if I might..?
Why do you want to do this?

Unless you have a fair amount of cylinder head modifications, lots of compression, the R2+ cam (or more), and running more gear in the rear than most Stude people seem to be willing to run, the standard Stude iron manifold...though heavy and not pretty...works very well. This is one place that the Stude engineers got together and mated the intake maifold to the heads fairly well.
Add an Edelbrock 500cfm carburetor...and your on the way.

If you go to the Stude Racing site, use the "search" function...you'll find hours of reading on manifolds and heads.

If you are looking for an aluminum manifold, look in the Stude venders portion of this site (I think it's here!). Lional Stone has single four barrel, dual four barrel and twin two barrel manifolds.
Dave Theibolt (spelling?) has a few others to choose from.
The Offy intake can accasionally be found (e-bay). But it was really designed for the smaller 224/232 engine. So the ports have too small a cross section for a 259 or 289. While they do run, and run fine...they cannot be concidered a "high performance" intake manifold.

IF...you have the engine modifications, the Chrysler manifold "might" work for you. In that case...as of right now, you may be on your own.

OR...do as a coupla others have done and I will be doing, get a pile of aluminum...cut and weld up your own!
One guy I know and helped a bit...built a twin, side draft Webber manifold for his Stude engine, so it can be done.

Mike

[PackardV8]

As usual, MVV gives sound advice. Until the first $2,000 has been spent on intake porting, larger intake valves, R2+ cam and so on, the OEM iron 4-bbl intake is not the problem. Your car, your money, your decision.

thnx, jack vines

PackardV8

[Warren Webb]

I believe one of our regulars in the forum here is DEEPINHOCK that has a photobucket site showing all he has done to convert a couple different manifolds to a Stude. Its ALOT of work & if you dont have access to a machine shop for cheap or free, it will run a bundle I'm sure. Perhaps someone can post a link to one or both of them. His work looks really great but its alot of work, like Jack says, "your car, your money, your decision."

60 Lark convertible
61 Champ
62 Daytona convertible
63 G.T. R-2,4 speed
63 Avanti (2)
66 Daytona Sport Sedan

[Dan White]

Anyone heard from Ted how the "New" manifold is going. I know he was having a dickens of a time getting the guy to cooperate after he got paid!

Dan White
64 R1 GT
64 R2 GT

[DEEPNHOCK]

Have done a few Mopar style intakes..
Torker, Dual plane, air gap, dual quad, tunnel ram....
With adapters (and without).
Lot's of work.

The adapter plates are just the start.
You will have to do some serious modifications to the intake manifold, too.
It will work, but it is not the ideal setup.
It will also raise the carb up a lot.

Flow bench tested them all...
Including a stock Stude WCFB 4bbl, a stock Stude AFB 4 bbl, Lionel Stone 4bbl, Offenhauser 4bbl, dual deuce, DD tunnel ram, Mopar stuff..
Bottom line...
For the street, stay with the dual plane intake.

For the money, it's hard to beat an aluminum Lionel Stone intake.
(cleaned up and prepped , that is)
Just don't expect to drop it on like a new Edelbrock.
It will need finishing..
Hope the info helps.
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by david and shane

Somewhere I saw (maybe in an old TURNING WHEELS) where someone has made an adapter to install a modified Mopar intake to a stude v-8,
As I recall it had to be an aluminum intake, and be modified, and off a 318-340-360. I guess another solution would be if I could find a good Aluminum manifold designed for the stude. The 1 I saw on e-bay went for about $400 adn was designed for the old Carter used in 55. Thanks for any help. David

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

[imported_n/a]

quote:Originally posted by DEEPNHOCK

Have done a few Mopar style intakes..
Torker, Dual plane, air gap, dual quad, tunnel ram....
With adapters (and without).
Lot's of work.

The adapter plates are just the start.
You will have to do some serious modifications to the intake manifold, too.
It will work, but it is not the ideal setup.
It will also raise the carb up a lot.

Flow bench tested them all...
Including a stock Stude WCFB 4bbl, a stock Stude AFB 4 bbl, Lionel Stone 4bbl, Offenhauser 4bbl, dual deuce, DD tunnel ram, Mopar stuff..
Bottom line...
For the street, stay with the dual plane intake.

For the money, it's hard to beat an aluminum Lionel Stone intake.
(cleaned up and prepped , that is)
Just don't expect to drop it on like a new Edelbrock.
It will need finishing..
Hope the info helps.
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by david and shane

Somewhere I saw (maybe in an old TURNING WHEELS) where someone has made an adapter to install a modified Mopar intake to a stude v-8,
As I recall it had to be an aluminum intake, and be modified, and off a 318-340-360. I guess another solution would be if I could find a good Aluminum manifold designed for the stude. The 1 I saw on e-bay went for about $400 adn was designed for the old Carter used in 55. Thanks for any help. David

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

David and Shane Baird
Judith Gap Montana
Just getting started

[imported_n/a]

Thanks Jeff and Mike.
What I am trying to do is this: Maybe increace performance a little, but help on MILEAGE. Right now I have a 63 Hawk GT, just plain, 2 barrel automatic, and don't think I have exceeded 15 mpg. (This is driving easy and under 65-pretty much like an old lady) I understand that the 2V is not th worlds best, and I do understand AFBs and have played with their jetting -on fords, not Studes. Right now the performance seems to me about the same as a 67 289 Ranchero I once had.
I understand you can have a 2V manifold machined to accept the AFB but somewhere I read that one side of the runners were cast smaller than the other, which I think would make one bank of pistons happier than the other. Thus I was trying to figure out a way to get
a more modern intake, and aluminum would weigh less for both handling and economy. I don't desire multiple carbs, especially 2 of the standard 2v.
I don't desire to rev the engine 6000, but I think it should rev over 4000 for passing, which it won't hardly do now. For crusing I think it would be nice to run about 2000 (at 70) but if I remenber right its about 2900. If I were to put taller gears in,would the engine be able pull them?
When I put a 4v on my old Ranchero (all stock ford parts) I was able to get 20-22 MPG if I drove careful.
I will contact Lionel Stone.
Thanks again Jeff and Mike

David and Shane Baird
Judith Gap Montana
Just getting started

[PackardV8]

Hi, David,

As we've said before, your car, your money, your decision. Most of what we do on Studes are not rational decisions anyway. However, do the math. To put a LS aluminum intake and an AFB on your car will run $400-600. It's doubtful an AFB would be more efficient, but say your fuel mileage improved two miles per gallon, to 17 MPG, we don't know how many miles you drive a year, but how many years would it take to pay for it with the improved economy?

Secondly, if your GT won't rev above 4,000 RPM, it is not the fault of the 2-bbl. A good 4-bbl will get to the same RPM 7% quicker and make 15 more horsepower doing it (210 vs 225 hp) Sounds like some work needs to be done on the fuel pump, ignition and/or valve springs before the aluminum intake and 4-bbl would start earning money.

The Stude 289" 2-bbl will easily pull taller gears, but with a tradeoff in slower acceleration. This is why the overdrive transmission was very popular in Studebakers, as you got to keep the low gears for acceleration and the overdrive for cruising. Now, I know Montana a bit, and since Judith Gap is just up the road from Two Dot, you might want to consider going to 3.31 rear gears for the open roads up there. It will mean starting in low and manually shifting to second for more acceleration from a stop, but the tradeoff is probably worth it, again only if you can do the gear swap yourself or get a brother-in-law deal.

I, too, had a '66 Ford Falcon 289" with a 3-speed manual transmission which would get 20-22 MPG, but it had 2.88 rear gears and 9.5 compression.The single most cost-effective thing you can do to improve your fuel mileage is install a Pertronix ignition system, new distributor cap, rotor, points, condensor, and plug wires. Secondly, if you can do the work yourself, have a pro valve job done along with milling the Studebaker cylinder heads about .040" to raise the compression (this assumes your cranking compression is to spec).

Let us know what you decide.

thnx, jack vines
spokane, wa

PackardV8

[DEEPNHOCK]

Couple of pointers...
The runners are the same size...
The smaller AFB is a great choice.
(You will end up driving it 75% of the time using only the secondaries anyways).
AFB's are on a whole lot of cars...not just Ford's, so don't think you are stuck with your adjustment choices.
Send me an e-mail and I will send you a whole lot of fact based, verifiable, and proven information about this swap.
It's been done hundreds of times before, with excellent results.
Hang in there! You'll get what you are looking for...
Jeff[8D]

quote:Originally posted by david and shane

Thanks Jeff and Mike.
What I am trying to do is this: Maybe increace performance a little, but help on MILEAGE. Right now I have a 63 Hawk GT, just plain, 2 barrel automatic, and don't think I have exceeded 15 mpg. (This is driving easy and under 65-pretty much like an old lady) I understand that the 2V is not th worlds best, and I do understand AFBs and have played with their jetting -on fords, not Studes. Right now the performance seems to me about the same as a 67 289 Ranchero I once had.
I understand you can have a 2V manifold machined to accept the AFB but somewhere I read that one side of the runners were cast smaller than the other, which I think would make one bank of pistons happier than the other. Thus I was trying to figure out a way to get
a more modern intake, and aluminum would weigh less for both handling and economy. I don't desire multiple carbs, especially 2 of the standard 2v.
I don't desire to rev the engine 6000, but I think it should rev over 4000 for passing, which it won't hardly do now. For crusing I think it would be nice to run about 2000 (at 70) but if I remenber right its about 2900. If I were to put taller gears in,would the engine be able pull them?
When I put a 4v on my old Ranchero (all stock ford parts) I was able to get 20-22 MPG if I drove careful.
I will contact Lionel Stone.
Thanks again Jeff and Mike

David and Shane Baird
Judith Gap Montana
Just getting started

http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

[gordr]

My GT Hawk has a late-style manifold that was milled and fitted with an adaptor plate by Studebaker John Lasseter, who is in Vancouver, WA, if I remember right. I mounted a 500 CFM electric-choke Edelbrock carb, and it works great right out of the box.

John was selling these manifolds for about $100.00 if I remember right. I think he runs an ad in Turning Wheels.

Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

[buddymander]

You need overdrive. Either go with a 700R4 or a 2004R. My 62 GT had a nice 289 for a motor, but the gearing was all wrong. Second gear start made it a dog off the line, and the 3:54 rear made it a gas hog. With a mid 3's gear, the GM overdrive trans will give you a killer takeoff and a great cruising rpm. There are plenty of threads on here that discuss the installation and a good source for the adapter.

[imported_n/a]

Thanks for all the Information.
Packard v-8 is right--a lot of what we do for Studes is'nt rational. Of course a 40K diesel pickup to save on fuel is'nt too bright either. So I guess the money spent on studes can be justified, because our initial investment was (hopefully) low enough to allow for some play room.
I installed a Petronix ignition a year or so ago. It seemed to help right off idle, and all the way up. Supposedly the motor was overhauled not too long before I got it. Compression isn't great, but it was even, I think about 110-120, but it was quite a while ago I did it. Can't tell if it burns oil, but does leak some. I have never thought that it ran as smoothly as I thought it should. Sounds like it is about half missing on a cylinder, but have never been able to find evidence by a discolored plug. It is possible to have a plugged muffler, but it really should't hurt much, as there are plenty of places for the gas to escape. It is in the shop to get the new one as soon as I get the time. Hav't checked cam timing or if there any partially flat lobes, although they all looked ok when checking tappet clearance.
An overdrive auto isn't out of the question, as neither is a 5 speed. I hav't even checked what the ratio is, but it could be changed. As you all know the easier stuff needs to be done first.
I have probably worn out this discussion, But thanks Every one for the input. We have a few more Questions that we will put up as soon as we get them together.. Thanks again David and Shane.

David and Shane Baird
Judith Gap Montana
Just getting started

[64Avanti]

All of the above is good advice. If you want good mileage get an overdrive manual or automatic.

You should be able to rev to at least 5K without a problem. If not something is wrong.

I had a 60 Hawk with T85 overdrive, AFB, R1/R2 cam and about 10:1 compression and mild porting. This would get about 23 MPG at 70+ mph and would do about 14.3 in quarter mile.

But as others mentioned don't spend a lot of money to get 6 or so better miles per gallon and then drive 3K miles per year. It is more important to decide what you want the car to do and modify it for that use.

David L