Rear Axle: Rear axel seals

[Bill A]

There are times I think I'm in over my head, this is one of them. We have a 57 Transtar 1/2 ton that has a Dana 44 rear end. I am trying to install new rear axel outer seals to retain the bearing grease. The axel uses a 6 bolt outer seal plate/ cup whichever it is that also retains the bearing position. In the cup there is what seems a felt/ cork seal that has worn out and the leak caused ruined the shoes. I have found two seals available at SI and I bought the first one and it turned out to be a 4 bolt set up for smaller rear ends so I got the second that is a felt seal by itself. I started removing the original seal by digging it out of the rear cup assay. and it is much thinner causing doubt that I might be going at it wrong. Closer inspection shows me the felt seal is maybe held in kind of like a normal seal that would be knocked/ hammered in. Am i supposed to attempt knocking what looks like a manufactured deal out and use a portion of it to reinstall the new one??????? Need some help or direction on this one as destroying a part here could result in a 9 inch Ford rear end in the thing as I have looked behind every door I can think of. Thanks for any help on this one.
Bill

[Bill A]

As an attempt to clarify here is a picture of my dilemma.

[Skip Lackie]

Those used to be replaced as a complete assembly, and they still turn up on ebay pretty regularly. I believe the original sealing material was cork, while the replacements being sold are felt (actually Champion front crankshaft seals, I think). Anyway, unless I am misunderstanding what you are saying, I think you are expected to dig the old cork seal out of there and somehow insert the felt. Not easy without damaging the felt. If the answer above is wrong, someone please correct me.

[Bill A]

thanks for the response. The supplied seal is a felt seal. The original looks like it was cork and the entire seal assembly is .250 thick and the felt might be nearly twice that I measured the hub which I believe is supposed to be the contact member with the seal ant it is 1.980 at the sealing surface and the internal cup dimension is 2.85. I found a normal seal at Granger that is listed at 2.00 by 2 7/8 in. I am considering that as an attempted option, any thoughts about a lip seal to a felt seal?? The seal is at Granger and is # 35 UD 90. I thought finding a workable solution might be worth some snooping.

[r1lark]

I have always figured that the next time my truck needed the rear outer seals, I'd try drilling out the spotwelds that hold those assemblies together, put the new felt in and compress the assembly in the press, and then weld it back together.

Note that I said try.

[Studebakercenteroforegon]

The rear outer axle seal is more of a dust seal than a lubricant seal. Regarding installing a felt seal in an existing seal assembly - soak the seal in oil and compress in in a vise to reduce its thickness. This and the ability to manipulate the felt after oil soaking will allow you to install it in to your present seal housing.

[Skip Lackie]

Yeah, the nominal seal ID is 2". You might be able to squash the felt seal down a bit by soaking it in water and putting a car battery on top of it. But if you can find a suitable alternative, you might have discovered a viable part-time business. I think that same seal is used on many 1940s cars, not just Studebakers. In case you want to try to find a complete unit, I think I have an aftermarket part number around here for the complete seal, but won't be able to look till tomorrow.

[StudeRich]

Axle seals

It is a little bit difficult not having one in hand at the moment to understand but I think I remember that the seal Case has two parts spot welded together which MAY be what you are describing.

I am sure Studebaker Engineers did not expect you to disassemble and destroy that Cage to replace the Cork.
On the Car Type, I have been able to scrunch the Felt into the center and expand it outward to replace it, but not on a Truck.

Usually the Outer Seal is just a Metal Cone with a Seal to keep the Dust out, it is the INNER Seal that actually does the Work of keeping the Oil out of the Brakes. So if you clean, lightly grease or graphite, and reinstall the old Outer cork seals, it will be good enough, AFTER you replace the Oil leaking INNER SEALS!

The Studebaker 3E Truck Parts Catalog shows BOTH Outer Seals required:

Outer Seals, Picture Number 1002-24 Part Number 193049 "Washer and retainer, R/A Shaft outer, Oil" (2 per Truck).

1002-29 P/N 191023 "Washer, R/A axle shaft outer Oil -Cork" (2 per Truck).

The one you actually NEED to stop the Oil, is Picture Number 1002-41 P/N 1685410 "Oil Seal, R/A shaft inner" (2 per Truck).

Which did you purchase?

I have to wonder if they meant to have a note saying that the -29 Cork Washer is a replacement for the Cork in the -41 !! But they show a Qty. 2 of EACH!

If that were the case, it should have had a Quantity of (*) with a Note that says that, plus "use as required."

[az64stude]

Are they part number 193049 DANA 44 axle? Mine are NOS w/ cork seals

[StudeRich]

The 193049's are in VERY LIMITED supply, it requires a call to S.I. for price $$$$ and availability.

[Bill A]

Great information, I worked with Mercedes Benz for an entire career and they used an inner seal that kept the diff oil out of the wheel bearing cavity and that area was hand packed with grease but it also had an outer lip seal to keep the grease put when the vehicle was running down the toad and the grease was real hot and thin. The pictures shared by az64stude are the ones I need for sure. Who has these in their catalogue for sale? The old cork seals that were in the thing didn't even touch touch the hub anymore but what the heck they are only 60 years old now.... I was just looking for an alternative with something I was familiar with hence lip seals but I would be happy as heck to use a cork seal again, it will outlast me for sure. The truck will travel around our mountain community and drag the fishing boat to the lake and back, 5 miles.

[Bill A]

I bought a pair of the 4 bolt ones that turned out to be for cars, then I bought the felt's and there are issues with them as in they are nearly three times to thick so serious compression would be needed. I cut one into two slices and got one in but it just spins on the shaft as they are tight and have no compression given by the inner assembly piece so it's still a work in progress.

[DieselJim]

I use a felt crank seal. Slide it over a socket and use a razor blade and cut it in half.

[Bill A]

Thats pretty much what I did but the outcome wasn't what I was hoping for. I may be wrong but I think the inner metal cup was pressed in pinching the cork in place. I got the felt in feeling good about it until I slid it onto the hub and the seal material rotated in the assembly instead of the hub turning in the seal. Its still a work in progress I guess. Thanks for the idea.

[jackb]

re-read #8.... and don't be tempted to grease the rear bearings with the zerks on the outer axle tubes...... there is a finite amount of grease to be "hand packed" into the bearings. Once you've pumped to that volume, and filled the cavity, you now push through the seal (whatever material) and force the outer seal to become a something it wasn't intended to be = a dust seal. Today's axle grease is good way beyond the life of the rear brakes and R/A use for 99% of us daily drivers (!). Don't worry about it after repacking...