Looking for seat belts

[Maynard]

I just saw a factory picture of a 1957 Transtar cab with seat belts. I know they were also available at least as early as 1956. I'm told they look like the same ones used in Hawks. They were manufactured by Karbelt.

I'm looking for a set to install in my 1957 Transtar. I'll replace the old webbing before placing them. All I really want is the hardware, but I'd like to see the design and stitching pattern of the old webbing. If you have a set to sell, send me a PM, and we'll talk.

I don't want a modern 3-point system, so save your fingertips unless you just have to see your name on the screen.

[StudeRich]

The later style two point lap belts that come close to duplicating the chrome buckles with the Gold Crest on them as used on '62 to '66 Studebaker models are readily available in many colors to make your truck safer and ATTEMPT to look original.

That said, what you are asking for is the Aircraft style large Aluminum lift lever type that had a round red ball S P over V emblem decal and not so pretty. They are VERY hard to find even with rotted webbing as you say you want.

I guess you are looking for over the top ORIGINAL for this Truck, at International Meet Judging, no one in our club goes quite THAT far, but you are welcome to try.

[barnlark]

Here are some original ones in their Karbelt box that Bondobilly previously posted for reference.



Below are mine for the front seat. I replaced the webbing and duplicated the original stitching. It had an X pattern between two horizontal stitch lines just below the latch on the ones I found. Bill's have a vertical pattern. I guess I went that far! I have a matching set for the rear seat, too.
I do have one set of those early S~P latches; they are aluminum with the quarter size indentation. The latch's housing is steel. I had those rechromed, but they were not in great shape and had some rust pitting before the chroming job. They couldn't polish them to show quality where the belt grips, however that area is normally not seen. The outside chrome is very nice. If you are seeking NOS, or better, they probably won't meet your needs, but at least you have some pictures for your search. They do pop up occasionally, but lately more like a needle in a stack of needles... Sorry.

[Maynard]

Barnlark, thanks for those pictures. They're great. I've been looking for an excuse to go the local yards, and looking for belts is as good an excuse as any. I'm not building a show piece, so I could live with the condition you mentioned. Think of me if you get the mood to sell them. I think I realize it's just the latches, and not the attachment hardware.

StudeRich, I'm just learning the scope of the hobby. I see there's a judging class for original examples. Would it be objectionable to add an accessory that was offered by the factory or dealership?

[N8N]

at one point in time I remember someone posting a scan of the original Karbelt install instructions. They used a plastic coated steel cable through the floor. I think if I were doing this, I would use the hardware from a set of the later style repro belts that bolts through a reinforcement plate in the floor, especially if I were going to have the belts rewebbed anyway. Probably wouldn't use the door mounts for the strap either. Unfortunately, it appears that I neglected to save the Karbelt instructions, they're not on my hard drive.

nate

[StudeRich]

StudeRich, I'm just learning the scope of the hobby. I see there's a judging class for original examples. Would it be objectionable to add an accessory that was offered by the factory or dealership?

No Maynard, it would not be a problem at all if it is a period correct Studebaker (AC) Accessory, no one will question if it came from the Factory or Dealer that way or in MOST cases, even if you added it later. What you WILL need documentation for, is any very unusual factory orders and uncommon/questionable Accessories, Parts or Colors for the given year of the Truck.

Anyway, being that Trucks were just about hand built to order, they have a lot more wiggle room than something like a '55 Speedster or Golden Hawk.

Also we do this for fun, not profit, (well at least MOST of us!). So we are not like the Corvette Club checking build dates on Starters, Alternators and Carbs.!!

I think somewhere in this new Forum system there is a Judging forum or rules list etc.
Update: Oh yeah, right on the first page way down the huge list of Forum Topics I never use, there is something called Judging Forum.

[Maynard]

What you WILL need documentation for, is any very unusual factory orders and uncommon/questionable Accessories or Parts or Colors for the given year of the Truck.

I'm fortunate to have the original invoice for the truck, since it has 19.5" wheels and the required larger opening front fenders as used on the big iron. The invoice states the tire sizes.

So we are not like the Corvette Club checking build dates on Starters, Alternators and Carbs.!!

Man, are you kidding? Wish my wife could meet some of them. She'd quit calling me...well, you know.

[studegary]

Barnlark, thanks for those pictures. They're great. I've been looking for an excuse to go the local yards, and looking for belts is as good an excuse as any. I'm not building a show piece, so I could live with the condition you mentioned. Think of me if you get the mood to sell them. I think I realize it's just the latches, and not the attachment hardware.

StudeRich, I'm just learning the scope of the hobby. I see there's a judging class for original examples. Would it be objectionable to add an accessory that was offered by the factory or dealership?

As usual, I agree with Rich's response. The key words are factory authorized accessories. If Studebaker said that your year and model could be equipped with the item, then it is okay. There were many things put on by dealers, even before delivery, that are not correct. Some of the common incorrect items are exterior mirrors, radios, exhaust extensions, seat covers and 1961 Hawks with the quarter stripe color changed.

A friend purchased a new 1957 pickup with most everything, including V8, automatic transmission, radio and seat belts.

[Skip Lackie]

Maynard-
Judging authenticity can be a contentious subject -- so much so that many members don't bother to have their vehicles judged. But it IS a way to get some expert advice on the quality of your restoration. In general, period-correct accessories don't cost any points. Also, the installation of modern safety equipment (seat belts, radial tires) is acceptable. The SDC Judging Manual can be downloaded from here:

http://www.studebakerdriversclub.com/sdcjudgingpolicies.asp

And as Rich has noted, specific questions can be raised on the Judging page of this forum.

[barnlark]

More pics of the period correct belt latches. Your year had a multitude of color options for the webbing. My year, 1960, only had grey webbing available, so black would be incorrect for a stock application. I think black looks just fine. I found 1957 Karbelts with the X stitch, so that is what I attempted to reproduce...with heavy industrial grade glue from a canvas top shop.
As Rich and Skip noted, it can be a contentious topic, but it's really not that big of a deal since we aren't that picky...usually. Safety is really the most important factor. My belts are better than nothing, but I'm not kidding myself that they will save me in a bad accident. Keep us up to date on what you find. I'd have to put mine back together with the springs to sell them and that's not an easy feat!

[Maynard]

Barnlark, thanks for posting more pictures of those. And compliments on the quality of the work and the pictures of it. How do you know about the colors available in 1957? Do you know what colors were available? If the truck interior is the same as the exterior, it's Turquoise. I found a vendor for replacement webbing that offers a color they call turquoise.

I realize there are better modern systems out there. And I realize you can't anticipate every turn of the road or count on the condition of the other driver. But, don't you drive your Studebaker more carefully and pay more attention while driving it? I don't think there's much danger of overturning the '57 because of a blowout while tearing down the highway at a foolhardy speed. It's just for putting. If you get killed in an accident because of something you didn't anticipate or couldn't avoid...maybe your number was up. People wearing modern seat belts still get killed.

On that macabre note, are there any recent anecdotes of Studebaker drivers using these belt systems being in accidents? How'd they do?

[barnlark]

It wasn't a good year for seat belt stories in the club, Maynard. Best not to rehash those.

Most parts books have the available colors for seat belts as options, IIRC. They were in my Dealer Options and Parts Catalog with every conceivable dealer and retail list price, too. Turquoise belts sound perfect. The later style from many vendors and Stude International are reasonably priced. Get those and buy the red S~P stickers for them and you'll be fine. They are much less archaic than the originals. Good luck.