Approximate value of an R3 engine?

[studefan]

I am looking for opinions of the value of a complete R3 B stamped engine. Not sure if it is rebuilt or not but believe it was rebuilt years ago but not run. Has original cast iron heads, etc.

I heard one that was disassembled sold for $15k a couple years ago and another assembled engine for $25K several years ago.

Any thoughts on value would be appreciated.

[Studebaker Wheel]

That's easy. $725 net or $1660 suggested retail, add $200 for supercharger.

[PackardV8]

Not sure if it is rebuilt or not but believe it was rebuilt years ago but not run.

If one wants top dollar, that's not enough for an evaluation. Much depends upon who's selling and who's buying and how deep each is willing to dig to establish authenticity and completeness.

FWIW, a B-serial-numbered block might be a complete and original as-installed Studebaker, might be a later Paxton-bitsa assemblage or might be a clone.

Suggest starting with posting the serial number and maybe someone here remembers it.

jack vines

[Hallabutt]

I can't imagine that with as many unknowns involving this engine that there are going to be many suitors willing to pony up the cash. It seems to me that any engine would require a thoroughly vetted history, as well a complete current condition report on what it is now. Falling short of any confirmation regarding history and current condition it is just interesting cold iron, waiting for a story to be told.

[Hulleywoodworking]

I did an internet search and found $25,000.00 R3 you referenced. FYI, that was a fully rebuilt engine with all high end components built by a well known race engine builder. I'm going to assume that the unassembled $15K engine you referenced was taken apart and evaluated by a reputable rebuild shop and was in great condition.

The point is that an R3 that hasn't run in years in unknown condition isn't worth much, because it's a crap shoot.

If you want top dollar, you need to get it to a reputable shop, have it torn down, and evaluated. In other words, you will have to spend some money to know what you've got before you can put a price on it. You may find that the engine is perfect, or you may find that it is nothing more than a boat anchor.

Just be aware that any buyer will have to do the same thing, so they will offer accordingly, and their offer will reflect the chance they are taking that it is a salvageable engine.

In my opinion, being an R3 only adds value IF the engine and components are good. I don't think many (any?) will spend big bucks on an unknown just because it is an R3.

[PackardV8]

I did an internet search and found $25,000.00 R3 you referenced. FYI, that was a fully rebuilt engine with all high end components built by a well known race engine builder. I'm going to assume that the unassembled $15K engine you referenced was taken apart and evaluated by a reputable rebuild shop and was in great condition.

The point is that an R3 that hasn't run in years in unknown condition isn't worth much, because it's a crap shoot.

If you want top dollar, you need to get it to a reputable shop, have it torn down, and evaluated. In other words, you will have to spend some money to know what you've got before you can put a price on it. You may find that the engine is perfect, or you may find that it is nothing more than a boat anchor.

Just be aware that any buyer will have to do the same thing, so they will offer accordingly, and their offer will reflect the chance they are taking that it is a salvageable engine.

In my opinion, being an R3 only adds value IF the engine and components are good. I don't think many (any?) will spend big bucks on an unknown just because it is an R3.

As previously mentioned, to some, an R3 is just stampings on a short or long block. To others, it is a complete turnkey engine with all the unobtainum bits worth big bucks.

Agree, somewhere in between is going to determine the value, after an inspection by one of the few here who knows what to look for.

jack vines

[studefan]

Thanks for all the comments to date.

For more clarification, let's assume the engine is rebuilt and is complete with all the goodies and unobtanium parts but hasn't been started after the rebuild.

I think Jack's comments (If I follow them correctly) make the most sense in that the engine is worth between the $15K and $25K as these are recent sales examples.

Additional thoughts/comments are welcome.

[VtMike]

I thought that genuine r3 engines had aluminum heads? You say the engine has original cast iron heads. Could you clarify?

[Alan]

Joe G. Had 2 sets of 1555479 aluminum heads cast. One set was put on the 229 motor for Bonnie. 3 hardened seats came loose and that killed any more playing with aluminum.

[RadioRoy]

Another question is, are you looking to buy it, or are you looking to sell it?

There is always a disparity of price/cost between one situation or the other.

[Gunslinger]

I thought that genuine r3 engines had aluminum heads? You say the engine has original cast iron heads. Could you clarify?

I’m not sure R3 engines had aluminum heads…but they did have aluminum intakes.

[r1lark]

"Original" R3 heads are cast iron. There were aluminum reproduction R3 heads available from Lionel Stone for a time.

[swvalcon]

Thing is a iron head will make more Hp than a aluminum head all things being equal. It's just the aluminum heads are easier to port and I believe to mold. The iron head holding more heat will build as much or more power at the same flow rate.

[Dwight FitzSimons]

I did an internet search and found $25,000.00 R3 you referenced. FYI, that was a fully rebuilt engine with all high end components built by a well known race engine builder. I'm going to assume that the unassembled $15K engine you referenced was taken apart and evaluated by a reputable rebuild shop and was in great condition.

The point is that an R3 that hasn't run in years in unknown condition isn't worth much, because it's a crap shoot.

If you want top dollar, you need to get it to a reputable shop, have it torn down, and evaluated. In other words, you will have to spend some money to know what you've got before you can put a price on it. You may find that the engine is perfect, or you may find that it is nothing more than a boat anchor.

Just be aware that any buyer will have to do the same thing, so they will offer accordingly, and their offer will reflect the chance they are taking that it is a salvageable engine.

In my opinion, being an R3 only adds value IF the engine and components are good. I don't think many (any?) will spend big bucks on an unknown just because it is an R3.

In this case "isn't worth much" is a relative term. An R3 engine, with the correct 479 cast-iron heads, int & exh manifolds, carb & enclosure, supercharger setup & pulleys, and the short block would be worth "thousands", not hundreds. How many thousands I don't know. I paid $10k for my R3 25 years ago. It ran reasonably well, but was a bit tired. I don't think I got taken and I don't think the values have gone down since then. They have gone up. The values in post number 1 seem about right.
--Dwight

[gwood]

If I recall correctly, there was an R3 engine still in the crate advertised in Turning Wheels about 10 years ago for $25K. I am not sure what all was there but I did call and the fellow said it sold on one of the early calls, and he had had lots of calls following that. Since it was already sold I didn't ask what all was included.

[Hulleywoodworking]

In this case "isn't worth much" is a relative term. An R3 engine, with the correct 479 cast-iron heads, int & exh manifolds, carb & enclosure, supercharger setup & pulleys, and the short block would be worth "thousands", not hundreds. How many thousands I don't know. I paid $10k for my R3 25 years ago. It ran reasonably well, but was a bit tired. I don't think I got taken and I don't think the values have gone down since then. They have gone up. The values in post number 1 seem about right.
--Dwight

That was my point. As of now, we know absolutely nothing about this engine. Is it a true R3 or a clone? Is everything correct and intact? What condition is the block, crank, cam, heads, etc.? Without a thorough and proper evaluation, the engine is a complete crap shoot. I know that I wouldn't gamble $15K on it at this time. I was and continue to encourage the OP to spend the money and time to find out what exactly he has, so that a fair price can be justified.

In other words, until we know a great deal more, I'll continue to believe that this engine isn't worth very much, and that it is highly unlikely that anyone will pay a premium for it without further evidence to the contrary. In my opinion.

[Hulleywoodworking]

On another note, Jack Vines suggested that the OP post the serial number to give the historians a starting point.