6 cylinder Avanti

[Dick LeRoux]

The original drawings for the Avanti had a "raked" windshield but the story goes that in the mock up Sherwood Egbert smacked his head getting into the the mock up and screamed, "Raise the GD roof." which resulted in the more upright windshield. Look at the original drawings that show that. I'd post the picture but haven't figured that out yet.

[studegary]

I probably know the answer... Were there ever any 6 cylinder Avantis?

(For reference, and I know they are not the same, but when Chevy first introduced the Super Sport it was an option group or package. One could get the S.S. package with any engine or trans. There are some well documented cases of Impala SS's with 6 cylinders and 3 speed trans.)

Where is the best and easiest to find source of info about Avantis, both Studebaker and later? Thanks.

But did you know the answer? There were factory built Avantis with a six cylinder engine.

EDIT: To answer your question - John Hull's books, this SDC Forum and the AOAI website & Forum.

[Andy R.]

"
I mentioned this to one of the Studebaker stylists at an SDC Int'l meet in South Bend some decades ago and he replied that the Jaguar E-Type windshield was about the same angle.

I see what you mean about the windshield rake of the Avanti and E-type being almost the same. The Avanti windshield appears only slightly more raked than the Lark Convertible, which stands to reason.

Seems the main difference is is the E-type curvature as it wraps horizontally to the A-pillars. Saab and Alfa Romeo really worked this aerodynamic feature on their relatively upright windshields.

Hard to believe this boxy Guilia had a drag coefficient of only 0.34, nearly matching that of the 4th gen Camaro (above) in its final years. Like the E-type, only 1/2 of the Guilia windshield is near the leading edge. The other 2/4 is wrapping back to the side. Another feature of the Giulia that contributed to the low Cd is the upward curvature of the cowl before the windshield, as on our beloved C/K models. Great article on this car's aerodynamics in Hemmings:
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/articl...iulia-1300-ti/

[PackardV8]

"I'm not aware of any. If it happened, they probably didn't set any records. While the Avanti styling was swoopy by 1963 standards, the upright windshield results in quite high drag."

I mentioned this to one of the Studebaker stylists at an SDC Int'l meet in South Bend some decades ago and he replied that the Jaguar E-Type windshield was about the same angle. So, maybe the stylists weren't thinking so much about aerodynamic drag (and Bonneville) as they were about styling and packaging. The Avanti's windshield could have been raked back at a bit greater angle without impacting entry or egress, so it's too bad they didn't. Look at modern cars; their windshields are raked back so much that they do impact entry and egress.
-Dwight

Yes, the Jaguar, the Avanti, the Sunbeam Tiger, all designed in the early '60s, had very upright windshields by today's standards.

jack vines

[Dwight FitzSimons]

"I'm not aware of any. If it happened, they probably didn't set any records. While the Avanti styling was swoopy by 1963 standards, the upright windshield results in quite high drag."

I mentioned this to one of the Studebaker stylists at an SDC Int'l meet in South Bend some decades ago and he replied that the Jaguar E-Type windshield was about the same angle. So, maybe the stylists weren't thinking so much about aerodynamic drag (and Bonneville) as they were about styling and packaging. The Avanti's windshield could have been raked back at a bit greater angle without impacting entry or egress, so it's too bad they didn't. Look at modern cars; their windshields are raked back so much that they do impact entry and egress.
-Dwight

[t walgamuth]

The venerable and nearly indestructible Slant six (My dad loved them) is one of the few engines of any cylinder count that might give the Stude v8 a run for its money on dead weight.

[spokejr]

IIRC, the 1963 Mercedes-Benz 220 SE only developed 134 horsepower versus the 240 horsepower of the R1. I drove M-B back in the day and they were by no means quick feeling. Once up to top speed, they'd hold it forever, but not much acceleration.

jack vines

Jack, you caught me sleeping. The 220 SE (fuel injected) was indeed only 134 SAE hp, the later 280 SE was 180 hp and 182 ft lbs SAE. Unfortunately the 280 wasn't available until '68.

Ken

[Madd Doodler]

About 20 years ago Bill Cathcart was working with a team that was running a 6 cylinder Avanti at Bonneville. He was supplying the high performance 6 parts for them. I never heard much more about it though.

[PackardV8]

I wonder if anyone ever instI'malled one to run a smaller displacement class for land speed records?

I'm not aware of any. If it happened, they probably didn't set any records. While the Avanti styling was swoopy by 1963 standards, the upright windshield results in quite high drag.

Those who land speed race Avanti relate it runs into an aero drag wall about 200 MPH. The aero drag is such resistance more horsepower just spins the rear wheels. There have been calculations showing the 1975 Monza

or the '80s-'90s Camaros
will run 30-50 MPH faster with the same horsepower.

jack vines

[Andy R.]

I wonder if anyone ever installed one to run a smaller displacement class for land speed records?

[PackardV8]

I am kind of surprised that Studebaker didn't lean on their connection with Mercedes on more product. The 220SE engine certainly would have been lighter and near the same power as an R1.

IIRC, the 1963 Mercedes-Benz 220 SE only developed 134 horsepower versus the 240 horsepower of the R1. I drove M-B back in the day and they were by no means quick feeling. Once up to top speed, they'd hold it forever, but not much acceleration.

jack vines

[Frank54]

Thanks for all responses.

[spokejr]

Somebody put a Chrysler Slant 6 in one. Why? Beats me!

I am kind of surprised that Studebaker didn't lean on their connection with Mercedes on more product. The 220SE engine certainly would have been lighter and near the same power as an R1. On the other hand, it was likely too tall. If laid over like the 300 SL's though, it may have fit.

[bezhawk]

There were a couple of 6 cylinder Avantis made of the last ford Mustang based cars. I think at least two came that way. Those would be 2007 models.

[gordr]

There is probably enough room there for a Commander 245 six. I wonder how one would run with a Paxton blower on it? I started my Avanti today, and warmed it up, and moved it a few feet to make room for the Daytona Convertible behind it.