Engine: Oil

[mkibler]

Hi Guys,

I have two quick questions:

1) What type (viscosity, additives to avoid like sulphur, etc.) and brand do you recommend for when I change the oil on my 1951 2R5 pickup tomorrow?

I worked for an old school mechanic years ago in high school and he always added about half a pint of kerosene to his oil before he changed it, then let the motor run for 15 minutes or so. I have done the same for years and I even flush a quart through the system and down through the oil pan on virtually every car and truck I have owned.

2) What do you fellas think about doing this on my 2R5 pickup before I change the oil, both pros and cons.

Thanks,

Mark in Ohio

[truckguy]

Mark, I use 15W40 in my Studebaker pickups. With that viscosity, the pressure will hold up even if the mains are a bit worn. Oils today are far superior to the oils manufactured 50 years ago and for that reason, I don't think brand is important. As such, what ever brand you use will have better specs than the recommended oil 50 years ago. The only additive necessary is ZDDP. Since the engines don't have full flow oil filters, I change the oil every 2,000. I'm not familiar with the practice of adding kerosene and running the engine before changing oil. I suppose the reason is to clean the inner walls of the engine. With today's high detergent oils, that practice would not seem necessary.

[Larry R]

Amsoil Z Rod oil. It is a full synthetic and is an excellent oil. It comes either in 10W30 or 20W50. That is what I run in all my flat tappet engines, it already has the ZDDP additive.

[tsenecal]

I second the Amsoil Z rod. Along with the ZDDP, it is formulated to work well in vehicles that are not driven for longer periods of time.

[Jeffry Cassel]

I've been using Valvolene VR-1 in 20-50 wt. It has ZDDP in it ( it is made for flat tappet engines). I also bought all the 15-40 at the local John Deere dealer before they too were forced to change their formula. Anyone else out there thought that just maybe the EPA is out to destroy our old cars??

[jackb]

Have you (OP) tried the "Search" function on this site. There is a lot of info on many subjects that will better inform you on novice questions (here) than posting and awaiting responses....

[Bud]

I wouldn't doubt that the bureaucrats want the old cars off the road. They've been trying to do that in California for years under the premise that they are major polluters. The new CK4 rated HDEO's have been reformulated to reduce diesel particulate filter contamination on the cars and trucks built since 2007. I'm thinking that the oil refiners are more interested in the bottom line as most older non DPF equipped heavy duty trucks are now off the road so the need for the older CJ4 oils is greatly reduced. I too bought a bunch of 15W-40 CJ4 rated oil last year before it disappeared from the shelves. I should have enough oil on hand to last me at least 5 more years. Bud

[TWChamp]

I've been using Valvolene VR-1 in 20-50 wt. It has ZDDP in it ( it is made for flat tappet engines). I also bought all the 15-40 at the local John Deere dealer before they too were forced to change their formula. Anyone else out there thought that just maybe the EPA is out to destroy our old cars??

Between the reformulated gas and oil, it would sure seem so.

[jackb]

...the powers should just sit back and let the hobby die of its own weight...... we can't have 20 years left of any real driving. I'd bet 75% or better of old vehicles will be in collections (real or perceived), modified, or Pacific found...by then....ZDDP will be found on a Trivial Pursuit bonus pack......

[jnormanh]

Between the reformulated gas and oil, it would sure seem so.

I don't believe the claims about ethanol in fuel and elimination of ZDDP in oil.

I have owned a 1959 Sprite since 1990. The engine was rebuilt in 1991. It has always used whatever comes out to the Regular fuel pump, and whatever 10W40 or 15W40 has been on sale. The engine checks 165 psi on all 4 cylinders, running oil pressure is 50 psi (that's where the bypass opens), and it uses no oil. The British car club I belong to includes about 140 cars, the newest of which is a 1979. All of these cars are driven, including a handful which are daily drivers.

There is no unusual amount of valve erosion or cylinder/bearing wear reported by anyone I have talked to. Yes, some of the engines are worn because they have either never been rebuilt, or were rebuilt many years ago.

On the plus side, the mild steel exhaust pipe and muffler which were installed in 1991 are still just fine. I have replaced the spark plugs once, although the originals from 1991 looked just fine. The 1991 rubber fuel hoses show no evidence of chemical damage.

[tsenecal]

jnormanh, you are certainly entitled to your own opinion, but the "claims" that you choose to not believe, are actually backed up by many facts. Ethanol fuel is fine for poly fuel tanks, lines, and fuel injection, although it produces less power than non ethanol. Where it really causes problems is in metal fuel tanks, and lines, and carbureted vehicles. If they sit for any length of time, the ethanol will corrode the pot metal in the carb, and hold moisture at the bottom of the fuel tank. It will also be much more likely to vapor lock, on older carbureted vehicles, in hot weather. As for ZDDP, I'm sure you can run modern oil in an average engine, but anything with flat tappets and a more aggressive cam with higher spring rates, could likely have problems without the zinc. There are many articles about camshaft failure related to the modern oil without it.

[jnormanh]

Ethanol fuel is fine for poly fuel tanks, lines, and fuel injection, although it produces less power than non ethanol. Where it really causes problems is in metal fuel tanks, and lines, and carbureted vehicles. If they sit for any length of time, the ethanol will corrode the pot metal in the carb, and hold moisture at the bottom of the fuel tank.

The steel fuel tank in my car dates from 1959. No corrosion, no leaks. The carbs date from 1968. they were last rebuilt in 1991. No corrosion. The cars sits unused for months during the winter.

Actually, I expect that 10% ethanol prevents condensed water from sitting on the bottom on the tank and carb bowls, and so prevents corrosion. Isn't alcohol the active ingredient in "Dry Gas"?

The cam was reground in 1991 and new lifters installed. Clearances were set at .012" and haven't needed resetting. Lack of ZDDP hasn't caused measurable lifter wear. Certainly modern motor oils are far better than, say, "Oilzum" or "Royal Triton" were back in 1959.

So when will all this damage you predict happen?

[Larry R]

How many miles do you drive with your cars per year? That could be one factor shy you have had the success you seem to have. Fewer miles=less wear.

[lumpy]

The steel fuel tank in my car dates from 1959. No corrosion, no leaks. The carbs date from 1968. they were last rebuilt in 1991. No corrosion. The cars sits unused for months during the winter.

Actually, I expect that 10% ethanol prevents condensed water from sitting on the bottom on the tank and carb bowls, and so prevents corrosion. Isn't alcohol the active ingredient in "Dry Gas"?

The cam was reground in 1991 and new lifters installed. Clearances were set at .012" and haven't needed resetting. Lack of ZDDP hasn't caused measurable lifter wear. Certainly modern motor oils are far better than, say, "Oilzum" or "Royal Triton" were back in 1959.

So when will all this damage you predict happen?

. Its happening now Ethanol fuel attracts water as it sits . I have had to rebuild several carbs for friends who let their cars sit to long.. It's usually pretty ugly inside. And if you attempt to run an older vehicle on old ethanol type fuel be ready for the valves to stick in the guide's. This is from personal experience , not on my cars but from several I have worked on . Trust me and ask your local small engine repairman about the damage caused to lawn mowers from sitting too long with E15 in them.That crap goes bad in 90 days or less. And yes flat tappet cams will be damaged by not having zinc in the oil. Choose to believe what you want , but I do this every day and have seen the damage first hand .

[kamzack]

Worm can, uugin.
Kim