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BShaw
08-22-2006, 08:28 PM
I'm finally getting around to replacing my WCFB with an Edelbrock 1403 500 cfm (that will sit atop my Jeff Rice converted intake).

A while back I picked up a 1/2" spacer at a local speed shop, but didn't really examine it until today. Anyway, the stud holes are too wide apart (probably for a Holly carb?)

So, does anyone know what 1/2" spacer brand/number is needed and where can I get one (MN) before Labor Day so I can drive my Hawk to our North Star Chapter's annual Orphan Car Show?

BShaw,Webmaster
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60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

N8N
08-22-2006, 08:31 PM
Mr. Gasket no. 97 will work, but you may need to open up the primary holes in your manifold to avoid a "step" in the wrong direction. I am using one on my LS manifold. I am not aware of an out of the box spacer that will work without mods, but if you have the ability to make stuff out of wood, a hardwood spacer would actually work pretty well. (use a gasket for a template)

good luck,

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

JDP
08-22-2006, 08:55 PM
You guys and your spacers, I just zing off the carb linkage part on the bottom and use the regular gasket stack.

http://stude.com/sig.jpg
Studebaker On The Net
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Arnold Md.
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
63 Daytona HT
63 Lark 2 dr.
62 Lark 2 door
62 GT(parts car)
60 Lark convert
60 Hawk
52 Starliner
51 Commander

DEEPNHOCK
08-22-2006, 10:13 PM
You don't need any spacer (unless you want one) if you trim off the lower tab (GM a/t kickdown tab) on the carb linkage. You can trim on the embossed 'step' that bumps the tab out a little bit. You might also need to remove the two choke stove tubes on the other side to clear the secondary throttle linkage. Most guys just grind the two tubes off and put some JB Weld in the holes. I like to grind off the 2 tubes and run a drill bit through the tubes to remove the lower loop, then JB Weld the two holes up. Doing these two steps keeps the carb low down to avoid hood clearance issues om some C/K's and Avanti's.
Give ma a shout and I can talk you through it.
Jeff[8D]


quote:Originally posted by BShaw

I'm finally getting around to replacing my WCFB with an Edelbrock 1403 500 cfm (that will sit atop my Jeff Rice converted intake).

A while back I picked up a 1/2" spacer at a local speed shop, but didn't really examine it until today. Anyway, the stud holes are too wide apart (probably for a Holly carb?)

So, does anyone know what 1/2" spacer brand/number is needed and where can I get one (MN) before Labor Day so I can drive my Hawk to our North Star Chapter's annual Orphan Car Show?

BShaw,Webmaster
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h53/StudeRobert/StudeWebService-small.gif
60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota


http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j54/deepnhock/Jeff%20Rice%20Studebaker%20Pictures/1937StudebakerCoupeExpressJeffRicee.jpg

DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
Ocala, FL.[u](For two more weeks!)</u>
'37 Coupe Express (never ending project)
'37 Coupe Express Trailer (project)
'61 Hawk (project)
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N8N
08-22-2006, 10:15 PM
I just don't like modding the carb in case I decide I want a different carb in the future; besides that little lower hole makes a handy location for a return spring :)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

BShaw
08-22-2006, 10:51 PM
Thanks all. I think I'll go the trimming route to maximize hood clearance. I'll also cut, drill and JB Weld the choke tubes (Thanks, Jeff... that answers another question before I aksed it!). If I experience percolation I can add a spacer later. I'll put the old intake and WCFB on a shelf in case I want to return it to orginal someday.




BShaw,Webmaster
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h53/StudeRobert/StudeWebService-small.gif
60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

JDP
08-22-2006, 11:56 PM
I just tap the tube out of the way in case I want to go back to a standard choke carb at some point. The tube is a closed loop, so nothing "leaks" out.

http://stude.com/sig.jpg
Studebaker On The Net
http://stude.com
Studebaker News Group
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.studebaker
Arnold Md.
64 Daytona HT
63 R2 4 speed GT Hawk
63 GT Hawk
63 Avanti R1/AC
63 Avanti R2/4 speed
63 Daytona HT
63 Lark 2 dr.
62 Lark 2 door
62 GT(parts car)
60 Lark convert
60 Hawk
52 Starliner
51 Commander

DEEPNHOCK
08-23-2006, 07:55 AM
You can do this choke tube a couple different ways if you want to keep your manifold to go back to stock.
One is to tap the tubes down and away (like JP said), and one other way is to take the intake manifold and turn it upside down on a bench. Put a 2x4 under the exhaust crossover and take a long drift punch and place it in between the two tubes (on the bottom side). Take the punch and smack it to drive the plug (that holds the u-loop tube) upward and out the top of the manifold. This way the plug containing the u-loop tube will be preserved and can be reinstalled later if desired.

Then you take a 5/16" carriage bolt and grind the square corners off a little bit (to fit the hole) and bolt it in so the nut is inside the crossover tube. It leaves a nice rounded cap on the outside that clears the linkage.
(kudo's to Jim Turner for this tip)

Hope the info helps.
Jeff[8D]



quote:Originally posted by BShaw

Thanks all. I think I'll go the trimming route to maximize hood clearance. I'll also cut, drill and JB Weld the choke tubes (Thanks, Jeff... that answers another question before I aksed it!). If I experience percolation I can add a spacer later. I'll put the old intake and WCFB on a shelf in case I want to return it to orginal someday.




BShaw,Webmaster
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h53/StudeRobert/StudeWebService-small.gif
60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

BShaw
08-23-2006, 11:32 AM
The carriage bolt is also a good tip. HOWEVER, my planned Studebaker day has come to a screeching halt. After getting out the cutoff tool and pumping up the compressor in mounting anticipation of whacking off the lower tab on the carb, I took the aforementioned carb out of its carton for the first time. All looked as it should for a new-in-the-box unit UNTIL I glanced at the base and saw the numbers 1406 stamped in it! Looked at the carton again and confirmed the 1403 label on it.

To be honest, I DID buy the carb on Ebay back in January (Nate I think you were also looking at this one) and it WAS advertised as a new-in-box 1403. And being a frugal Studebaker chap I was proud as a peacock to save 25-30 bucks under the cost at Summit.

Well, penny wise and pound foolish applies to yours truly. I suppose this 1406 will go back on Ebay (sold as a 1406 in a 1403 box, of course) and I'll get whatever I get (adding up to taking it in the shorts) and I'll order a 1403 from a known vendor like Summit.

Bobservation: Pinching a penny often results in being bitten in the a$$.

BShaw,Webmaster
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h53/StudeRobert/StudeWebService-small.gif
60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

CHAMP
08-23-2006, 12:41 PM
I don't have a problem with pinching pennies! I love to spend money on my Stude and if you don't beleive it ask my wife!:D

GARY H 2DR.SEDAN 48 STUDEBAKER CHAMPION NORTHEAST MD.

N8N
08-23-2006, 04:01 PM
Bob,

I actually bought a different 1403 on eBay and it turned out to be damaged. I still have the carb as the seller was a real jerk about it. The primary throttle shaft is bent and the casting is cracked on the pass side behind where the choke would go. If you want to take a chance that the primary throttle bore is OK (the crack *appears* to be in a non functional location) I'll sell it to you real cheap. I have stolen some choke related parts off of it but all the 1403-unique parts are still there (throttle blades, rods, jets, etc.)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

sbca96
08-23-2006, 04:58 PM
That GM TV Cable (not a "kickdown" like Studebaker") arm is GOLD if you
ever decide to replace your Borg Warner with a 700-R4. The Stude uses
this to kick down the trans, but it will work without it. The GM uses
this to control line pressure, which means the 700 wont engage right.
This will make the car undrivable, and burn the trans in short order.
After years of dealing with the BW trans, and wanting to go drive my
newly installed 700-R4 Hawk right away, I decided to take a spin around
the block before I hooked up the TV Cable. Lets just say it never got
out of "first" gear, and over 1000 RPM would slip like crazy.

http://www.tciauto.com/instructions/gm_tv_cable_adjust.htm

"It is imperative that after your new TCIŽ 700R4/2004R transmission has been installed that the Throttle Valve (TV) Cable gets adjusted properly, DAMAGE WILL OCCUR to the transmission, voiding the warranty. If you are unsure about the proper adjustment needed, call TCIŽ's tech line for help or refer to a General Motors service manual for additional information and reference.

Function of the TV Cable: Many people believe that this is a detent downshift cable and that this is the only function that the cable performs. In actuality, the TV Cable controls line pressures, shift points, part throttle downshifts and detent downshifts. The cable functions similarly to the combination vacuum modulator/cable systems found on other automatic transmissions."

Tom

BShaw
08-23-2006, 06:05 PM
Thanks for the offer, Nate but I'm going to get a new'un.

Tom, you make a good point but as I love the 3-speed manual w/OD in my 60 Hawk I'm not a candidate for putting in a 700-R4.

BShaw,Webmaster
http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h53/StudeRobert/StudeWebService-small.gif
60 Hawk. 49 2R5, 39 Champion
Woodbury, Minnesota

DEEPNHOCK
08-25-2006, 08:43 PM
Good point Tom, but only if you have a 700R4.
Do you know if the 200R4 uses the same TV cable deal?
Reason for asking is I just traded a 700R4 for a 200R4 for a future project that currenty has a TH350 in it... and I want the OD trans to clear the X-member without cutting it....
Jeff[8D]


quote:Originally posted by sbca96

That GM TV Cable (not a "kickdown" like Studebaker") arm is GOLD if you ever decide to replace your Borg Warner with a 700-R4.
&lt;snip&gt;
Tom


http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j54/deepnhock/Jeff%20Rice%20Studebaker%20Pictures/1937StudebakerCoupeExpressJeffRicee.jpg

DEEPNHOCK at Cox.net
Ocala, FL.[u](For ONE more week!)</u>
'37 Coupe Express (never ending project)
'37 Coupe Express Trailer (project)
'61 Hawk (project)
http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

sbca96
08-25-2006, 09:34 PM
Yes ... the 200-4R is controled the same way, since the 700-R4 is more
popular (because it can be used out-of-the-box with high HP) people
incorrectly call the 200-4R the 200-R4. As the link I posted a quote
from above says, "700R4/2004R transmission has been installed that the
Throttle Valve (TV) Cable gets adjusted properly". Not trying to be
cocky, just clarifying. If you are using the 200 trans with a high
horsepower engine, make sure you do the common upgrades.

Also as an FYI .. stay clear of the per 1987 700R4 transmissions, they
did enough upgrades in 1988 to have called it a new transmission. GM
made a mistake by waiting til 1993 to call the upgraded 700, the 4L60.
In 1994 the trans was upgraded (slightly) to be computer controled. It
was then called the 4L60E. If you have a chance, this shortly used
4L60 (still w/ the TV Cable) would be a nice addition for an R series
car, or a hopped up Stude motor. Its basically a 700R4, but with a few
nice tweaks to make for better shifts, and longer life. It can be
found in 1993 Camaro Z28s and Firebird Formulas.

Tom

mbstude
08-25-2006, 09:38 PM
quote:Good point Tom, but only if you have a 700R4.
Do you know if the 200R4 uses the same TV cable deal?
Reason for asking is I just traded a 700R4 for a 200R4 for a future project that currenty has a TH350 in it... and I want the OD trans to clear the X-member without cutting it....
Jeff


Does this mean the CE will finally be Stude powered? :D

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