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Thread: '51 Land Cruiser

  1. #41
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Thanks Sam, but as I said before, this car isn't for sale.

    More new parts are showing up. I talked to Tom Shrock a month or so ago, and somewhere in the conversation he said, "tomorrow is my 82nd birthday. And one of these days I'd like to retire!" Thinking that maybe I should take advantage of the Shrocks services while it's still being offered, I asked him to do a wheel for the '51. It's perfect.


  2. #42
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    I have the same car. What was the cost of the wheel repair? You can PM me if you don’t want to post it.

  3. #43
    Golden Hawk Member jclary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim333 View Post
    I have the same car. What was the cost of the wheel repair? You can PM me if you don’t want to post it.
    It is not a repair. The Schrocks make no secret of their charges. Prices are listed on their website (I don't have the link handy). They strip the core and mold a brand new wheel around the metal core. When finished, you have a brand new wheel made with brand new UV resistant material that is probably more durable than the originals. I have one on my Land Cruiser and it was worth every penny.
    John Clary
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    SDC member since 1975

  4. #44
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tim333 View Post
    I have the same car. What was the cost of the wheel repair? You can PM me if you don’t want to post it.
    http://www.shrockbrothers.com/steering_wheels.html

    Scroll down, the ‘51 wheel is towards the bottom. $800 cast onto your core.

    Like John said, what they do is more of a remanufacture than a repair. The wheels are cast in a colored urethane that should last forever.

    Here's another one that they recast earlier this year.

    Last edited by mbstude; 09-07-2018 at 06:35 AM.

  5. #45
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    Thanks, scrolled down and saw that a few hours ago.

  6. #46
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    It'll be sometime next month before I have enough time to finish the brakes and get back to working on the car. Still, I've had some time in the evenings to play around with attempting to replicate the plastic bulletnose insert.

    Last year, a friend gave me a silicone mold for the bullet. Not knowing anything about casting plastics, it's been a "learn as I go" process, and I think I may have finally found a casting resin that produces acceptable results; Urethane based and supposed to not turn yellow when exposed to UV.

    Why buy a part when I can make one for three times the cost?



    Last edited by mbstude; 09-23-2018 at 01:37 PM.

  7. #47
    Golden Hawk Member jclary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    It'll be sometime next month before I have enough time to finish the brakes and get back to working on the car. Still, I've had some time in the evenings to play around with attempting to replicate the plastic bulletnose insert.

    Last year, a friend gave me a silicone mold for the bullet. Not knowing anything about casting plastics, it's been a "learn as I go" process, and I think I may have finally found a casting resin that produces acceptable results; Urethane based and supposed to not turn yellow when exposed to UV.

    Why buy a part when I can make one for three times the cost?
    Matt...just because I like you so much...I will offer to use my Land Cruiser as a test platform for the bullet casting so you won't be embarrassed. Just send it to me, set a reminder on your smartphone calendar to check back in a couple of years and I will let you know how it's doing.
    John Clary
    Greer, SC
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    SDC member since 1975

  8. #48
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jclary View Post
    Matt...just because I like you so much...I will offer to use my Land Cruiser as a test platform for the bullet casting so you won't be embarrassed. Just send it to me, set a reminder on your smartphone calendar to check back in a couple of years and I will let you know how it's doing.
    Hey John, send me a message.
    Last edited by mbstude; 09-23-2018 at 06:15 PM.

  9. #49
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    I’ll take one

  10. #50
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Not so much an update on the car, but it's related. When I was talking to Tom and David Shrock about doing a steering wheel for the '51, I asked them if they could make a toy to match the car. Their response was that they didn't have any toys in production and that they really had no interest in taking custom orders, so I left it at that.

    They also told me that the attic of their shop was packed full of NOS Studebaker parts from various dealership inventories that they bought out in the '70's. They never did anything with the parts and asked if that might be something we were interested in. Long story short.. We drove up to PA this past week to load the trailer. A couple of days before we left home, David told me that they'd decided to make an exception and cast a '51 Land Cruiser toy for me. He had the body painted when we got there, and had it finished before we left. He showed me the entire process and I was able to watch the toy version of my car come down the assembly line (so to speak). He said that it isn't economical to only make one toy.. So I bought two.

    It was worth the trip just to hang out with them in their shop. They also gave me some helpful advice about casting the plastic bulletnoses. Coincidentally, the urethane casting resin that I used is the exact same stuff that they cast their parts with.. So the bullets should be good to go once I find a silver paint that's a closer match to the NOS one I have.

    Two of the nicest, most talented guys I've ever met.

    Last edited by mbstude; 10-01-2018 at 07:00 PM.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    Not so much an update on the car, but it's related. When I was talking to Tom and David Shrock about doing a steering wheel for the '51, I asked them if they could make a toy to match the car. Their response was that they didn't have any toys in production and that they really had no interest in taking custom orders, so I left it at that.

    They also told me that the attic of their shop was packed full of NOS Studebaker parts from various dealership inventories that they bought out in the '70's. They never did anything with the parts and asked if that might be something we were interested in. Long story short.. We drove up to PA this past week to load the trailer. A couple of days before we left home, David told me that they'd decided to make an exception and cast a '51 Land Cruiser toy for me. He had the body painted when we got there, and had it finished before we left. He showed me the entire process and I was able to watch the toy version of my car come down the assembly line (so to speak). He said that it isn't economical to only make one toy.. So I bought two.

    It was worth the trip just to hang out with them in their shop. They also gave me some helpful advice about casting the plastic bulletnoses. Coincidentally, the urethane casting resin that I used is the exact same stuff that they cast their parts in.. So the bullets should be good to go once I find a silver paint that's a closer match to the NOS one I have.

    Two of the nicest, most talented guys I've ever met.
    Neat story, congrats to you and well done.

    Question, Is the urethane clear and the back side painted or is the paint on the outside? Not a big deal, just curious.

    Bob
    , ,

  12. #52
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    Looking good! I bought one of those kits from Lark Works for my 1951 Land Cruiser and it turned out great. Donald does some really fine work and he is really easy to deal with. I was so impressed with his work that I ended up purchasing a harness for my 2R5. The Shrock Bros. are the way to go when it comes to re-manufactured steering wheels. About 2 years ago, I purchased a 1941 Champion phantom wheel from them and the detail is well worth the price.
    1947 Studebaker M-5
    1946 Studebaker M-5
    1948 Studebaker Land Cruiser
    1961 Studebaker Lark 4-dr. Sedan
    1951 Studebaker Land Cruiser

  13. #53
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetolbob View Post
    Neat story, congrats to you and well done.

    Question, Is the urethane clear and the back side painted or is the paint on the outside? Not a big deal, just curious.

    Bob
    It's cast clear with paint in the inside. That gives it a deep "wet" look when it's finished.

  14. #54
    Golden Hawk Member jclary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetolbob View Post
    Neat story, congrats to you and well done.

    Question, Is the urethane clear and the back side painted or is the paint on the outside? Not a big deal, just curious.

    Bob
    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    It's cast clear with paint in the inside. That gives it a deep "wet" look when it's finished.
    This reminds me of one of my "sales Successes" back in the day. It was in a town about 40 miles from where I live. A new plant had been established to build plastic components for commercial vehicles, including Volvo Trucks, and John Deere tractors. For several weeks, I called on the facility, only to be turned away by the receptionist. I would leave my business card and literature and politely leave.
    The process they used to make their parts is called Reactive Injection Molding. Now, I confess, there is still more I don't know about the process than I DO know about it.

    BUT, I had two products I sold that were extremely important to the success of their operation. Finishing equipment (paint spray guns) and pumps. Finally, after several times getting turned away, I got a call from the plant manager. When I was able to get inside the operation I was stunned to find a warehouse about a third full of John Deere tractor fenders rejected by Deere's quality control. The castings were perfect, but the paint was horrible. The process involved painting the mold before the plastic was injected. Once the mold was painted, it would be closed, and then the material would be injected, cured, and when opened...a perfectly painted part was supposed to emerge. That was not happening. After observing how they were going about it, it became obvious that they had serious problems. Flea market grade imported spray guns, poor training, and controls.

    I was able to clean up their compressed air, sell them quality spray guns, train the workers on how to adjust them, use correct hand/arm motion along with proper overlap, clean & maintain them, and In that operation, I became a "rock star." Rejects became rare, and my products supplied to them expanded to workstations and air tools. Like a lot of operations, that one went south of the border or offshore. Fortunately for me, after I had left the business.

    That customer's material was not clear, and the paint was applied to the exterior side of the mold, but I don't see why it wouldn't work on the inside. However, I don't know if some kind of special sophisticated cooldown process wouldn't be required to keep the paint and urethane from co-mingling while the urethane was curing. Sorry 'bout all the rambling, but how things get made fascinates me, and are rarely as simple on first glance. The fact that some folks undertake these tasks is very commendable...even if it turns out to be just a humble little plastic Studebaker orb.
    John Clary
    Greer, SC
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    SDC member since 1975

  15. #55
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Received the Production Order from Andy Beckman today. Not as informative as others I've seen.


  16. #56
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    I find it interesting that it was built for stock on August 29, 1951. That must have been at the end of 1951 model production.

    I spent an afternoon at the Shrock's location (home and shop) about the time that they were winding up vehicle restoration and getting more heavily into model making. I drove a truck with a trailer with a car on it to and from their location. I remember it as being not an easy site to find or to drive something like that to.
    Gary L.
    Wappinger, NY

    SDC member since 1968
    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

  17. #57
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by studegary View Post
    I find it interesting that it was built for stock on August 29, 1951. That must have been at the end of 1951 model production.

    I spent an afternoon at the Shrock's location (home and shop) about the time that they were winding up vehicle restoration and getting more heavily into model making. I drove a truck with a trailer with a car on it to and from their location. I remember it as being not an easy site to find or to drive something like that to.
    We were in Stephen’s F350 (single rear wheels) with a 24’ enclosed trailer. We stopped on a scale on the way home and figured out that we had around 13,000 pounds worth of parts in the trailer. It was a little exciting coming down the mountain from their shop.

    Regarding the production order, I’m a little surprised that a car with so many original accessories didn’t leave the factory with any of them.
    Last edited by mbstude; 10-02-2018 at 06:09 AM.

  18. #58
    Golden Hawk Member jclary's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    Regarding the production order, I’m a little surprised that a car with so many original accessories didn’t leave the factory with any of them.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but looking at that production order, I believe the car was built for general inventory with "destination" being #21 Stock. That leads me to think the car was to be held in some factory inventory parking lot (#21?) awaiting an order from a dealer? Notice shipping is filled in as (Cust) which I assume would be the specific Studebaker dealer would be responsible for getting the car shipped. If I'm correct, some dealers even did "driveaway" by sending employees to the factory to pick up and drive cars to their location.

    In the scheme of things for 1951, a Land Cruiser was already an expensive car. Loading it up with accessories would make the financing/payments even higher, and for a lot of places, more difficult to sell. One additional question I have, if the car was indeed produced without a specific destination...If a dealer ordered the car and requested any of the accessories to be added to the car, would the factory have pulled it from the parking lot and added the accessories in South Bend, or would they have placed the accessories in the car for the dealer to install and bill those items on a separate invoice?

    I certainly have zero first-hand knowledge, because, at that time, I was in the first grade, and our family of 8 had no car, no phone, no TV! But, we did have a radio, one milk cow, a bunch of chickens, and a few hogs. The only wheeled vehicle was my oldest brother's bicycle, and we had a wheelbarrow. Needless to say, it was a very small world back then, and a Studebaker Land Cruiser would certainly have been something to remember!
    John Clary
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  19. #59
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    I'm still fighting problems with the Turner brake kit, but at least I was able to spend some time on the car this weekend.

    I got the dual MC setup (mostly) installed, and swapped the 9" rear brakes in favor of 11" rears from an Avanti. New inner and outer grease seals, wheel cylinders, shoes, and drums. I need to run new metal lines and sort out the MC setup, but hopefully I'll have the brakes done before too long. The parking brake cable in the picture is one from a disc brake Lark that I installed temporarily to see if it would work.. It doesn't. A custom cable is now on the shopping list.



    Feeling like I needed to accomplish something on the car, I installed the new steering wheel, along with an NOS horn ring and center button.

    Last edited by mbstude; 10-07-2018 at 05:01 PM.

  20. #60
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    I finally have the brake job sorted out. I think I still have some air in the system somewhere as it doesn't stop quite as well as I would like, but still, it's better than it was, and the car is on the road again. I replaced the oil pressure flex hose and rebuilt the fuel pump this afternoon, and decided to drive it home this evening. The exhaust deflector fell off somewhere along the way.. Otherwise it did fine. It's nearly 90 degrees today, my only complaint is that the AC blows a little too cold.

    It runs and drives so nice, I'm going to wait a bit before digging into the wiring, and enjoy putting some miles on it for a while.

    Last edited by mbstude; 10-20-2018 at 04:00 PM.

  21. #61
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    Such a nice car. Enjoy!
    3H-C5 "The Blue Goose"


  22. #62
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Woke up this morning to temps in the low 60's, which is a little nicer than yesterday's low 90's. Loaded up the dog and did some Land Cruising before taking the car back to the shop.

    I wanted a Studebaker that would make a good long distance road car.. I think this one will do fine. I forgot how much I like having one with overdrive.




  23. #63
    President Member 62champ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    I forgot how much I like having one with overdrive.
    Fun to hear the motor take that deep breath when you let off the pedal at 35 and it slips into OD... Thanks for keeping us posted.

  24. #64
    Golden Hawk Member rockne10's Avatar
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    Using 2nd/over is a thrill when entering a highway as well.

  25. #65
    President Member Jerry Forrester's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    It runs and drives so nice, I'm going to wait a bit before digging into the wiring, and enjoy putting some miles on it for a while.
    [/img]
    Careful there Matt. You don't want to fix everything on the car. You may not wan't to admit it now, but deep in your heart you know that as soon as everything is done, the car is going to be for sale.
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  26. #66
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Forrester View Post
    Careful there Matt. You don't want to fix everything on the car. You may not wan't to admit it now, but deep in your heart you know that as soon as everything is done, the car is going to be for sale.
    Nah.. The thought hasn't crossed my mind. I wouldn't have bought this car if I didn't want to keep it.

    But I do like having different projects to work on. Here's a '47 Schwinn I put together recently with an 8 speed internally geared rear hub. Less expensive and easier to work on than Studebakers, but just as much fun.

    Last edited by mbstude; 12-29-2018 at 08:02 AM.

  27. #67
    Silver Hawk Member 52-fan's Avatar
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    That's a lot sleeker bike than I would expect for 1947. All the bikes I grew up with came with fenders.


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    1952 Commander 2 door. Really fine 259.
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  28. #68
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Weekend update on the '51. Yesterday I installed a new aluminum radiator from CGJ, a company in Alabama. It fits and works perfect; I'm happy with it. Installed a new water pump and hoses while I was at it.



    With the car now "road ready", I figured I'd shine it up a bit. Washed and waxed the paint, polished the chrome, and put on the new hood nameplates and V8 emblem. I've been driving it around all weekend and plan to do so this coming week as long as the weather doesn't turn wet. It runs and drives so nice, it's hard to put it back in the garage.





    Last edited by mbstude; 03-10-2019 at 08:26 AM.

  29. #69
    President Member 62champ's Avatar
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    Looks great Matt. Those battery cables should give you every ounce of juice that battery can put out!

  30. #70
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 62champ View Post
    Looks great Matt. Those battery cables should give you every ounce of juice that battery can put out!
    Those were another addition this weekend. 00 gauge wire, about $15 each from a marine store. Sometimes overkill is good.

  31. #71
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Not much new to report, just driving it occasionally and avoiding the thought of pulling the dash to replace the wiring harness.

    Had some time this past week, so I gave the car a good detailing, and put on a set of standard bumper guards in place of the towel racks.





    I bought a set of S.I.'s new repro Avanti rubber floor mats as soon as they were available, hoping I could make them work in the '51. They're designed for a car with hanging pedals, but with a little modifying they fit just fine.

    Last edited by mbstude; 12-29-2018 at 09:35 AM.

  32. #72
    Silver Hawk Member 52-fan's Avatar
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    You did a fine job of modifying that floor mat...Matt. I had to look close to see how you did it. What did you put it back together with?
    Attached Images Attached Images


    "In the heart of Arkansas."
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  33. #73
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    On the 19th, I drove the '51 150 miles round trip to an SDC Chapter meeting. Overall it couldn't have run better, but sitting behind the wheel for a few hours taught me two things: The loose steering needs to be fixed sooner rather than later, and I am still not satisfied with the Turner brake conversion. I'll try a different master cylinder, if that doesn’t fix it I’ll remove everything and install later V8 drums and the stock MC back on it.

    Stephen and I are planning to pull the dash board next month to replace the wiring harness. Since the steering column has to be removed to pull the dash, that would be the time to rebuild the steering box. There were 3 different gearboxes used on '51 models, and luckily my car has the "better" Saginaw box. The bad news is that sometime in the past the box was ran dry and the bearings have gotten "notchy". Poking around the shop, I found another '51 Saginaw column, and thought it'd be a good idea to rebuild it and have it ready to install. After taking it apart, it looked as though it would've been good to use as-is, but I replaced everything anyway. NOS worm gear post, sector shaft, bearings, etc. Once together I set the adjustments per the shop manual, and with a little paint it'll be ready to go. Nothing better than a brand new steering box for a 70 year old car!



    Last edited by mbstude; 01-27-2019 at 08:18 PM.

  34. #74
    President Member Flashback's Avatar
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    Enjoyed talking to you a few days ago, even if it was briefly. I appreciate the courteous way you do business, and the promptness. "Thanks"!! I am not nearly as active, but still hanging around, LOL. Like what you are doing with this beautiful car. Been watching all along. Question: Are the Diamondback tires, the best wide whites you have used? considering a set for The Saturday Night Special.

  35. #75
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flashback View Post
    Enjoyed talking to you a few days ago, even if it was briefly. I appreciate the courteous way you do business, and the promptness. "Thanks"!! I am not nearly as active, but still hanging around, LOL. Like what you are doing with this beautiful car. Been watching all along. Question: Are the Diamondback tires, the best wide whites you have used? considering a set for The Saturday Night Special.
    Was nice talking to you as well, Tex. I haven’t had many cars with wide whites to compare to, but if you want radials, I think Diamond Backs are the only way to go.

  36. #76
    Golden Hawk Member rockne10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    ... if you want radials, I think Diamond Backs are the only way to go.
    I will echo that sentiment.
    "All attempts to 'rise above the issue' are simply an excuse to avoid it profitably." --Dick Gregory

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  37. #77
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Today was the big day.. I drove the car into the shop and Stephen and I began disconnecting wires and unbolting parts. Step one: Remove the front seat, and be sure to shove the bottom of the seat track into the heater core while pulling it out of the car. Bonus points if antifreeze spews onto the carpet. We decided that installing a new heater core should be standard procedure when replacing the wiring, anyway.



    With the underhood wiring unhooked, we pulled the steering wheel, column jacket and shifter assembly, and then the steering box itself. The AC evaporator moved out of the way enough to remove the radio and unbolt the dash. With everything disconnected, it was pretty easy to pull the wiring harness through the firewall and then lay the whole mess on the workbench.



    I have nothing but positive things to say about the wiring harness I purchased from Lark Works. It is absolutely spot-on perfect and worth twice what it cost. They'll be my go-to for any future wiring needs.



    All of the gauges are operable and still glow in the dark, so I left them alone, aside from lubricating the speedometer. But I did replace all of the bulbs and dash switches (headlight, heater, and wiper) with NOS. I also installed an NOS turn signal switch since now's the time to do it.

    We were able to re-install the dash and get a lot of the underhood wires connected before calling it a day. Tomorrow we'll do our best to have the car driving out of the shop on its own. I also have new wiring for the headlights, overdrive, and taillights, but those can wait for another weekend.

    Last edited by mbstude; 02-03-2019 at 05:33 PM.

  38. #78
    President Member Colgate Studebaker's Avatar
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    Looking good Matt! I want a ride next time we're up your way. Hope you finish up before the game tonight, but then you might not even care about it as many of us do. Too much controversy this year. Talk to you later, Bill.

  39. #79
    Golden Hawk Member mbstude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Colgate Studebaker View Post
    Looking good Matt! I want a ride next time we're up your way. Hope you finish up before the game tonight, but then you might not even care about it as many of us do. Too much controversy this year. Talk to you later, Bill.
    What game?

    We put the car back together today, complete with a new heater core to replace the one that I shoved the seat track into. The rebuilt steering box fought us a bit, but it's in, as well as an NOS reach rod. With everything reassembled, we hooked up the battery and started the car.. Nothing caught on fire and we didn't see any smoke. Success!



    We had enough time this afternoon that we went ahead and tackled the rear chassis harness as well.

    Made for a pretty fun and productive weekend.

    Last edited by mbstude; 02-04-2019 at 06:01 AM.

  40. #80
    Silver Hawk Member Studedude's Avatar
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    Apr 2005
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    Perkins, OK, USA.
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    5,108
    Quote Originally Posted by mbstude View Post
    What game?



    51074236_10205808633971728_5411630059628789760_n.jpg
    ...............................

    Dave Lester

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