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  • Electrical: 6 volt power windows...

    Anyone have them? I'm trying to assist a chapter member in installing them in his 55 Speedster (6 volt). He has everything except those 6 wire relays. See schematic here
    http://www.studebaker-info.org/tech/PW/55pw/1955PWs.jpg

    The relays are not available, but the schematic shows a double connect to the field of each motor. This would infer that the armature is a constant 6 volts and the different sides of each motors field is grounded to achieve up/down. Does this sound plausible? If so, an easy fabrication of 2 modern day relays to create the functionality of the old NLA relay. Does anyone have an internal schematic of the Motor?

    Comments?


    thanks
    64 GT Hawk (K7)
    1970 Avanti (R3)

  • #2
    From looking at the diagram I don't believe they are grounding the field through the relay. Rather I believe the field is grounded inside the motor and the relay selects which one of the two field wires receives power when either up or down is selected. The armature terminal would receive power in both directions.
    If the above is true it was one complicated relay.
    Where were the relays originally located; inside the door?
    Yes you could do the same thing with 2 double pole 6 volts relays per window.
    Best to test a motor and see what it takes to make it operate. Ground the motor housing and then power to the armature lead and one of the field leads.

    Comment


    • #3
      I have power windows in my '55 sedan. I've not had to work on them yet, but need to as my left rear door window will work it's way down on it's own when your driving (hitting bumps maybe). I almost think it has power to it all the time, but don't remember for sure.
      Mike S

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      • #4
        I stock these motors N.O.S by part numbers.
        I also have most of the switches and some bezels, both in chrome and gold
        Electric window regulators etc.
        All these are inventoried by part numbers.
        As I have said before , have patience.

        Robert Kapteyn
        815 212 2389

        Comment


        • #5
          I suspect what one would find, analyzing the operation of the relay, is that it feeds current to the armature through the field, and thence to ground. So "up" would be: juice goes in to "Field 1" out of "Field 2" to armature, and through armature to ground. "Down" would be: juice goes in to "Field 2", out of "Field 1" to armature, and through armature to ground.

          Given that the standard way to reverse a series-wound (or shunt wound) motor is to reverse current direction in ONE of either field or armature.
          Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by rkapteyn View Post
            I stock these motors N.O.S by part numbers.
            I also have most of the switches and some bezels, both in chrome and gold
            Electric window regulators etc.
            All these are inventoried by part numbers.
            As I have said before , have patience.

            Robert Kapteyn
            815 212 2389

            Do you have that relay? drawing C-3322 reference# 2320-134 Plate 23-17 page 257, Hard-Top bodies.
            thx
            64 GT Hawk (K7)
            1970 Avanti (R3)

            Comment


            • #7
              Thx Gordr / Rstrasser. Will pass this on. The owner is in Germany. Will have to wait on his decision
              64 GT Hawk (K7)
              1970 Avanti (R3)

              Comment


              • #8
                OK dumb question for the morning on my part. The "relay" shown for the RR door. From what I remember a relay is a switching device controlled by another device or switch allowing a high current to be switched remotely, Looking at the line drawing i see 6 terminals. The center 2 seem a pass through supplying power to the motor windings. Either 2 on the respective ends are also a pass through as the switch supplies a ground for a DC circuit causing the motor to run in one direction or another. The depiction to me looks more like a terminal block that a relay as it seems to have no control line?????? Am I missing something, I'm sure I am so what is it guys.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Well, the diagram shows the relays as "black boxes". It's a "wiring diagram" versus a "schematic". if you want to get pedantic. Now each switch has its common contact grounded, and the up/down wires go to matching terminals on the relay box. The relay box, in turn, has terminals for each of the switch positions, a terminal for "battery", a terminal for "armature" and a pair of terminals for "field". I expect the relay box contains two relays. What would work, and I diagrammed it out on a piece of paper: two DPST relays, one terminal of each relay coil goes to the "bat" terminal, and the other goes to an end of the window switch. One relay, if energized, connects the "top" end of the field winding to "Bat" and the "bottom" end to "Arm". The other relay, if energized, connects the "top" end of the field winding to "Arm", and the "bottom" end to "Bat".

                  Wired this way, it would work. The down side that I see, is that if Dad, driving, tried to put the left rear window down, using the master switch, and Junior, in the back seat, simultaneously tried to put that window up using the door switch, you could have a "smoke escapes now" situation. Maybe that's what the 50 amp breaker is for, LOL. If I were designing that circuit, I would be tempted to put a third relay in that box, to interrupt the ground to the local door switch, if the master switch was used in in any function, thereby making the master over-ride the door switches.

                  In modern cars, this is probably all done with logic signals to the body control module, and the window motor would be a permanent-magnet DC motor, to which you simply reverse the connections to reverse it.
                  Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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