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  • Engine: Rear Oil passage leak

    Hi all,
    first, the good news - the oil leak at the rear of my63 Hawk 289 V8 engine is not the rear seal. Hooray! It is however proving very annoying...........
    There is an oil passage running from centre of block at the rear, turns right to under the 2,4,6,8 head, then turns 90 degrees south down to the oil filter assembly. Where it turns south, on the 90 degree bend there is an inspection hole with a small threaded bung to seal, and this is the source of my leak.
    It is very difficult to access, with space being about 1 1/2 inches between block and firewall, and a RHC steering column just to complicate access even further. Also it is square (about 9/32) instead of a standard nut/bolt hex that would take a standard socket/ring spanner.
    Despite numerous attempts, I cannot shift it, and am coming close to rounding it off. Must be cross - threaded.I have decided there is no way of getting to it unless there is a transmission tunnel inspection panel in a 63? (even then it would be very difficult.)
    I tried covering it with silicon goo, and this failed after 10 minutes or so.
    So I now have 2 problems ! how to clean off silicon sealant ? is there a product that will dissolve this mess? Then, to cover with a quality 2 part epoxy resin putty such as "Knead It"
    This is the final issue to address prior to transport dept. inspection for registration. It leaks enough oil as to run the risk of failing the inspection so must be addressed. Any ideas greatly appreciated! Quentin.

  • #2
    Hello Quentin ,
    There should be a transmission tunnel panel in the Hawk, well atleast my 62 has one .
    Its located at the top of the tunnel near the firewall and allows access to the bellhousing bolts. You obviously need to remove any carpet to get at it.
    I'm surprised you can't get a ring spanner on the bolt, I would have thought that although it has a square head a ring spanner would fit.
    I'm sure it's the same size as the plugs on the head so double check with one of those. They can be buggers to get out at times.
    Sorry I can't offer more help but I will look at mine tomorrow. Good luck

    Comment


    • #3
      I know of no solvent that will readily remove silicone seal. You might try acetone, plus a wire brush. I am trying to visualize just which plug is being described here. Usually, these passage plugs are 1/8" NPT pipe plugs, and never cause trouble. And, yes, they can be a bear to take out. Have you absolutely ruled out a leaking rubber oil gauge line, which is directly above the area under discussion? Much easier fix, if it is the culprit. If it really is leaking from a passage plug, and that plug is also in real tight, the real problem might be that the plug was screwed in too tight, and has cracked the block casting around it. Pipe plugs are tapered, and screwing them, or a fitting, too tightly into the threaded hole can split the female half of the joint.

      I would recommend that you clean the area as well as you can, and then find a video borescope to get a good up-close view of the plug and surrounding metal, and start the engine, and see if you can view where the oil wells out. I sort of doubt that any sort of epoxy would hold under 60 psi oil pressure behind it, mostly because of the difficulty of getting a clean bond. But if you directly view the source of the leak, it can't hurt.
      Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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      • #4
        it is definitely coming from the plug at the rear as I have described. Plug is at the 90 degree bend south to the oil filter. When covered with silicon, the oil could clearly be seen pushing out against the silicon, being of contrasting colours. Silicon held for 10 minutes or so. I have just done some research on flea bay, there are several products to remove sealant. I will try good old spray on paint stripper first, followed by oven cleaner, before I purchase the sdedicated silicon remover. (appear based on sulphuric acid).
        http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SELLEYS-S...UAAOSwKfVXDegA

        Comment


        • #5
          The term sulfuric acid made me nervous so I Googled the MSDS for the Corning silicone solvent. It appears the "solvent" is a solution of hydrocarbon soluble surfactant in hydrocarbon distillate. You might Google hydrocarbon soluble surfactant to see if you can find something available locally.

          Just didn't want to see sulfuric acid being mixed with any number of other things that can go "Burp" and cause injury.

          Bob

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          • #6
            This may be common knowledge, but if you need to cut an access hole, I have a neat trick for an "out of plain sight" location.
            Taught to me by one of my long-gone old time body men.
            Begin cutting your hole with a drill-mounted hole saw.
            Let the hole saw begin to score a circle into the sheet metal, but then before the hole saw breaks through, cant it to one side.
            Most of the saw will break through but leaving a portion of uncut metal which acts like a hinge.
            Pry back the cut center, make your repair, then simply bend the center back into place and smear on a bit something to "seal" the cut.
            If you ever need to go back in again, this "hinge" should allow for a few bendings before it work-hardens and breaks.

            Comment


            • #7
              Just to clarify which passage and plug you are referring to...I braved the heat and went out to the barn to look at the back of an engine I have on a test stand. There are several "oil galley" plugs. This engine, which is a 289 truck engine, has a water jacket block-off plate, which also incorporates the accelerator bell crank on one side. On the other, there are two pipe plugs that tap into the oil galley. Then, just below the distributor, there is another plug next to the bellhousing flange. Which of these are you describing?

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              John Clary
              Greer, SC

              SDC member since 1975

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              • #8
                Many years ago they made square sockets sets, you see them from time-to-time at swap meets. You would need a square 9/32 socket to get at it. With a bit of engineering it may be possible to fabricate one.

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                • #9
                  That's a new one. Nearly every other place on the engine leaks, but never seen a pipe plug leak. It is to be hope the previous builder did not somehow crack the block when screwing it in.

                  jack vines
                  PackardV8

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by PackardV8 View Post
                    That's a new one. Nearly every other place on the engine leaks, but never seen a pipe plug leak. It is to be hope the previous builder did not somehow crack the block when screwing it in.
                    jack vines
                    Yeah Jack, that is an alarming thought. If it is that plug shown on my second pic posted above, cranking down too hard on the taper threaded plug, could crack the narrow webbing in the casting. Believe me, that is not a pleasant experience. I ruined a perfectly good water manifold over tightening a heater fitting pipe. It is one of those situations, where, "just a little bit more"...is WAY TOO MUCH!
                    John Clary
                    Greer, SC

                    SDC member since 1975

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by altair View Post
                      Many years ago they made square sockets sets, you see them from time-to-time at swap meets. You would need a square 9/32 socket to get at it. With a bit of engineering it may be possible to fabricate one.
                      Snap-on and Mack tools has them.

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                      • #12
                        Sears also sells individual 8-point sockets.

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                        • #13
                          Pipe plugs are usually so tight eight-point sockets will just round them off. You really need a square socket.
                          Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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                          • #14
                            [QUOTE=jclary;1003620]Just to clarify which passage and plug you are referring to...I braved the heat and went out to the barn to look at the back of an engine I have on a test stand. There are several "oil galley" plugs. This engine, which is a 289 truck engine, has a water jacket block-off plate, which also incorporates the accelerator bell crank on one side. On the other, there are two pipe plugs that tap into the oil galley. Then, just below the distributor, there is another plug next to the bellhousing flange. Which of these are you describing? QUOTE

                            None of the above, by the looks. Start from the camshaft rear plug in the block, not the head.. There is a round cast oil tube, that runs to the right side of the engine, (right facing forwards). It then turns 90 degrees south. At the turn, there is a threaded bung. it continues on down to end up eventually at the OIL FILTER. Conversely, start from the oil filter, full flow block, and stick your hand around the bak of the engine. A roundish tube will be felt, travelling UP 4 or 5 inches before turning into the centre of the engine at the rear. Get on the passenger side of your LHC vehicle, and shine a torch between the 2,4,6,8 head and the firewall. You will see it at about 2 oclock.
                            As far as sulphuric acid goes, I have purchased the 8% sulphuric acid gel, which slowly dissolves the sealant. 8% solution is pretty mild. (Just ask Sherlock Holmes.) I also found a very skinny wire brush that will fit between engine and firwall to clean this crud off, and be back at square one.
                            I doubt the block is cracked - it is not p(ers)iss(t)ing out, more of a slow ooze that can clearly be seen emanating from the threads of the bung, so no catastrophe. If I run the engine for 40 minutes as I did the other day, there is a puddle the size of a small saucer. Fairly mediocre, but enough to not pass rego.

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                            • #15
                              I once rebuilt a Avanti R2 that had a oil leak from the area you are talking about. Turned out to be leaking out between the head and block and running down the right rear. I used aluminum paint to seal the gasket. I now use copper hi tack.

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