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  • Engine: Timing gear whine

    I just started up my rebuilt 185 with an aluminum timing gear and new crank gear and it appears to be causing a whine. It's quite noticeable and varies with the revs. I noticed it when I first started the engine and seated the rings. On the second start it disappeared. Then on third start it again was absent but after a 10 minute drive it was back.
    Is this to be expected and how long before it goes away?
    I installed a new oil pressure relief kit. The engine pegs the oil pressure gauge when it starts and then settles down to 40-50 lbs when warm and on the road. It gives about 10 lbs when hot and idling.
    A fellow club member also installed an aluminum timing gear in his 259 Cruiser recently and it is also causing a whine.
    Thanks
    Graham
    www.kgworks.ca/studeparts

  • #2
    That's the reason the original gears were Celeron - to make them quiet. The aluminum gear may get somewhat quieter as it wears in, but will probably always make some noise.
    RadioRoy, specializing in AM/FM conversions with auxiliary inputs for iPod/satellite/CD player. In the old car radio business since 1985.

    17A-S2 - 50 Commander convertible
    10G-C1 - 51 Champion starlight coupe
    10G-Q4 - 51 Champion business coupe
    4H-K5 - 53 Commander starliner hardtop
    5H-D5 - 54 Commander Conestoga wagon
    56B-D4 - 56 Commander station wagon
    60V-L6 - 60 Lark convertible

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    • #3
      That whine will confuse a lot of people into thinking you have a supercharger on it. Keep the hood down and just smile at them.
      sigpic1966 Daytona (The First One)
      1950 Champion Convertible
      1950 Champion 4Dr
      1955 President 2 Dr Hardtop
      1957 Thunderbird

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      • #4
        Well...some folks are whiners for no reason at all. At least, you have a reason! Someone will correct me if I'm wrong (and I am...a lot), but I think returning oil lubricates the timing gears on the way back to the oil pan. Your whining being quiet when first cranked and then getting louder is probably just a result of the oil thinning as it warms up. Your pressures sound good as you describe. I wish my truck had that kind of pressure. Mine don't whine, but it sure has its groans, creaks, and other well earned quirks.
        John Clary
        Greer, SC

        SDC member since 1975

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        • #5
          I put an alum gear in a 58 hawk. I had the same experience. Since I have used fibre gears. Good thing is your gear will outlast my fibre gear
          Milt

          1947 Champion (owned since 1967)
          1961 Hawk 4-speed
          1967 Avanti
          1961 Lark 2 door
          1988 Avanti Convertible

          Member of SDC since 1973

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          • #6
            I had the same problem, but after about 2,000 miles, it quieted dramatically. I'd had thought it would seat in much quicker than that.
            Ron Dame
            '63 Champ

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            • #7
              (Making an assumption here...)

              Since this was a fresh rebuild...
              Did the block go through the machine shop 'process'?
              Bore/hone cylinders. Square the deck. Line hone the crankshaft bores.

              If so, did the shop know it was a gear drive camshaft?
              A lot of shops take a few thousandths off the bottom of the main caps, and just set the bore/hone up 'on center', and bore/hone away.
              On a chain driven cam a couple thousandths might not be critical, but on a gear drive, it is.
              If the shop (and the machine operator) knows, the can set the bore/hone up to stay off the top of the bore.

              Good communications between the owner, the machine shop, and the tool operator are paramount...
              HTIH (Hope The Info Helps)

              Jeff


              Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain



              Note: SDC# 070190 (and earlier...)

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              • #8
                Thanks everyone for your feedback. The engine was just bored and deck and head made level. Nothing else. I believe the whine is becoming quieter so I will finish the breaking 500 and see how it does.
                Graham
                www.kgworks.ca/studeparts

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                • #9
                  I am thinking those are repro timing gears. I have an aluminum gear in a cloverleaf 289 in the wife's GT, and my older brother has an aluminum one in a cloverleaf 289 in his 49 Stude pickup. Both are quiet as mice.

                  OTOH, my bro-in-law has a GM 350 motor in his M series Stude pickup. Someone replaced the timing chain with an aluminum gear when they installed a warm cam. It has an annoying whine. If it were mine, the timing chain would go back in it. But he says hot rodders like to hear that whine, because its an indicator of a hotter cam.

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                  • #10
                    I've seen some aluminum timing gears which have a giant steel circlip installed in a groove on the inside of the outer rim. Supposedly, it dampens the whine.

                    jack vines
                    PackardV8

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                    • #11
                      The gears are suppose to be cut to match and sold as a set. If yours came in two different boxes they where not and I think most today are made in China so your looking at any kind of possibility. They should after a few miles cut themselves in and run quieter as time goes on.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by swvalcon View Post
                        The gears are suppose to be cut to match and sold as a set. If yours came in two different boxes they where not and I think most today are made in China so your looking at any kind of possibility. They should after a few miles cut themselves in and run quieter as time goes on.
                        In a perfect world, yes.

                        However, every Stude gear I've bought came as a separate piece, with a separate P/N. Did Stude ever sell a matched pair under one P/N?

                        jack vines
                        PackardV8

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by PackardV8 View Post
                          In a perfect world, yes.

                          However, every Stude gear I've bought came as a separate piece, with a separate P/N. Did Stude ever sell a matched pair under one P/N?

                          jack vines
                          No they are not a matched set!
                          David L

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by swvalcon View Post
                            The gears are suppose to be cut to match and sold as a set. If yours came in two different boxes they where not and I think most today are made in China so your looking at any kind of possibility. They should after a few miles cut themselves in and run quieter as time goes on.
                            Just another GM experienced Guy, that's OK you gotta start somewhere!

                            Matched Sets on Studebaker Gears?
                            Some Crank & Cam Gears are not even made in the SAME Country, let alone Supplier!

                            And if you read Post #9 and 10, both are talking about the Same thing... an Original 1685777 Studebaker/Alcoa Aluminum Cam Gear with the steel ring.
                            Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1200.jpg
Views:	2
Size:	89.9 KB
ID:	1705236 Sorry, NOT for Sale!
                            Last edited by StudeRich; 05-07-2016, 09:24 PM.
                            StudeRich
                            Second Generation Stude Driver,
                            Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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                            • #15
                              Interesting comment.
                              I wonder what the engineering reason was for casting the gear around a steel ring.
                              Could it be for dimensional stability?
                              Or could it be to change the mass to change the harmonic's?
                              Adding steel could change the vibration 'range' where the gear could vibrate/oscillate and 'ring'.
                              (which could sound like a whine with the gear contact changing).


                              Originally posted by StudeRich View Post
                              <snip>

                              And if you read Post #9 and 10, both are talking about the Same thing... an Original 1685777 Studebaker/Alcoa Aluminum Cam Gear with the steel ring.
                              [ATTACH=CONFIG]53862[/ATTACH] Sorry, NOT for Sale!
                              HTIH (Hope The Info Helps)

                              Jeff


                              Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain



                              Note: SDC# 070190 (and earlier...)

                              Comment

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