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Source for NOS or replacement Champion head bolts (cap screws)?

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  • jnormanh
    replied
    Originally posted by TWChamp View Post
    To clean threaded holes I like to use an old bolt and cut 4 slots around the end of the bolt. I use a hack saw or my Dremel with a thin cutoff wheel to cut the slots. This will clean rust and dirt without cutting good original metal away, such as a tap might do.
    I like to use a rifle bore brush (brass). Chuck it in a variable sped drill, shove it in the tapped hole and run it in reverse to "screw" all the old crud up and out of the hole.

    Leave a comment:


  • DWBookout
    replied
    Cap screw source

    I'm a little late to this discussion, which has been well covered; however, thought I add this comment. When restoring my 1950 Champion I sat down one evening with the Chassis Parts Manual and listed every single bolt, nut and screw that was used anywhere that I was going to be working. Then I took that list to a commercial parts warehouse called "Evansville Nut and Bolt", located in Evansville, IN. They supplied everything I needed in the correct and the correct material specification. It was a pleasure to work with all new parts, even though many of the original could have been reused. Evansville is a small city of about 125K so I'd expect to find a similar outlet in most areas.



    Originally posted by Lothar View Post
    They aren't listed in SI's catalogue, at least I can't find them. I couldn't find anything on eBay, either. I find three different part numbers for different length screws (longer screws for battery ground 519141 and spark plug wire bracket 520182), with the main cap screw part # 194459. Anybody out there have a source or a few they can spare?
    I would appreciate any help as I have two Champion engines that I'm planning to re-build. I recognize that I shouldn't need to replace a full set, but I suspect that at least a few could be corroded or overtorqued.

    Thanks!

    Leave a comment:


  • Jeffry Cassel
    replied
    Likely Fred Kahler in Wisconsin would have some. Don't have his contact info with me but he is in the roster.

    Leave a comment:


  • 55 56 PREZ 4D
    replied
    Originally posted by TWChamp View Post
    To clean threaded holes I like to use an old bolt and cut 4 slots around the end of the bolt. I use a hack saw or my Dremel with a thin cutoff wheel to cut the slots. This will clean rust and dirt without cutting good original metal away, such as a tap might do.
    UHH OHH !
    The old tap or chase question.
    Seems no matter what forum you go to it comes up.
    http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...er-tap-237679/
    http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/additio...hread-chasing/
    http://mmb.maverick.to/threads/is-th...ead-tap.28087/
    Here are a few.

    Leave a comment:


  • TWChamp
    replied
    To clean threaded holes I like to use an old bolt and cut 4 slots around the end of the bolt. I use a hack saw or my Dremel with a thin cutoff wheel to cut the slots. This will clean rust and dirt without cutting good original metal away, such as a tap might do.

    Leave a comment:


  • doofus
    replied
    Think you will find a Stude head bolt has a larger head than std 7/16 bolts. Luck Doofus

    Leave a comment:


  • PackardV8
    replied
    theres a couple of the head bolt holes that have been helicoiled ,wondering if I can torque these all the way up to 60#
    Yes, assuming it was correctly installed.

    jack vines

    Leave a comment:


  • Stevenlesser
    replied
    I'm putting on a head onto a 49 170 ( champ) the head bolts look tired ,with some corrosion apparent at the site of the water contact ,previous owner ran water ,and the threads look worn ,some are cracked at the end
    I took them to southern fastner the local industrial supplier and asked him to match me up a set for auto head bolts
    I got heat treated grade 8 bolts that looked identical
    I'm going to run an aluminum head so I got heat treated washers
    theres a couple of the head bolt holes that have been helicoiled ,wondering if I can torque these all the way up to 60#

    Leave a comment:


  • jnormanh
    replied
    Originally posted by Lothar View Post
    7/16" -14 * 2 11/16". Factory torque spec is 46-50 Lb.s for these screws.
    I see you have found a source for the correct cap screws.

    For future reference:


    Recommended tightening torque for grade 8, 7/16-14 is 70 ft-lb dry or 50 ft-lb lubed.

    That would indicate to me that the factory original cap screws are no stronger than grade 8.

    http://www.americanboltcorp.com/tech/techtorque.pdf

    Leave a comment:


  • garyash
    replied
    There are important differences between hex head cap screws and hex head bolts.

    Philosophically, a bolt is designed to pass through two or more parts and is secured by a nut on the end, perhaps with a washer and/or lockwasher. The nut gets turned to tighten the assembly and provide the clamping force, and the nuts have smooth faces. The bolt head is allowed to have die marks on the under side, and a washer face is not usually included. The bolt provides non-precision alignment of the parts. Bolts can have an unthreaded body diameter that is greater than the nominal size and a minimum diameter equal to the thread minimum diameter. So, on a 7/16-14 bolt, the maximum body diameter is 0.452" and the minimum is 0.421". The bolt's head height can be from 0.272" to 0.316".

    A hex head cap screw is usually (but not necessarily) used to pass through one piece and thread into a piece on the other side. That is, it is secured without a nut. To tighten it, the bolt head must be turned. Hence, a smooth washer face with minimal circular runout is provided under the hex head. The washer face also prevents the hex corners from digging into the surface below it so that tightening torque is controlled. The maximum body diameter of a cap screw is the same as the nominal size and the minimum diameter is only slightly smaller. For a 7/16-14 cap screw, the maximum diameter is 7/16"=0.4375" and the minimum is 0.4305". This provides precision alignment of the parts. The cap screw head height is more tightly controlled, as well, so a 7/16-14 cap screw has a height of 0.272"-0.291". In addition, a small radius is provided on cap screws where the washer face transitions to the body diameter to reduce stress where the head and body join.

    Places like Fastenal carry, or can special order for you, cap screws in a wider range of lengths than the big box stores, though you may also find them at "real" auto parts stores.

    If you want to get into how bolts work - or not - take a look at http://www.boltscience.com.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lothar
    replied
    Great Dan, Thanks!

    Leave a comment:


  • dpson
    replied
    Hi John,

    I show all three part numbers; 194459, 519141, 520182, in inventory (NOS).

    Send me a PM and let me know how many of each you need.

    Leave a comment:


  • Lothar
    replied
    Brad
    Thanks for finding the screw length for me. I have a chassis parts book, but I didn't think to look there. Since you gave me that tip, I went ahead and I looked it up myself. The "distributor cables bracket" aka spark plug loom to head bracket screw is 7/16" -14 * 2 11/16". Factory torque spec is 46-50 Lb.s for these screws.
    Since these screws are non-standard lengths (7/16"-14* 2 5/16" and 7/16"- 14* 2 11/16") I would need to cut standard hardware to length... UNLESS other manufacturers (Chrysler, Ford?) used these same size and length bolts. Does anyone know if there is any chance that they might interchange with a more common application?

    Leave a comment:


  • Dan Timberlake
    replied
    On some engineering forums Cap Screw vs bolt gets responses similar to "oil" threads here and elsewhere.

    There is some evidence that, at some level above water cooler conversations, it would not be wrong to say a bolt is a screw that uses a nut, and a screw is a bolt that is installed in a threaded component, like when securing a cylinder head to a block.
    Hence Studebaker's not calling head bolts head bolts, but cap screws.

    Leave a comment:


  • rockne10
    replied
    Originally posted by Lothar View Post
    The service manual tells me to use a 7/16" 14 pitch tap to clean out the holes, but it doesn't give me the specs of the bolts themselves.
    Here's where the Chassis Parts Catalog comes in handy. The '53 catalog says 7/16"-14x2 5/16" for the Champion engine part # 194459. You will need to check the appropriate chassis catalog, not service manual, for your application.

    Leave a comment:

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