Need Advice and/or opinions on stuck valves

[PackardV8]

When a valve is as stuck as you describe, sometimes the hot wrench can free it up. Remove the valve spring and retainer. The shadetree way to do this is to use a 5/8" deep well socket and your brass hammer. Align the socket on the retainer over the valve stem and smack it hard enough to collapse the valve spring. A couple of hits usually cause the valve keepers to pop out of the retainer. With the spring out of the way, apply a propane torch at full power to the base of the valve guide, moving the flame around the circumference. Allow it to cool slightly, spray with solvent, whack valve stem with brass hammer, repeat as necessary.

As you surmise, the professional solution would be to rebuild a pair of heads with new valves, guides, seals and springs. That's a few more bucks, but it would be done for your lifetime.

jack vines

[Mike Van Veghten]

Funny thing after all this..."unsticking" work...either the guide AND or the stem will effectivly be junk..!

If you get the valve to move and the engine to run as is, there will be excessive wear as the corrosion digs at the two metals. The guide being softer, it will be the first to enlarge, causing excessive clearance for oil to leak thru and causing the valve to not seat properly every time it comes to the closed position, causing the seat to pound out of round faster than the rest of the valves, thus leaking.

If you don't plan on driving the car much, it might take a while to be a problem. If you plan on actually driving the car....plan on some cylinder head repairs soon..

Mike

[63 R2 Hawk]

I remember a car guy who saved all of his drained auto trans fluid. When it came time to store the 7 or 8 collector cars he had, he would start them up and slowly pour a qt of ATF into the carb until the engine would choke and die. He claimed he had been doing that for years and never had a stuck valve, rust or a stuck engine and they always started right up again in the spring with some fresh gas... and some smoke. Never tried it, obviously not something you'd do with a catalytic converter equipped car...

[JoeHall]

I would stop trying to unstick that valve, and pull both heads. Then, disassemble each valve, starting with the most stuck one. At a minimum, would install new valve seals, clean the stems, and lap the valves. If planning to keep the vehicle, would probably take both heads to a shop for R&R. While the heads were there, I'd be fooling with the rest of the motor to determine other needs, i.e. while the heads are off is an excellent time to clean the water jackets and install new freeze plugs.

[Farrier1951]

Stuck valve

I would stop trying to unstick that valve, and pull both heads. Then, disassemble each valve, starting with the most stuck one. At a minimum, would install new valve seals, clean the stems, and lap the valves. If planning to keep the vehicle, would probably take both heads to a shop for R&R. While the heads were there, I'd be fooling with the rest of the motor to determine other needs, i.e. while the heads are off is an excellent time to clean the water jackets and install new freeze plugs.

Well I think I am going to go the Joe Hall route. I have the valve spring and retainer off and have been able to deliver some firm blows to the top of the valve stem without success. I do not want to do more harm than good, as I have travelled that road before. I am trying to decide if I should pull the right side head too. Murphy's Law makes me think I should just do it and then at least I will know the upper end is OK Right Joe? . I am still curious if the heads from the 62 Hawk are a direct bolt on to the 63 engine. They appear to be the same from the outside. Since I had heard from a P.O. that he had at one time sleeved a cylinder it makes sense to see what is going on in there right? After all the car was sitting in the woods for a reason...right? Thanks everyone for your input and I will post some pictures as the exploratory surgery progresses. Jim

[StudeRich]

I do think that there is a slight difference, because you should have the latest configuration head Studebaker ever made, the one used on R1 Avantis on the '63. The Casting Number, NOT Part Number is on the center exhaust port 1557570.
The '62 should be different, check it out.

As long as you use them as a Pair there should be no problem, but still check the rocker arms and push rods (Compare) and use whatever year, TOGETHER as a complete Set, as some years do vary and you never know after this many years what you have.

I do have all the parts in stock to overhaul or rebuild the Engine or top end here, down the Road a piece!

[SN-60]

When a valve is as stuck as you describe, sometimes the hot wrench can free it up. Remove the valve spring and retainer. The shadetree way to do this is to use a 5/8" deep well socket and your brass hammer. Align the socket on the retainer over the valve stem and smack it hard enough to collapse the valve spring. A couple of hits usually cause the valve keepers to pop out of the retainer. With the spring out of the way, apply a propane torch at full power to the base of the valve guide, moving the flame around the circumference. Allow it to cool slightly, spray with solvent, whack valve stem with brass hammer, repeat as necessary.

As you surmise, the professional solution would be to rebuild a pair of heads with new valves, guides, seals and springs. That's a few more bucks, but it would be done for your lifetime.

jack vines

The 'shadetree' way probably wont work here Jack, as it sounds to Me like the valve may be stuck in the full open position and the spring is already fully compressed (No where to go). Might have to 'butcher' the valve spring with a die grinder to get it and its retaining parts out of the way, THEN work at moving the valve further down with solvent, hammer, etc. This should work without pulling head, but God knows what the seat looks like!

[PackardV8]

The 'shadetree' way probably wont work here Jack, as it sounds to Me like the valve may be stuck in the full open position and the spring is already fully compressed (No where to go). Might have to 'butcher' the valve spring with a die grinder to get it and its retaining parts out of the way, THEN work at moving the valve further down with solvent, hammer, etc. This should work without pulling head, but God knows what the seat looks like!

Your first assumption may or may not be correct. He hasn't given enough info to determine where the valve is in its travel.

Doesn't matter, because your second assumption is definitely incorrect as the Stude limber neck springs at full lift still have sufficient travel left for the suggested keeper removal method to work. BTDT, so it will work.

jack vines

[Studebakercenteroforegon]

Jim - I have lots of good usable heads of various casting numbers stacked around here. If you don't want to tear into your other engine, just come over and get a couple of heads from me.

[SN-60]

Your first assumption may or may not be correct. He hasn't given enough info to determine where the valve is in its travel.

Doesn't matter, because your second assumption is definitely incorrect as the Stude limber neck springs at full lift still have sufficient travel left for the suggested keeper removal method to work. BTDT, so it will work.

jack vines

Time to put on the safety glasses !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[PlainBrownR2]

After getting the heads the way I wanted them, finding the crack in the intake passage, replacing them with another set of heads, moving and removing the valves and springs from one head to another head, finding a broken valve and stem, followed by finding a bent valve and stem, I've become intimately familiar with the Lisle Spring Compressor we have!

Anyway, like I said, I'm familiar with having a valve stick open. This happened about a year ago or so. This one ended up having its valvestem bend a few thousandths in the middle, rendering it unable to return to its closed position. There was no saving this valve, so I used a small punch and tapped the valve back out, which got a replacement valve put into its place. I understand the need for taking it to the machine shop, grinding some new seats, and having new stems and valves put in, but as money is a limiting factor, a replacement valve from my pile of intake valves worked equally as well.







To get them out isn't hard. The valvespring and its spacer? are held in place with a pair of keepers that fit into a groove on the valve. If the keepers are where they are should be, there shouldn't be any trouble in taking them out with the spring compressor. The Lisle spring compressor that I used, has fingers that slide into the coils on the spring. Once those are properly wedged in and secure, a knob is turned down on the top of the valvestem, until the spring FULLY compresses, and exposes the keepers. At that point, the keepers come out, the spring is slid off of the valvestem along with the spacer, and the valve slides out through the bottom. Do it right, and it goes like cake. Do it wrong, and the fingers may pop loose, a keeper gets dropped in a place its not supposed to go, or you're dealing with a spring that compressed in a very strange position. Easy enough!

[Zenwren]

On my 259 I tried everything for a valve that was stuck open. What eventually worked was grabbing the valve spring retainer with a vice grip and hooking a slide hammer on the vice grip.
Also once it was freed I filled the cylinder with some rope to keep the valve up, removed the spring retainer and worked the valve up and down with some penetrating oil until it moved freely. I also replaced the spring retainer as I had chewed it up a little in my first attempts with the vice grip (grab the spring retainer with just the tip of the jaws, leaving the vice grip in line with the valve as opposed to perpendicular.

[cultural infidel]

Old thread... still good info!

[Mrs K Corbin]

That may work on a flat head 6, probably not on a v8.....
On a V8, i would do the tapping downward thing with plenty of pb blaster, and pull it back up if possible. repeatedly over a couple days...

In doing this job remove the spark plugs (I assume you already have) and assure the cam position with the stuck valve is TDC follow your firing order around. As said in previous, reach in through the sparkplug hole with a drift, brass or hardwood and tap on the edge of the valve until it reseats. Turn the engine over by hand until that valve is pushed up if it stays up repeat the process and relocate TDC. This process could take 1-3 days to complete it is not east but doable, also lubricate the valve stem as required. I have done this on several engines and it is time consuming. Do not over strike the valve as it may cause damage, steady gentle taps. Best of luck Dave