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Pre war brake shoe and hardware

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  • Brakes: Pre war brake shoe and hardware

    I have been working on the brakes of my 1941 Studebaker champion 4 dr sedan for about 3 months now. I found someone to turn the drums and had the brake shoes relined. I have had trouble with them ever since. I have owned the car from 1997 til now. I did not have to do anything to the brakes when I got it so I am new to the prewar technology. The main problem stems from the fact that the shoes keep trying to come off the backing plate.Now after all that I have been though I found what's wrong. There are these little horse shoe clips that hold the shoe on with a washer undernath. The stud that the clip rides on has slots cut on each side the clip just slides into these clips. I have been forcing these clips on this pin any kind of way so mthey have been falling off in to the drum where they have been lodging themselves between the drum and the shoe. If I could have read somewhere just a little about this before I attemped to do my brakes it would have saved me alot of money. I wanted to keep my car as original as possible however these type of episodes will lead a person to change alot of things on a prewar car. Maybe it's me but some how this info should have been on this site somewhere, we know it ain't "new" I think with all these car shows on cable someone needs to do some play by play on old prewar cars.I think I know where my next vinture is going to be.
    Studebakers forever!

  • #2
    I don't understand what you're saying? You don't have a shop manual? You are upset that it isn't online? You're too umm 'frugal' to do it the right way and buy the books and now you're mad at the forum for YOU messing with BRAKES and having problems?
    Bez Auto Alchemy

    "Don't believe every internet quote" Abe Lincoln


    • #3
      I have a number of manuals, What is it you don't understand. The info needed to fix this car is not here, i'm not mad at the forum. I would like someone to post more stuff on prewar cars. What does "frugal have to do with it.Itake you don't have a prewar car or don't know what that is, if it don't concern you stay out of it. You sound confused here,sometimes somewhere else With alot of faces. Your funny
      Studebakers forever!


      • #4
        So you are saying that the Shop Manual text never mentions the direction the clips should go onto the studs to keep them from falling off? If so it seems like a major oversight.

        I would not be surprised that these would be same old part number as the "C" Clips used on the Rear Drum Brakes of Avantis and Disc. Brake Larks and Hawks that holds the aft. shoe E-Brake lever to the shoe. If so they are to be crimped together so they can not come off and then replaced and disposed of.

        I am sorry to hear that. My Cars are all 1954 and on, and I have never found an assembly problem that the Parts Catalogs and Shop Manuals could not solve, they are some of the best in the Industry.
        Second Generation Stude Driver,
        Proud '54 Starliner Owner


        • #5
          The manual is a good idea but it would not help much in this case. It does not have a lot of specfics about changing shoes on the brakes.

          Those clips are not springs. You have to crimp them on with a pair of pliers or something. I have reused mine a couple of times but I am careful taking them off. SI might have replacements if yours are in bad shape. There should be a washer under the clips as well. You can see pictures at Click on any picture to make them bigger.

          Drums for these cars are getting rare. Be careful getting yours turned and don't do it unless you really have to.

          There are not any bolt-on brake upgrades for these cars so if you want modern brakes you will have to put in the time, engineering, and $$$. The learning curve for these cars can be frustrating but my car has become a reliable, fun machine. Fun is the key word. If you are not enjoying it a more modern car might be the best solution.



          • #6
            I was looking to do some brake work on my 1941 Champion & the shop manual for 1941 doesn't have much information. This manual is a reprint-maybe the brake section was omitted somehow? The brake section in the 1941 shop manual is 3 pages & highlites the difference between the commander & champion brakes, relining the brake pads & using the cam to adjust clearances. The brake section in the 1941 manual seems more like a supplement-does the 1940 or 1939 shop manual have a more detailed brake section?


            • #7
              I have been doing brake jobs longer than I want to admit. First thing I learned, do one side at a time so you have a reference (assuming they are correct to start off with) and I have passed that on when I have taught people. If you can’t do one side at a time at very least, take pictures!

              Just looked at one of my MOTOR manuals and it has very detailed diagrams for all makes from 1935 to 1950.
              Last edited by Neal in NM; 09-08-2020, 08:23 PM.


              • #8
                The manual skimps on information that any mechanic would have known in 1940 but a present-day Stude owner might not know. Motors manuals are excellent general references. I have a 1951 Motors manual that has come in handy many times. You can find them online or sometimes you get lucky at a library book sale. I just did the front brakes again on my 41:



                • #9
                  Studelover - you mentioned washer under the clips.....are they spring washers or plain flat washers? I thought I would mention this because previous owners added plain washers to my '39 commander. Go see my posting on my spring washer, I would have to re-read it to understand what I did or go pull a wheel off and see. I believe the '39 commander has the similar brake shoe clips/washers as the '41 champion... nvonda's '41 champion pics overall looks like mine.


                  Shop manuals are great if they have the detail information. The '39 commander shop manual is lacking in a lot of areas. The Motors Manual is better but it still did not show which way the brake washer goes. And the the illustrations in the chassis catalog did not help either.

                  Regarding the clip falling off...... if it is the same horseshoe clip as mine....make sure it and the slot are not too worn for good grip. New clips would be best. You are "crimping" or closing the clip with pliers...right?
                  I mention this because 30-40 years ago when I first saw this style of clip, I was not sure if it just snapped on like a retaining ring or if it was crimped on. It was soft steel so it bent into place easily and became obvious that had to be done....I dont think I ever saw this step in any shop manual(s) of mine.


                  • #10
                    I got a hold of a Motors 1935-1953 manual-unfortunately no information on removing or re-installing the hub...My drivers side rear brake is frozen as it has sat for years with the emergency brake engaged. I'd like to add that there were some roof repairs during that time that were left undone until spring of the following year & it got pretty damp in there for a few weeks from the melting snow... The wheel will spin with some effort if you turn it by hand but drags if a load from the engine is actually placed on it... I think I have a pretty good handle on removing the hub-I got the drum puller from Question is: when re-installing the hub/drum do i torque the castle nut to 170 lbs? Any other considerations besides cleaning the drum off really well before re-installing it?


                    • #11
                      The one important consideration, is to put the hub back on the tapered axle DRY. Any sort of lube will allow it to slip to far and possibly split the hub.