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Hinge Pins- how bad to remove? (57 GH)

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  • Body / Glass: Hinge Pins- how bad to remove? (57 GH)

    Per my other thread (removing hinges/doors) from my '57 Golden Hawk, I need to weld in a new nut on the lower hinge screw. For which, it seems to me, it would be much easier if I had a loose hinge to fit in place with the two GOOD screws, and then tighten the 3rd "loose" screw with it's new nut, allowing me to weld the new nut in place inside the cowl pillar.
    That said, the hinge pins, just from looking at them, sure look like they might be buggers to remove. They turn with the inner part of the hinge, not the outer, so a lot of area to "bust loose", and from experience removing hinge pins on my Model-A Ford, the "hinge pin remover" broke before the pins moved. I ended up having to drill most of them (oh what fun that was!!!)
    So, leery of messing with the hinge pins here.... are they usually stubborn too? need a hinge pin removing tool to avoid flattening the bottom of the pin?
    If so, maybe better off borrowing a "loose" hinge from someone who has one, for the purpose of locating and welding the new nut in place.....
    Suggestions?
    Thanks!

  • #2
    Originally posted by bsrosell View Post
    Per my other thread (removing hinges/doors) from my '57 Golden Hawk, I need to weld in a new nut on the lower hinge screw. For which, it seems to me, it would be much easier if I had a loose hinge to fit in place with the two GOOD screws, and then tighten the 3rd "loose" screw with it's new nut, allowing me to weld the new nut in place inside the cowl pillar.
    That said, the hinge pins, just from looking at them, sure look like they might be buggers to remove. They turn with the inner part of the hinge, not the outer, so a lot of area to "bust loose", and from experience removing hinge pins on my Model-A Ford, the "hinge pin remover" broke before the pins moved. I ended up having to drill most of them (oh what fun that was!!!)
    So, leery of messing with the hinge pins here.... are they usually stubborn too? need a hinge pin removing tool to avoid flattening the bottom of the pin?
    If so, maybe better off borrowing a "loose" hinge from someone who has one, for the purpose of locating and welding the new nut in place.....
    Suggestions?
    Thanks!
    If the upper half turns with the middle portion, you have double the trouble I had with my 54k. The pins had rusted to the middle section and sheared off the top portion while turning in the lower portion of the hinge. I ended up fixturing the hinge in my drill press an drilling out the lower portion of the pin until it was thin enough to break apart, letting the two halves separate. The top portion that was broken pushed out but the middle section was so rusted solid I needed to drill it out also.

    I wish I had better news but short of finding a set of hinges you have some work to do. Although, I'll bet another set might not be to hard to find. Another bit of good news is that slightly larger hinge pins are available if needed.

    Bob

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    • #3
      Hi Bob, I ddin't check them that thoroughly; will have to go back out and do so tomorrow. I just noticed the pin stayed with the upper flange, never checked the bottom, but I think they are all unbroken. There is just a touch of 'slop' in each hinge (I have nothing to compare it to, how much was there when new?) , but I think not enough that I'd to try to remove all of them, and several people have advised "don't remove them from the door!!!!" in order to avoid realignment nightmares, so loathe to take them off the door now to send them anywhere. And, I couldn't notice any up/down slop in the door when I was first checking things out (to see if hinge wear was causing the "misalignmnent' that later proved to be a binding front fender that someone had replaced WITHOUT the fender shim rubber).
      If any of the local St.Paul guys are in the Lake Elmo area and want to wiggle some hinges, would be happy to have you stop by though ! :-)
      Barry
      Last edited by bsrosell; 11-13-2011, 06:44 PM.

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      • #4
        "in order to avoid realignment nightmares"
        Oh so true.
        But the easy way to remove them and maintain the alignment of the door: drill two 1/8" holes in the hinges clear thru the door or the pillar in each side of the hinge. You just made yourself 2 alignment holes. Now remove the hinges at will, and use 1/8 cotter pins or whatever to realign when you bolt them back in
        1947 M5 under restoration
        a bunch of non-Stude stuff

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        • #5
          Originally posted by bsrosell View Post
          Hi Bob, I ddin't check them that thoroughly; will have to go back out and do so tomorrow. I just noticed the pin stayed with the upper flange, never checked the bottom, but I think they are all unbroken. There is just a touch of 'slop' in each hinge (I have nothing to compare it to, how much was there when new?) , but I think not enough that I'd to try to remove all of them, and several people have advised "don't remove them from the door!!!!" in order to avoid realignment nightmares, so loathe to take them off the door now to send them anywhere. And, I couldn't notice any up/down slop in the door when I was first checking things out (to see if hinge wear was causing the "misalignmnent' that later proved to be a binding front fender that someone had replaced WITHOUT the fender shim rubber).
          If any of the local St.Paul guys are in the Lake Elmo area and want to wiggle some hinges, would be happy to have you stop by though ! :-)
          Barry
          Barry

          I read the post as the middle section turned with the pin. As you are well aware from your post, the pin should stay fixed in the upper section with the door swinging on the middle section. If the upper and lower section of the pin don't move than I misread the post and the hinge is working as designed.

          I'll leave the movement issue to more knowledgeable forum members but most doors have very little play, if any, when they leave the factory. How much is too much I can't say. I will suggest that replacing them is not the most fun job but I did it on my 39 Ford and the 54K due to sufficient movement to affect the door closing. Hopefully you don't have enough to cause issues.

          Bob

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          • #6
            There are occasions when even the oversized pins ( which are usually not for a Stude in the first place) are not enough to clean up the slop in the hinge. The hinge has worn the holes to a larger diameter than the oversized pin. This was my case, in both the upper and the lower hinges, and I used a pair of reamers that I had to buy from McMaster Carr, and made up pins to fit. Not the plan I had in mind, but it is what it is.
            '53 Commander
            Art Morrison chassis
            LS6 ASA/4L60E

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            • #7
              Hinge pins, such fun! The last few I've dealt, both Studebakers and the barn door on my Suburban were in so tight that I took the path of least resistance. I got out my die grinder and zip wheel, and made a slice in the hinge itself to free the pin. Once that's done, they come out dead easy. You can then vee out the slit with a grinder, and run a bead of weld with the MIG welder, and good as new. If the holes were ovalled out, you could even squeeze the slit hinge in a vise, and then weld it up, and re-drill the hole to standard size. Do a neat job of welding and grinding, and nobody will ever see it. I haven't even gotten to the welding stage on the Suburban yet, and the hinges are working fine as it is. That metal is really stout. Those are exposed hinges on that vehicle, too.
              Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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              • #8
                great idea !!
                1947 M5 under restoration
                a bunch of non-Stude stuff

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                • #9
                  Bob, I was incorrect in my original description as well as unclear. Didn't look at them close enough and I apologize.
                  I went out and examined all four hinge sets tonight. All four are identical, with pins 'tight' in the upper/lower area, and pins rotating within the center or body of the hinge. So, this is correct I believe.
                  I like your idea of pinning to the doors if I do remove the hinges; and THOSE screws should come out quite easily in comparison, right? no rust (my doors are rust free from top to bottom.....) A lot harder to use the impact wrench on the sheetmetal door without damaging something I would think....

                  Removing them would make it a lot easier to clean in my parts-cleaner too, and really examine to determine if pin removal is necessary/wothwhile or not..... Will have to think about it down the road. Going to concentrate on the body and floors now, keep on track. Body, doors, etc.. come after a get my chassis and engine done, in m plan.
                  If I DID want to replace the pins, where do you get the new pins, Stude Intl? How about oversize? Though mine are tight enough that I'd guess just NEW pins of original size would be enough improvement, if even that is necesssary.
                  One thing that is curious; there seems to be JUST a tad bit more slop in the passenger door, yet both doors/hinges appear to have never been touched. Maybe some guy used the car for a postal delivery car for a few years and used the passenger door more often :-)
                  Originally posted by sweetolbob View Post
                  Barry

                  I read the post as the middle section turned with the pin. As you are well aware from your post, the pin should stay fixed in the upper section with the door swinging on the middle section. If the upper and lower section of the pin don't move than I misread the post and the hinge is working as designed.

                  I'll leave the movement issue to more knowledgeable forum members but most doors have very little play, if any, when they leave the factory. How much is too much I can't say. I will suggest that replacing them is not the most fun job but I did it on my 39 Ford and the 54K due to sufficient movement to affect the door closing. Hopefully you don't have enough to cause issues.

                  Bob
                  Last edited by bsrosell; 11-14-2011, 06:27 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Note: when you take the doors off, don't lose the door checks.
                    '53 Commander
                    Art Morrison chassis
                    LS6 ASA/4L60E

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