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R1 Fuel Pump / Power Steering Pump Clash!

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  • #16
    These are the 2 variants of original R1 pumps. The latest one that you have has a larger body. Did you measure your fan belt yet? You may find that even an original pump will hit, if the belt is wrong....
    Attached Files

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    • #17
      I didn't measure the belt, but I read the number stamped on the belt, and Jon says it is indeed the correct belt and is 37 1/2 inches i.d. He suggested a 38-inch belt would help, but when I lift the power steering pump upward to the furthest extent of its travel on the bracket, still the fuel pump doesn't clear. Thank you very much for those pictures. To clarify your post, are you saying that my fuel pump is larger than either of the two original R1 pumps?

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      • #18
        The bolt with the short shoulder goes on the top hole on the water manifold. The stud with the longer'nut' goes on the third one down ,or the upper of the botttom branch.
        Just thinking out loud. And don't forget the bracket to the exhaust manifold.
        Bez Auto Alchemy
        573-318-8948
        http://bezautoalchemy.com


        "Don't believe every internet quote" Abe Lincoln

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        • #19
          I think I have the p/s pump installed correctly. I will take a few pictures in case anybody sees something obviously wrong.

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          • #20
            Holy cow! Send out the Welcome Wagon!
            James, welcome to the madness! Please snap some pictures of your car so we can see it! Sounds like you are having fun with it. Where are you from? Have you joined the SDC and your local chapter yet?
            Carey
            Packard Hawk

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            • #21
              I would be happy to post pictures, but I do not seem to know how to attach pictures.

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              • #22
                Success!

                Well boys, I got it figured out. My friend the genuine Studebaker mechanic removed the power steering pump, THEN installed the fuel pump, then re-installed the power steering pump, and -- VOILA -- everything fits. There is barely enough room to slide an index card between the two pumps, but it does fit. I took a picture which I should like to post, if only I could figure out how to attach it.

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                • #23
                  I followed this thread with interest when it was current and now I find that I have the same or a similar problem.
                  When I bought the '64 R-1 Avanti last year I noticed that the p/s belt was slipping at low rim and in hard turning. I tried to tighten it, but the top of the pump came up hard against the radiator tank which left the belt loose and made it impossible to get off the pump reservoir lid. I decided someone had put on too long a belt so I finally got around to addressing it. I looked up power steering belts on Bob Johnstone's Resource Site and wrote down all the cross reference numbers. I went to my good guys at CarQuest with the numbers and a used Studebaker belt which says right on the belt Studebaker 1548513. CarQuest had the Gates number, 7380 and it appeared to be identical in length to the original so I bought it. The p/s belt is a PITA to change because it is closest to the engine meaning all other belts have to come off (and I hate trying to tension the a/c belt). When I got the "too long" belt off it turned out to be a Gates 7375 which is shorter than the 7380. How come? To put on a shorter belt than that I'll have to take the pump clear off and feed the belt in the pulley because I can't push the pump down the last half inch or so because it hits the top of the fuel pump. I think the PO put on a new fuel pump that he bought from Jon Myer. I have a couple carcass Carter R engine pumps. I guess I'll have to check them to see if they are different from what is on the car. In the mean time, how much shorter a belt should I get?
                  BTW, I have a NOS Studebaker power steering belt that is shorter and it has the number Studebaker 1547294. I don't find that number in either the '59-'64 Chassis Parts book or the earlier one. On the sleeve it has handwritten Studebaker p/s '59-'64 V8s. ??
                  Last edited by 53k; 06-10-2011, 04:10 PM. Reason: mis-typed Gates number
                  Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia.
                  '64 Daytona Wagonaire, '64 Avanti R-1, Museum R-4 engine, '72 Gravely Model 430 with Onan engine

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                  • #24
                    Interesting. I just had to approach this when installing a new fuel pump on my '64 Daytona sedan with power steering.

                    Phil Harris fixed me up with a surplus 318-MoPar application pump he and Malcomn Berry modified to be an R-engine pump, even though I don't need that capacity. (It's a long, irrelevant story, so I'll spare you...)

                    Anyway, it looks like a pretty big pump physically, but it fit fine and there is no issue with clearing the power steering pump. BP
                    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

                    Ayn Rand:
                    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

                    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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                    • #25
                      The NAPA belts that I have been using have the specific belt length marked on the back of the sleeve. Although the belts are listed by group lengths in 5 or 10 unit increments, the specific belt length allows you to zero in the optimum length for your application (assuming the counter clerk is cooperative and they have a reasonable stock). I'm currently using a pair of belts on my R2 supercharger from NAPA that had identical specific lengths noted on the package and are working perfectly.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by 53k View Post
                        I followed this thread with interest when it was current and now I find that I have the same or a similar problem.
                        When I bought the '64 R-1 Avanti last year I noticed that the p/s belt was slipping at low rim and in hard turning. I tried to tighten it, but the top of the pump came up hard against the radiator tank which left the belt loose and made it impossible to get off the pump reservoir lid. I decided someone had put on too long a belt so I finally got around to addressing it. I looked up power steering belts on Bob Johnstone's Resource Site and wrote down all the cross reference numbers. I went to my good guys at CarQuest with the numbers and a used Studebaker belt which says right on the belt Studebaker 1548513. CarQuest had the Gates number, 7380 and it appeared to be identical in length to the original so I bought it. The p/s belt is a PITA to change because it is closest to the engine meaning all other belts have to come off (and I hate trying to tension the a/c belt). When I got the "too long" belt off it turned out to be a Gates 7375 which is shorter than the 7380. How come? To put on a shorter belt than that I'll have to take the pump clear off and feed the belt in the pulley because I can't push the pump down the last half inch or so because it hits the top of the fuel pump. I think the PO put on a new fuel pump that he bought from Jon Myer. I have a couple carcass Carter R engine pumps. I guess I'll have to check them to see if they are different from what is on the car. In the mean time, how much shorter a belt should I get?
                        BTW, I have a NOS Studebaker power steering belt that is shorter and it has the number Studebaker 1547294. I don't find that number in either the '59-'64 Chassis Parts book or the earlier one. On the sleeve it has handwritten Studebaker p/s '59-'64 V8s. ??
                        Well, I am now in the fully frustrated mode about this situation.
                        I took back the too-long 7380 belt and my guys took it back even with greasy finger prints on the sleeve. A 7380 is 38 5/8 inches long, the belt on the car, a 7375 is 38 1/8 inch, so I asked for a 7374 which is 37 3/4 inches, 3/8 inch shorter than the too-long 7375 belt on the car. They didn't have that, but did have a 7370 which is 37 5/8 inches, one half inch shorter than the too-long belt. So, I try to install it. Too tight to go over the pulleys since the power steering pump is bottomed out on the fuel pump. So, using the braille system I remove the bolts holding the p/s pump and drop it free, put on the belt and try to fasten the pump back in place. Bolt holes won't line up, pump is now held against the fuel pump and won't allow movement toward the studs. No way to pry to try to stretch the belt. So, for now, until I can come up with the RIGHT fuel pump, I'll be putting the too-long belt back on and pulling the pump tight up against the radiator tank all the while cursing myself for selling the Daytona convertible which was a snap to work on and choosing an Avanti which is anything but. I guess I qualify as a slow learner in that this is my eighth Studebaker Avanti.
                        Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia.
                        '64 Daytona Wagonaire, '64 Avanti R-1, Museum R-4 engine, '72 Gravely Model 430 with Onan engine

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                        • #27
                          Paul, I dont know if this is much help or not without pictures. My wife's cell phone camera isnt light enough to see anything so she took some pictures with her 35mm so now I have to finish the roll & get them developed on a cd. The numbers on the belts are from my R-1 crate engine.

                          I did note the part numbers on the belts. These are moulded into the belt, not printed on:
                          Power steering belt 1548317
                          Alternator belt 1557585
                          A/C belt 1694301

                          http://s1220.photobucket.com/albums/...ump2psPump.jpg

                          http://s1220.photobucket.com/albums/...20Engine%20R1/
                          Last edited by Warren Webb; 06-16-2011, 09:41 PM. Reason: added picture
                          59 Lark wagon, now V-8, H.D. auto!
                          60 Lark convertible V-8 auto
                          61 Champ 1/2 ton 4 speed
                          62 Champ 3/4 ton 5 speed o/drive
                          62 Champ 3/4 ton auto
                          62 Daytona convertible V-8 4 speed & 62 Cruiser, auto.
                          63 G.T. Hawk R-2,4 speed
                          63 Avanti (2) R-1 auto
                          64 Zip Van
                          66 Daytona Sport Sedan(327)V-8 4 speed
                          66 Cruiser V-8 auto

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by 53k View Post
                            I guess I qualify as a slow learner in that this is my eighth Studebaker Avanti.
                            Paul,

                            You know my solution to that problem. I'm really enjoying the '78.
                            Jim Bradley
                            Lake Monticello, VA
                            '78 Avanti II
                            sigpic

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                            • #29
                              Tried again to put on the shorter belt, but couldn't do it- gave up and put the slightly too long belt back on (after giving it a shot of belt conditioner). The pictures Warren posted and also sent to me show me that my only solution is to find an original Carter fuel pump which lets the p/s pump drop down about another 1/2 inch. Interestingly, his photo answered one question I hadn't asked. When I took the p/s pump completely loose, a small 90-degree slotted bracket fell out. I couldn't see where it came from. His picture showed that bracket supporting the radiator tank. I guess the nut holding the tank had lost off or was overlooked when something was changed.
                              In the mean time, I have also changed to a set of 215x75x15 tires. Taking a three-mile test drive today showed no problem with the p/s pump so I'm thinking the narrower, taller tires turn more easily that the 225x60x16s. So, I'm done with the problem (for now).
                              Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia.
                              '64 Daytona Wagonaire, '64 Avanti R-1, Museum R-4 engine, '72 Gravely Model 430 with Onan engine

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                I just measured the belt for the power steering on the crate engine. part # 1548317 measured 38 5/16" or 98mm long. Hope this helps Paul.
                                59 Lark wagon, now V-8, H.D. auto!
                                60 Lark convertible V-8 auto
                                61 Champ 1/2 ton 4 speed
                                62 Champ 3/4 ton 5 speed o/drive
                                62 Champ 3/4 ton auto
                                62 Daytona convertible V-8 4 speed & 62 Cruiser, auto.
                                63 G.T. Hawk R-2,4 speed
                                63 Avanti (2) R-1 auto
                                64 Zip Van
                                66 Daytona Sport Sedan(327)V-8 4 speed
                                66 Cruiser V-8 auto

                                Comment

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