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  • 1963 golden hawk rear brake drums

    I met a new studebaker guy today. His brother died and left him a 63 golden hawk. I don't know hawk's well enough to know, but it has a mccullogh supercharger on it.
    He has tried and tried to get the rear brake drums off without success. Can anybody give me any secrets, or is it just hub puller and hammer?

    Steve E

  • #2
    no such thing as a '63 Golden Hawk, GH's were made from 56-58, 57-58 used McC supercharger. '63 you could get a supercharger but that would be a GT Hawk (or "super hawk" if a package car... t lengthy to explain here and irrelevant to your question)

    anyway, to answer your question, it requires a hub puller not a drum puller, hub and drum are not separable because the studs are swaged, you remove the hub from the axle to get to the brakes. search the forum for hub puller, tapered axle, etc. and you should find several threads discussing these and the proper ways of dealing with them. try to get friend to come on over, if he is unfamiliar with Studebakers we can hopefully help him try to avoid a lot of the common newbie mistakes with them

    good luck

    nate
    --
    55 Commander Starlight
    http://members.cox.net/njnagel

    Comment


    • #3
      It's either not a golden hawk or not a 63, but regardless the rear drums aren't fun to get off, I broke the welds on my hub puller trying to get them off ... but a bit of heat , a 6ft pole and a few choice words did the trick for me.

      Comment


      • #4
        Well...there is no such thing as a 1963 Golden Hawk. The last Golden Hawk was 1958. I think you mean Gran Turismo, or GT Hawk? But those were not equipped with McCullogh supercharger as the Golden Hawks were. A GT Super Hawk, as I recall, had a Paxton blower, but those are very (very-very?) rare.

        No matter, because the drums are all the same deal. They are held onto a tapered axle by friction fit and a Woodruff key and secured by a big nut on the axle end. Modern cars use flanged rear axles. These have to be removed with a special tapered axle drum puller. I bought mine from JC Whitney ages ago, but maybe they still sell them. You loosen the center nut, install the puller, and beat the drum off by following the instructions with the puller. All while avoiding destroying the drum, in other words, try not to beat up the drum. It helps to loosen that center nut slightly and put 5-10 miles on the car if it's in driving order, first. Don't use WD-40 or anything, otherwise when you put the drum back on it will slide too far up on the axle and split the hub. I doubt he will ever get them off without the puller.

        Comment


        • #5
          Hi, Steve; sounds like you guys are in for a great adventure with the supercharged 1963 Gran Turismo Hawk, which is what it is if it is what you say.

          1. The rear brake drum removal procedure has been discussed here repeatedly ad nauseum, so please use the search feature and you'll be inundated with threads on that topic.

          2. The only supercharged Golden Hawks were 1957 and 1958 models. If his is a 1963 model and it is supercharged, it is a supercharged Gran Turismo Hawk, not a Golden Hawk.

          3. The supercharger on the car, if so equipped as you say, will not be the 1957/1958 variable-ratio McCulloch unit. Rather, it will be a 1963/1964 fixed-ratio Paxton supercharger, again assuming the car is a 1963 model and has a factory-installed supercharger on it.

          4. If you'll post the car's Serial Number, we can tell you more about it, if it was a factory-supercharged car. The Serial Number is stamped on a stainless-steel plate below the upper hinge on the driver-side door hinge post. The Serial Number will start with 63V, followed by four or five numbers.

          Keep us posted; it may be an unaccounted-for 1963 R2 Hawk! BP


          Hm Hs
          Last edited by BobPalma; 01-03-2011, 04:07 AM. Reason: spelling
          We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

          Ayn Rand:
          "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

          G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

          Comment


          • #6
            thanks Nate

            Comment


            • #7
              thanks Michael

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks Bob, I will get the serial number and find out more.

                Steve

                Comment


                • #9
                  Bob Palma

                  the car's serial number is 63 V 29427. Let me know what that tells me about the car please.

                  thanks

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by stevee View Post
                    Bob Palma

                    the car's serial number is 63 V 29427. Let me know what that tells me about the car please.

                    thanks
                    The car's serial number, 63V29427, tells me you are a very fortunate young man, Steve!

                    That's because the car was built as a full-package 1963 Studebaker Super Hawk! Not only that, but it was built late enough to have been ordered in the rare, exclusive Super Red color, which it was.

                    It is one of only 21 1963 Super Hawks built in that color with Powershift, per the tally from this thread several months ago. See Post #5 herein:

                    http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...ght=super+hawk

                    It also had Powershift floor automatic transmission, and was shipped with supercharged engine Serial Number JTS1598. Wipe off the machined pad on the extreme front of the engine block, on the drivers side of the top of the block, and see if that number is stamped there. Hopefully, it is.

                    That is a rare and desirable 1963 Hawk, arguably the most desirable unless someone prefers a 4-speed. We all hope to hear that it has survived with its original engine and if so, you have scored big time. Congratulations. BP
                    Last edited by BobPalma; 01-13-2011, 12:39 PM. Reason: add link to earlier thread
                    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

                    Ayn Rand:
                    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

                    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      On the rear brakes, there are 2 adjusters on the inside (back of the backing plates) it takes a special 'shock socket' to hold the stud from turning, and an end wrench to break to lock nut loose.

                      Use some Kroil, PB Blaster or something on the adjuster so it does not give you problems.

                      Loosen these, to release any pressure on the brake shoes..... Do not use vise grips, you will need to precisely adjust the brakes after the overhaul. and once more after the first test drive. Adjusters are hard to replace, and about 20 bucks each if one gets damaged.......

                      You will need a drum puller to pull the drums. Lots of people are here to help, you my also want a shop manual, there are BOOKS and CDs you want a 59-64 Book covering ALL models.

                      This FORUM has a SEARCH FUNCTION and you can type " remove rear drums" in the search window at the top of the page, and it will pull up threads on this procedure. You can also search R2 Hawk, and learn more about your car.

                      Good luck with your RARE Hawk!!
                      Last edited by (S); 01-13-2011, 01:01 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        adding on to the last post, if the car in question is a "package car" (congratulations!) it will have front discs, meaning that the rear drums will be different than the ones used on all other 55-64 Studebakers. his advice about the adjusters is correct for what you have. other Studes use a more conventional star wheel and in '63 would have self adjusters - but you don't have that.

                        also make sure the e-brake is releasing and/or that you can rotate the rear wheels freely before you start frustrating yourself. If everything is all froze up you can also remove the brake line and then unbolt the wheel cylinder and let it fall into the drum when all else fails.

                        good luck (and nice find!)

                        nate
                        --
                        55 Commander Starlight
                        http://members.cox.net/njnagel

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I know that (S) knows, but his reply may mislead you. You need a hub puller, not a "drum puller".
                          Gary L.
                          Wappinger, NY

                          SDC member since 1968
                          Studebaker enthusiast much longer

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Bob:

                            thanks so much for the information you posted on the Forum about this 63 Hawk that a neighbor has.

                            to remind you:

                            The car's serial number, 63V29427, tells me you are a very fortunate young man, Steve!

                            That's because the car was built as a full-package 1963 Studebaker Super Hawk! Not only that, but it was built late enough to have been ordered in the rare, exclusive Super Red color, which it was.

                            It is one of only 21 1963 Super Hawks built in that color with Powershift, per the tally from this thread several months ago. See Post #5 herein:

                            http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...ght=super+hawk

                            It also had Powershift floor automatic transmission, and was shipped with supercharged engine Serial Number JTS1598. Wipe off the machined pad on the extreme front of the engine block, on the drivers side of the top of the block, and see if that number is stamped there. Hopefully, it is.

                            That is a rare and desirable 1963 Hawk, arguably the most desirable unless someone prefers a 4-speed. We all hope to hear that it has survived with its original engine and if so, you have scored big time. Congratulations. BP

                            OK, i wish this was my hawk, but I want to help this guy get another stude back on the road, it just gets in your blook when you were born in South Bend!

                            Here is my next question:

                            I am going to his place to help him take the brake drums off. A local club member is letting me borrow his hub puller. I call him to tell him I will be there later today. He says he already got one off (left side), but not the right side. He said it came off easy, but the hub is still on the axle, only the drum came off. Now I am thinking he does not have tapered axles, but when I saw the car, the hubcaps were off, and there was a casltled nut on the end of the axle, so now I don't know what to think.

                            Did late 63's have the non-tapered axles? If they are the flanged axle design, do they still have a nut on the end of the axle?

                            On this left side that he was able to get off, the lugs are all brand new, but he says they are still very tight in the hub. I thought maybe someone separated the jub from the drum some time ago and somehow fixed new lugs in the hub, but make holes in the drum large enough to slide over the new lugs. Is this even possible?

                            I know it would be easier if I went up there and looked at if first, but I thought you might have some advice.

                            The current owner inhereted this car from his brother, who did not do anything to the car but drive it for many years according to Dennis, the current owner. The previous owner was not mechanically inclined, and would have asked Dennis to fix something if it broke.

                            What would you guess we have?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by stevee View Post
                              Here is my next question:

                              I am going to his place to help him take the brake drums off. A local club member is letting me borrow his hub puller. I call him to tell him I will be there later today. He says he already got one off (left side), but not the right side. He said it came off easy, but the hub is still on the axle, only the drum came off. Now I am thinking he does not have tapered axles, but when I saw the car, the hubcaps were off, and there was a casltled nut on the end of the axle, so now I don't know what to think.

                              Did late 63's have the non-tapered axles? If they are the flanged axle design, do they still have a nut on the end of the axle?

                              On this left side that he was able to get off, the lugs are all brand new, but he says they are still very tight in the hub. I thought maybe someone separated the jub from the drum some time ago and somehow fixed new lugs in the hub, but make holes in the drum large enough to slide over the new lugs. Is this even possible?

                              I know it would be easier if I went up there and looked at if first, but I thought you might have some advice.

                              The current owner inhereted this car from his brother, who did not do anything to the car but drive it for many years according to Dennis, the current owner. The previous owner was not mechanically inclined, and would have asked Dennis to fix something if it broke.

                              What would you guess we have?
                              I don't believe that the flanged axles were available in '63.

                              If there is a castellated nut, you have tapered axles.

                              My guess is that what happened is that the one brake drum was replaced without the lugs being swaged. From the factory, the drum should have been held to the hub by the lug studs being swaged. To separate the two the swages would have had to have been cut, or the lugs cut off and ground down. the fact that the lugs are new suggests that this was done and then the lugs replaced. Whether or not this will cause an issue in practice I don't know. How tightly do the holes in the drum fit over the new lugs? If there is no perceptible movement you may be OK although it's not "correct."

                              When you go see the car, look at the right side's lugs, close to the drum. You'll see what I mean re: swaging.

                              If you are pulling the axles to grease the bearings (note: the axle bearings on a Stude are NOT lubed by the diff's gear oil! They do require periodic greasing), it may still be easier to remove the hub before pulling the axle. I don't know, I've never worked on a tapered-axle Stude that had the drums removable from the hubs. It does seem like a good idea from a serviceability standpoint, but it is not how the factory did it.

                              You will definitely need to remove the hub if the outer grease seal requires replacement.

                              nate
                              --
                              55 Commander Starlight
                              http://members.cox.net/njnagel

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