Announcement

Collapse

Get more Tips, Specs and Technical Data!

Did you know... this Forum is a service of the Studebaker Drivers Club? For more technical tips, specifications, history and tech data, visit the Tech Tips page at the SDC Homepage: www.studebakerdriversclub.com/tips.asp
See more
See less

51 Champ Business Coupe drive train changeover

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • 51 Champ Business Coupe drive train changeover

    I want to change out the small Champ six , 3 spd OD and stock rear end
    to a Stude 289 V8 , 4 speed and TT rear end ....

    Has anyone done this update ? what am I faced with?

    I know 350 Bow Ties and 289Blue Ovals are done all the time ..
    but I want to keep it all Stude.. with some teeth ...

    (and I will make sure the orginal Champ drive train goes to a deserving SDC member .. it's a good engine , trans and rear end )

    any and all help is appreciated --- I am located in El Dorado Hills CA .. I want this to look factory ...

    and if someone has built 289 Stude for sale give me a shout ... my engine builder is freaking out .. build a Stude!! he's scared.... but I promised I would not "out " him if he built me one

    my email is cruzerdog@mac.com

    John

  • #2
    John - Get in touch with David Carter in San Jose. Sorry, I don't have his email or phone number but maybe he's lurking. David made a similar conversion.

    Comment


    • #3
      You might want to get in touch with Jim Turner.
      Although the year and model is not the same, he did an all Stude 289 update to his convertible that is to die for. Right down to the stock air cleaner hiding a new AFB carb....
      He can share the do's and dont's with you.
      Jeff[8D]



      quote:Originally posted by Starlite51

      I want to change out the small Champ six , 3 spd OD and stock rear end
      to a Stude 289 V8 , 4 speed and TT rear end ....

      Has anyone done this update ? what am I faced with?

      I know 350 Bow Ties and 289Blue Ovals are done all the time ..
      but I want to keep it all Stude.. with some teeth ...

      (and I will make sure the orginal Champ drive train goes to a deserving SDC member .. it's a good engine , trans and rear end )

      any and all help is appreciated --- I am located in El Dorado Hills CA .. I want this to look factory ...

      and if someone has built 289 Stude for sale give me a shout ... my engine builder is freaking out .. build a Stude!! he's scared.... but I promised I would not "out " him if he built me one

      my email is cruzerdog@mac.com

      John
      HTIH (Hope The Info Helps)

      Jeff


      Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain



      Note: SDC# 070190 (and earlier...)

      Comment


      • #4
        Well, since the V8 debuted in '51 and shared the same basic frame and sheet metal as the Champion models, the engine fit is a piece of cake. Of course, there'll be some mod work to make that 4-spd and related pieces work where they'd never been. But that's certainly do-able[^]

        There was an R2-powered 51 Biz Cpe that used to show at all the Los Angeles area shows for years. I've not seen or heard of it for some time now.

        As has been mentioned, David Carter did a Biz coupe with a V8 only his turned the wheels thru a T-86 OD tranny. David wanted power AND economy from the OD option.

        Miscreant at large.

        1957 Transtar 1/2ton
        1960 Larkvertible V8
        1958 Provincial wagon
        1953 Commander coupe
        1957 President 2-dr
        1955 President State
        1951 Champion Biz cpe
        1963 Daytona project FS
        No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

        Comment


        • #5
          thanks for the leads .. I will follow up on them..
          also does anyone know the width of a TT rear end from hub to hub?

          I am thinking it might be wider than my stock 51 rear end .. which means I would have to narrow it -- (if my memory serves me right they used the same frame 53 till the end ..
          and my 51 was narrower than the 53 )

          John

          El Dorado Hills CA
          John
          Folsom CA


          "Lone Dog ... No Woof"

          www.cruisinnews.com

          www.SacramentoSwapMeet.com

          Comment


          • #6
            quote:Originally posted by Starlite51

            thanks for the leads .. I will follow up on them..
            also does anyone know the width of a TT rear end from hub to hub?

            I am thinking it might be wider than my stock 51 rear end .. which means I would have to narrow it -- (if my memory serves me right they used the same frame 53 till the end ..
            and my 51 was narrower than the 53 )

            John

            El Dorado Hills CA
            IIRC, David used a later Dana 44 in his biz coupe. It was wider than the stock one, but the relatively stock wheels and tires still fit and actully looked better than stock...not "tucked" as much under the car.

            BTW, David's email address is...

            dcat917 at sbcglobal dot net



            Dick Steinkamp
            Bellingham, WA

            Comment


            • #7
              Dick

              thanks -- that email address is now dead ... I guess we need to call the Studebaker Police

              Studebakers West, Redwood City said that I could use the TT center and my '51 axles and it would fit and keep the stock width -- but advised me to get new HD front springs
              and ... Carl has made new HD leaf springs for the rear in the past ...

              seems everything else fits rather nicely ---

              I will add frt disc brakes and 12 volt system... and of course vintage air ... 103 in Sacramento and 117 in Redding this past week

              should look fairly stock but with a nice Stude 289 growl

              John
              John
              Folsom CA


              "Lone Dog ... No Woof"

              www.cruisinnews.com

              www.SacramentoSwapMeet.com

              Comment


              • #8
                I know David was planning on moving to Florida soon. His folks live there and he was gonna go help them in their advancing years.

                Miscreant at large.

                1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                1960 Larkvertible V8
                1958 Provincial wagon
                1953 Commander coupe
                1957 President 2-dr
                1955 President State
                1951 Champion Biz cpe
                1963 Daytona project FS
                No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Did a '51 Champion use a 44 rear end? that is what you'll want to have; also will want to use the later model 56-up finned brakes front and rear no doubt. This will require 5 lug wheels - I can't remember if a '51 used 4-lug wheels or only '50. If the rear end is other than a 44, I would try to find a 44 from a '51 Commander and proceed as Studebakers West suggested.

                  good luck

                  nate

                  --
                  55 Commander Starlight
                  62 Daytona hardtop
                  http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel
                  --
                  55 Commander Starlight
                  http://members.cox.net/njnagel

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    '51 Had 5-Lug Wheels

                    Studebaker Fever
                    60 Lark
                    51 Champion
                    Phil

                    Studebaker Fever
                    60 Lark
                    56 Power Hawk
                    Phil Hendrickson
                    Arnold, Missouri

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Plus what Mr. B. added about David Carter's 51 BC was that
                      besides power and OD...he wanted A/C for those Florida days,
                      if he headed that way. Last contact that I had was Oct 05.
                      He was still at his San Jose,CA location and the sbcglobal
                      dot net email.

                      Glen Brose
                      53 Champion 2 dr Sedan

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I'm not sure if the 51-2 rear WAS a 44 but it did use the same GEARSETS as later 44s so I'm assuming it was equal to a 44 even if it wasn't designated as such The carrier's the same too. The differences were the housing and the axle shafts. Maybe Dwain or BP can elaborate. If they don't, I'll use my fancy new TW index to look it up later.

                        Miscreant at large.

                        1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                        1960 Larkvertible V8
                        1958 Provincial wagon
                        1953 Commander coupe
                        1957 President 2-dr
                        1955 President State
                        1951 Champion Biz cpe
                        1963 Daytona project FS
                        No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Nate,
                          I thought the finned drums came in 63 and the larger drums prior to that were not finned and not self-adjusting.[?]

                          For appearance sake, can the self-adjusting brakes be installed inside the non-finned drums?
                          "All attempts to 'rise above the issue' are simply an excuse to avoid it profitably." --Dick Gregory

                          Brad Johnson, SDC since 1975, ASC since 1990
                          Pine Grove Mills, Pa.
                          sigpic'33 Rockne 10, '51 Commander Starlight, '53 Commander Starlight "Désirée"

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            all brakes from 56-up are basically the same. '55 is similar but used a different hub that took different bearings and seals. The finned drums were introduced on "President" (including Golden Hawk) models in '56 while the smooth drums continued on the other models. The backing plates, shoes, etc. were all the same and the only difference between self adjusting and non self adjusting is in the lower spring, star wheel assembly, and obviously the addition of the actual adjuster hardware itself.

                            I'm talking only about V-8 brakes here, the six brakes were smaller, but similar in design. Actually the rear shoes from a V-8 and the front shoes for a six are the same.

                            nate

                            --
                            55 Commander Starlight
                            62 Daytona hardtop
                            http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel
                            --
                            55 Commander Starlight
                            http://members.cox.net/njnagel

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              thanks everyone --- you guys are saving me a lot of trial and error stuff... can't say enough good things about this forum and SDC

                              I got hooked up with Ken Pyle in Three Rivers thru this forum ..I am planning on turning the entire project over to him to build and install everything at his shop .. he is a walking " Studebaker manual"

                              I am now looking for a good core - a 289 full flow to take to Ken and have him build it ...

                              I am not going all out in the horsepower dept ..been that route ... old age has cured me of having monster engines [B)]

                              John






                              El Dorado Hills CA
                              John
                              Folsom CA


                              "Lone Dog ... No Woof"

                              www.cruisinnews.com

                              www.SacramentoSwapMeet.com

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X