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259 in a GT ??

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  • 259 in a GT ??


    The 289 in my 63 GT is toast ! I'm not a novice & could see where it needs everything totaling about $3-4000 spent to rescue it.The question being; I have a chance to get a crate 259 a lot cheaper.Did the GT's ever have a 259 ? I've seen one with a 6cyl.documented engine
    I believe it was built for export.Would it be a grevious sin to use the 259 or were they not available for GT's ?
    I'm just a poor pensioner so $$$ is a factor,either that or I go the "belly button" route unless I can find a good used 289 close to home which is Hamilton Ontario Canada----This car is the worst Studebaker I have ever owned in regards to every-thing needed 2=B overhauled.Im in too deep to give up now so I have to keep throwing $$$ at it.It's a California black plate car so the body is good but that's about the only thing !!

  • #2
    I'd say go for it. No GT's that I know of came with a 259, but who cares! A Stude engine is a Stude engine. And as long as they're being driven, it doesn't really matter (to me, anyways)! I wouldn't get all over you because you had a 259 or think less of your car. Hey, just restamp the #'s. The 259's 'wind up' quicker than the 289's, so if I had a choise, my Lark would be a 259 with an OD tranny. Hawks with 289's are nice, but it doesn't really matter, unless this is going to be a show-only car. 259's sound just as good as a 289 and you can still 'hop them up'.
    There were a few 6 cylinder models, but they all went oversees, although a few have made it back over here. There was one in North Carolina a while back.

    Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
    South Georgia Chapter Newsletter Editor
    63 Daytona HT (project)
    51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
    52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g&gt
    MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
    Click my name and check out "Links".

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    • #3
      The sixes did not all go for export, a few were sold here by a South Bend dealer for one.

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      JDP Maryland

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      • #4
        Kim Kidwell in Deltaville, Va. has a '63 GT with the OHV six and 3 on the tree. He just finished up a Golden Hawk so I think the GT may be for sale.

        Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

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        • #5
          Hmm, learn sumthin' every day! Who woulda thought...

          Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
          South Georgia Chapter Newsletter Editor
          63 Daytona HT (project)
          51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
          52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g&gt
          MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
          Click my name and check out "Links".

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          • #6
            quote:Originally posted by kmul221


            The 289 in my 63 GT is toast ! I'm not a novice & could see where it needs everything totaling about $3-4000 spent to rescue it.The question being; I have a chance to get a crate 259 a lot cheaper.Did the GT's ever have a 259 ? I've seen one with a 6cyl.documented engine
            I believe it was built for export.Would it be a grevious sin to use the 259 or were they not available for GT's ?
            I'm just a poor pensioner so $$$ is a factor,either that or I go the "belly button" route unless I can find a good used 289 close to home which is Hamilton Ontario Canada----This car is the worst Studebaker I have ever owned in regards to every-thing needed 2=B overhauled.Im in too deep to give up now so I have to keep throwing $$$ at it.It's a California black plate car so the body is good but that's about the only thing !!
            If you know that you will be getting a good 259 at a good price, go right ahead and do it. The one thing that worries me a bit is: what is the history of that "crate" 259? In the hotrod world, a crate motor is usually taken to be a brand new product, or at least a brand new rebuild shipped by a company that does a national business. If this "crate" motor comes from a reputable Studebaker vendor, I'm sure it's safe to use it. OTOH, if the "crate motor" is something that was purportedly New Old Stock, or an older rebuild, never installed, you may have issues with dried and shrunken seals or gaskets, and cylinders and bearings may have developed rust due to the assembly lube having dried out.

            One of our SDC members recently sold a New Old Stock R3 engine that he had on loan to the Studebaker National Museum for years. That engine is to be torn down and minutely inspected before it gets fired. I'd recommend that as good practice for anybody who plans to put a long-stored "new" engine into service. It would be truly heartbreaking to go to all the trouble of installing the new engine, only to have it screech to a stop with a spun bearing after running a few minutes.

            Barring that caveat, a 259 versus a 289 would do little to diminish the value of any GT Hawk, excepting a "package car." At least, that's my opinion. Most onlookers would never spot the difference. Either engine has completely adequate power for normal driving and highway cruising.

            Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands
            Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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            • #7
              yep go for the 259 after all the 289 was just bored out from the 259

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              • #8
                quote:Originally posted by pete

                yep go for the 259 after all the 289 was just bored out from the 259
                Actually, a 289 is a STROKED 259...they both share the same 3 9/16" bore. A 259 has a 3 1/4" stroke and a 289 has a 3 5/8" stroke.



                Dick Steinkamp
                Bellingham, WA

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                • #9
                  BTW, I've seen worse. There was once a 57 Golden Hawk with a 259. Not that's just wrong. But a GT Hawk, not so much...

                  Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
                  South Georgia Chapter Newsletter Editor
                  63 Daytona HT (project)
                  51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
                  52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g&gt
                  MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
                  Click my name and check out "Links".

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                  • #10
                    Some 1962-1964 Gran Turismo Hawks were built with 259 ci engines. All years of Hawks had some made with 259s and in the case of 1959 Hawks, all V-8s were 259s.

                    Gary L.
                    1954 Commander Starliner (restomod)
                    1959 DeLuxe pickup (restomod)
                    Gary L.
                    Wappinger, NY

                    SDC member since 1968
                    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

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                    • #11
                      I've even seen a few 59's wih factory 289's. I guess if you slipped the dealer a little extra $$$ you might could have gotten a 289... I have seen 59 trucks with 289's too.

                      Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
                      South Georgia Chapter Newsletter Editor
                      63 Daytona HT (project)
                      51 2R16 dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
                      52 Commander Starliner (basket case)(will trade for another Stude <g&gt
                      MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars.
                      Click my name and check out "Links".

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        quote:Originally posted by mbstude

                        I've even seen a few 59's wih factory 289's. I guess if you slipped the dealer a little extra $$$ you might could have gotten a 289... I have seen 59 trucks with 289's too.

                        Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
                        I think that I would have to see a factory build sheet to be convinced that a 1959 car had a 289 originally installed in it. You say that you have seen a few. Were any of them documented and if so, how? 289 V8s in '59 trucks is a different story. That was offered by Studebaker. That is what made it so easy to re-introduce the 289 into the Hawk in 1960.

                        Gary L.
                        1954 Commander Starliner (restomod)
                        1959 DeLuxe pickup (restomod)
                        Gary L.
                        Wappinger, NY

                        SDC member since 1968
                        Studebaker enthusiast much longer

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                        • #13
                          Fred Fox's article March '06 Turning Wheels indicates 289 was available in Police Pursuit Marshals in 1957 (at least two were produced) and in 1958 Marshals; none in 1959 and available again in mid 1960. But the Marshals were not sold to the public. As Gary indicated, the 289 was available in 1959 Trucks.
                          "All attempts to 'rise above the issue' are simply an excuse to avoid it profitably." --Dick Gregory

                          Brad Johnson, SDC since 1975, ASC since 1990
                          Pine Grove Mills, Pa.
                          sigpic'33 Rockne 10, '51 Commander Starlight, '53 Commander Starlight "Désirée"

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                          • #14
                            FWIW, our Studes are getting old and so are our memories. GTs have been through so many owners now, I've seen everything including the McKinnon 283" 'Studebaker V8' represented as 'came that way from the factory' I'd want to see the documentation on GT Hawks being factory delivered in the US with 259" engines.

                            One other minor point of contention which perennially comes up in V8 discussions - The 259" will not "wind up quicker" than a 289" in the same car with the same gearing. The 289" in equal OEM condition and equipment makes 20 to 30 more horsepower and lb/ft of torque and thus will always be slightly quicker and faster than an equivalent 259". There is no replacement for displacement.

                            Subjectively, the 259", with its 3.25" stroke, may feel smoother because it has a lower piston speed and thus a greater theoretical maximum rpm than the 3.625" stroke 289". The 1955 224" V8 has a 2.8125" stroke and thus feels smoother than either the 259" or the 289", but as the Brits would say, it is a "buzzing little anvil" and makes no real horsepower as it smoothly winds up. In any of the five Studebaker V8 engine displacements, the valves float long before theoretical maximum piston speed is reached.

                            thnx, jv.
                            PackardV8

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                            • #15
                              Jack, have you ever driven a 224 for any amount of time?[:I]

                              Miscreant at large.

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