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Transmission... Flight-o-matic? Powershift?

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  • Transmission... Flight-o-matic? Powershift?

    Is Flight-o-matic and Powershift two different transmsions? Or is Powershift just an expression for Flight-o-matic?
    My tranny is marked AS2-10F (by Warner gear div. Muncie). The shift pattern is PRND21.
    What tranny is it and what is the correct lubrication?
    What Stud model has this tranny as standard?

    It is installed in my 1967 Excalibur which used the Daytona chassis as a basis.

    Jan Tore
    Norway, Europe

  • #2
    IF it's a PowerShift, it would be a floor shifter. A Flight o Matic would be on the column. The Flight o Matic pattern is PNDLR. Yours must be the PowerShift. There basically the same tranny.

    Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
    South Georgia Chapter
    63 Daytona HT (project)
    51 Stude dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
    52 Commander Starliner (basket case)

    MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars
    http://community.webshots.com/user/mbstude101
    And here: http://community.webshots.com/user/mbstudepagetwo
    And here too: http://photos.yahoo.com/ph//my_photos

    Comment


    • #3
      That shift pattern says Powershift. A standard Flight-o-matic would have a PNDLR pattern.

      The Powershift is really just a heavy duty Flight-o-matic with different valving to achieve the manual gear selection range.

      Miscreant at large.

      1957 Transtar 1/2ton
      1960 Larkvertible V8
      1958 Provincial wagon
      1953 Commander coupe
      1957 President 2-dr
      1955 President State
      1951 Champion Biz cpe
      1963 Daytona project FS
      No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

      Comment


      • #4
        Mr. Biggs, where can one see pictures of your collection?

        Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
        South Georgia Chapter
        63 Daytona HT (project)
        51 Stude dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
        52 Commander Starliner (basket case)

        MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars
        http://community.webshots.com/user/mbstude101
        And here: http://community.webshots.com/user/mbstudepagetwo
        And here too: http://photos.yahoo.com/ph//my_photos

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks for your replies...
          But what is the correct lubrication for the Powershift? Dexron III???
          And what Stud model(s) has this tranny as standard?

          Comment


          • #6
            Either Dexron or Type F should work; Type F will give firmer shifts. It wasn't installed "standard" on anything but the Avanti (well, a 3-speed stick was standard, but the Powershift was the standard automatic,) but was available in all models. I want to say that any "package car" ordered with an automatic got a Powershift, but I can't say that with 100% certainty.

            nate

            --
            55 Commander Starlight
            62 Daytona hardtop
            http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel
            --
            55 Commander Starlight
            http://members.cox.net/njnagel

            Comment


            • #7
              N8, I think some of them got a HD FOM with a column shift lever.

              Matthew, someday I'll put up some photos.

              Miscreant at large.

              1957 Transtar 1/2ton
              1960 Larkvertible V8
              1958 Provincial wagon
              1953 Commander coupe
              1957 President 2-dr
              1955 President State
              1951 Champion Biz cpe
              1963 Daytona project FS
              No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

              Comment


              • #8
                quote:Originally posted by Mr.Biggs

                N8, I think some of them got a HD FOM with a column shift lever.

                Matthew, someday I'll put up some photos.
                Here's some interesting Stude Automatic trivia...

                In 1963. 3 automatics were offered for the GT Hawks. The FOM (with the standard engines) was a $209.50 option. The HD FOM (with non package R1 and R2 engines) was $229.78. The Power Shift (available all models...floor shift) was $219.50. Closer in price than I would have guessed.

                Matthew,
                Here's my favorite picture of Mr. Biggs' Provincial. Taken while it was still in my custody. Mr. Biggs has done some very nice work to it in the last year or so.



                Dick Steinkamp
                Bellingham, WA

                Comment


                • #9
                  Cool ride! A friend of mine has a totally original, unrestored 57 Prez wagon that has about every option there is. AC, power windows and seats, and lots more. I like that look with the long board. I know another guy that has a 59 Lark wagon with a surf board in the back...

                  Matthew Burnette, the 16 year old Stude nut.
                  South Georgia Chapter
                  63 Daytona HT (project)
                  51 Stude dump truck (yes, I won the raffle)
                  52 Commander Starliner (basket case)

                  MANY more Studes in the family and a few parts cars
                  http://community.webshots.com/user/mbstude101
                  And here: http://community.webshots.com/user/mbstudepagetwo
                  And here too: http://photos.yahoo.com/ph//my_photos

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    As far as I can remember,(sometimes that's not very far[xx(]) I don't think the Power Shift was ever "factory" available with a bench seat. In those cars the HD-FOM (column shift) was the only AT offered. Bob, (Mr. Biggs) I still have that DSO 63 Cruiser R-1, (now the 3rd oldest listed in the JT roster) and yes it's STILL under re-construction. I believe this car was once in your possession??? FYI, I used to do the service work on that car when it was almost new. It's owner then used it to terrorize teenagers on our favorite incompleted strech of I-285 Oh those were the days!!!
                    Dan

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Just for clarification, the early "R" powered Larks, and mabe some Hawks, did NOT come standard with the HD-FOM, but the FOM. In a short time, due to failures of the std. FOM under hard usage, they were recalled by the factory and "up-dated" with the HD-FOM w/ appropriate torque convertor, including a new radiator (w/cooler) and related hardware. My R-1 Cruiser mentioned in the earlier thread had this done.
                      More clarification...this info pretains to the non-package cars.
                      Dan

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        WOW! Dan. I didn't remember what had happened with that Cruiser! That's SO COOL to think that it still survives[8D]
                        When I first saw that car, it was in a basment garage, out east of Atlanta. I hauled it to the shop using Jim Loftin's truck and the shop's trailer.
                        Once at the shop, it fired right up with some minor tinkering. I was SOOOO anxious to test drive it that I nearly put it into someone's front yard on our street.[:0] I figgered I could drive that snarling R1 OK with just one brake working.[] Luckily, the car handled better than my judgement![}]
                        I wanna say I gave $150 for that thing but I really can't be sure after almost 30 years.[:I]

                        Miscreant at large.

                        1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                        1960 Larkvertible V8
                        1958 Provincial wagon
                        1953 Commander coupe
                        1957 President 2-dr
                        1955 President State
                        1951 Champion Biz cpe
                        1963 Daytona project FS
                        No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          FOM or HD-FOM...vs GM 400 or 700R...??

                          I need to switch from a standard transmission to an automatic in my '64 Daytona..(factory 225 hp 289)

                          I would appreciate some feed back on the pros and cons of the costs involved for each, performance expectations, and the benefits of keeping, or not keeping the car all Studebaker...

                          Thanks

                          Barry
                          Barry Leppan
                          Ontario, Canada
                          64 Daytona R-1 Convertible & 64 GT Hawk R-1
                          GT Hawk Registry & SDC, Hamilton Chapter [IMG]

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Well, either FOM is one brute of a tranny. Unless you plan on towing with that Daytona, the HD unit isn't warranted, in my opinion.(nor in the opinion of John Metzker - FOM technical advisor to SDC.)

                            I keep recalling Ted's (Ted Harbit) testimony as to the FOM's hardiness. He's told me that he raced an FOM in the Chicken Hawk for TWELVE YEARS and never busted it!!! He only changed it out for a GM T/H tranny because other (Brand X) racers told him that the increased power of the turbo he was installing would rip up the FOM. Consequently he DID do the conversion and destroyed two "built" Turbo-Hydro trannies in short order. Finally, he DID get one that's held together - so far.[}]

                            A good FOM and all that's required (stock parts) to convert to an automatic - figure a grand or $1200 bucks. A GM 200R4 or 700R4 (either works well and the overdrive gear IS worthy of consideration with 3 buck a gallon gasoline nowdays!) will cost you over 2 grand by the time you get the adaptor, the trannie and convertor, the shifter setup or mod and the changed rear motor mount and driveshaft.[:I]

                            Miscreant at large.

                            1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                            1960 Larkvertible V8
                            1958 Provincial wagon
                            1953 Commander coupe
                            1957 President 2-dr
                            1955 President State
                            1951 Champion Biz cpe
                            1963 Daytona project FS
                            No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The easiest and cheapest thing to do would be to put the FOM in. Just be sure it is in good shape when you put it in.

                              I am running a GM 400 in my '51 drag car but would never change from the FOM to a GM 350 or 400 for a street car. The ONLY thing you gain is first gear start and you can put a first gear start valve body in if that's that important to you.

                              I would consider putting a 200 or 700 in for the low gear, overdrive and lockup converter though. You can use something like a 3.73 rear and have good take off power and yet cruise the highway with very reasonable rpm's. You will need an adapter kit which will run $300 to $400 plus the transmission, converter, shifter, drive shaft and rear mount modifications, etc.

                              Don't let anyone tell you the FOM is a weak transmission. They used this same basic type transmission in the '64 Ford 427 Thunderbolts before they had the C6. I ran the Powershift several years with no problem and when I put a GM 350 in, it was junk within three weeks. I think the 400 is probably stronger than the Powershift but I've torn three of those up but have more HP now than when I was running the Powershift.

                              Ted
                              ******************************************************************
                              quote:Originally posted by studee64

                              FOM or HD-FOM...vs GM 400 or 700R...??

                              I need to switch from a standard transmission to an automatic in my '64 Daytona..(factory 225 hp 289)

                              I would appreciate some feed back on the pros and cons of the costs involved for each, performance expectations, and the benefits of keeping, or not keeping the car all Studebaker...

                              Thanks

                              Barry

                              Comment

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