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Rear End

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  • Rear End

    i am getting a drone from r r at highway speeds should i add or remove shims ?

  • #2
    What does "rr" mean? Right Rear??? IF, for sure, you're getting noise from that side, I'd be worried about the wheel bearing on that end.
    "Drone"? How about a failing tire???

    If the rear axle is original OR was set up correctly the last time something was done to it, the shims shouldn't need adding or subtracting. They have nothing to do with the right side specifically - they're to establish end play in BOTH axles.[:I]

    Miscreant adrift in
    the BerStuda Triangle


    1957 Transtar 1/2ton
    1960 Larkvertible V8
    1958 Provincial wagon
    1953 Commander coupe

    No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

    Comment


    • #3
      Input...need input! What's the car?

      Has the car been lowered or raised?
      Yea, that will cause a drone.

      What's the car?????
      If it has a two piece drive shaft, the center bearing support or bearing or u-joint itself may need help.

      Mike

      Comment


      • #4
        I have changed the complete rear-end housing and all in my 63 Lark Daytona from 62 Lark - I put same shims that were in donor car back in place. Drone seems to be coming from right rear. I am not sure of end play.

        Comment


        • #5
          Kelvin writes:"complete rear-end housing"

          Does that mean you used the axles, innards and other stuff from the 63? In other words did you change the whole axle assembly or just mix and match parts as were needed? If the latter's the case, then just transferring the shims to match the housing has set you up for trouble.

          If you swapped WHOLE AXLE UNITS, there should have been no need to mess with the shims unless you had to mess with the brake backing plates in the process. And, of course, that could have been necessary if one had no brakes or had different brakes or whatnot.

          Miscreant adrift in
          the BerStuda Triangle


          1957 Transtar 1/2ton
          1960 Larkvertible V8
          1958 Provincial wagon
          1953 Commander coupe

          No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

          Comment


          • #6
            I put in donor rear end from '62 Lark but kept original backing plates from my '63 Lark.

            Comment


            • #7
              drone almost goes away when i take my foot off throttle

              Comment


              • #8
                You should have checked the axle end play per the shop manual when you swapped the rear end. You have a shop manual don't you?? If not that should be your first investment!
                Your whine or drone as you call it is coming from the ring gear and pinion, either excessive wear or the ring gear/pinion gear runout is not set up correctly. You might get luck and have a loose pinion nut nut that holde the rear yoke on the pinion. Again the shop manual will be your best friend on this.
                Good Luck
                Russ
                quote:Originally posted by Kelvin R

                drone almost goes away when i take my foot off throttle
                Russ Shop Foreman "Rusty Nut Garage"
                57 SH (project)
                60 Lark VIII 2dr sd (driver)

                Russ Shop Foreman \"Rusty Nut Garage\"
                53 2R6 289 5SpdOD (driver)
                57 SH (project)
                60 Lark VIII 2dr sd (driver)

                Comment


                • #9
                  So, did you ever hear this rear axle run in the '62?[?]

                  Miscreant adrift in
                  the BerStuda Triangle


                  1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                  1960 Larkvertible V8
                  1958 Provincial wagon
                  1953 Commander coupe

                  No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I did not hear the rear end run before I changed it. I have a manual it says 1 to 6 thou end play not sure how to find that even with a dial indicater do I push and pull the axel by hand ?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I agree with Russ, it sure sounds (no pun intended) like the ring and pinion aren't aligned properly. Now that's a fun, time consuming job if there ever was one. The problem is you don't know if the noise started right before you got the axle or if it was that way from the factory. One of the trucks I drove at work had a howling differential when brand new and still sounded that way at 60,000 miles when it was traded off. If the noise is a recent development (as far as miles on the rear end goes) I'd be getting concerned but I don't want to frighten you into action when none is needed.

                      You may want to consider dropping the driveshaft in the rear and see if there's any end play in the pinion shaft and see how much backlash (freeplay) there is when you rotate the pinion one direction and then the other. Something else you could check would be to remove the cover and with a bright light, wipe off the oil and look at the surface condition of the teeth. I doubt you'll be able to see the pinion, but if you can see hard surface material flaking off the teeth or areas that appear worn and with a rough surface, it's down into the softer cast iron and the gears are shot. The teeth should be smooth and shiny, almost mirror shiny. If the hard surface material is still good, most likely you'll find a very shiny, elongated oval located in the center of the tooth. If this area is not centered, then most likely the thing has been apart before and someone didn't get it shimmed up correctly. That is if it was done a good many miles ago, otherwise it may not have had enough miles put on it to move the shiny spot. Again, rotate the gear and check for pitting on any of the teeth which would be the sign of one with very many miles on it. With differentials having many hours of very hard use, you'll commonly find the pitting. The cause is not just age, but the cast iron gear is softer than the hard surface material and the iron gives an extremely tiny bit. The hard surface material is more brittle and doesn't like to flex which is why it's usually not much more than .035". Too thick and it's too brittle. You can also press your finger on the tooth and slide it back and forth slowly (just don't turn anything because your howling will be much worse than the differential's!). I know it sounds dumb, but if you close your eyes you can feel things better and yes, it does work. You should be able to feel the shiny part and the low wear areas on the edge of the teeth that is just a bit rougher. If the center of the tooth feels rough, it'll eventually go south on you and I ain't talking about the car taking you to Florida for vacation. If you're concerned with it, I'd look for another rear end because the labor of getting someone to straighten it out would cost more than the axle.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Check your Pinion Angle per the shop manual. The front of the differential probably needs to be pointed down a bit more ( noise goes away on decelleration) . Shims are available at most spring shops. When you swap out axles even though they are from Studebaker to Studebaker the perches on the axle may differ depending on the car the axle comes from.
                        Peter Sant
                        KOOL R2

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Peter, I've heard that before, do you know what the difference in pinion angle if any is between pre-58 and 58-up passenger cars? I obviously need to set mine with an angle gauge but would like a rough idea what shims I may need to have on hand to "do it."

                          Also, since I can't fit under my car with all four wheels on the ground, is the bottom of the frame below the doors supposed to be roughly horizontal at a normal ride height?

                          thanks!

                          nate

                          --
                          55 Commander Starlight
                          http://members.cox.net/njnagel
                          --
                          55 Commander Starlight
                          http://members.cox.net/njnagel

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                          • #14
                            Now here's something I'd forgotten but came to me in the middle of the night. I don't know if it was in a dream or I just woke up, but it's been so many decades since I did this it'd slipped my mind. It's a good way to determine if it's worn ring and pinion gears or just the pinion angle without tearing into stuff. This will work if you're good at backing up but if not you'd better leave it to someone who is. Back it up at speed and if it's the pinion angle, it should still make a noise, maybe just a bit less since axle torque will tend to bring the pinion end down just a bit. If it doesn't make noise, then it's most likely the ring and pinion. How so? When you're backing up, you're using the other side of the gear's teeth.

                            Now for those of you who are going to say the reverse axle torque when backing up will abrogate the exggerated driveline angle of deflection causing the present noise, come on now! If you can apply that much torque when backing up, you belong in the Joey Chitwood show where your supreme world class driving skills will make you some money!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Nate,
                              I dont know what the angle is supposed to be for early cars. The Avanti shop manual says about 4 1/2 to 5 degrees and it shows how to measure it in the book. I checked mine by measuring from the bottom of the frame to the floor then putting it on jack stands under the axles and adjusted until I got the same numbers front and back. Then I took the angle finder and came up with an adjustment of 3 degrees. Shims for three degrees are available at most spring shops.
                              I figured that the axle I installed which came out of a 1966 car had the perches on a little different than an Avanti would.

                              Peter

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