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  • jlmccuan
    replied
    nels, I'll take your direct experience over my "a guy told me or I read this somewhere, so that's the way I do it" Thanks for weighing in.

    Does anyone know what part of the SC is responsible for the bulk of the heat? The belt drive, bearings, ball drive, tranfer of the heat from compressing gasses? I have always assumed that most comes from the ball drive, but have not quantitatively tested that theory.

    Jim

    ____1966 Avanti II RQA 0088_______________1963 Avanti R2 63R3152____________Rabid Snail Racing

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  • nels
    replied
    Bob, I think I last used Mobil synthetic but I really don't think it would make a difference which you use. Gordon, I remember Sonatrac and Paxton's knock off that was Paxtrac I think. I think the intro of those products and the continued blower problems led me to try full synthetic trans fluid. I would imagine full synthetic oil would probably also work. The older units, in the 50's, often plumbed engine oil to the blower to cool it

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  • gordr
    replied
    I seem to remember reading about stuff called Santotrac, a synthetic fluid that was custom-made for planetary ball-and-race drives such as those used in Paxton (and McCullogh) superchargers.

    Supposedly, one of its properties was that under extreme pressure, it became very tacky, and allowed the balls to transmit more torque without slipping. You could get more boost without adding extreme pressure to the spring pack.

    Anybody here had experience with it?

    Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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  • BobPalma
    replied
    quote:Originally posted by nels

    I'll bet I've burned up fifteen blowers in my day. All fifteen or so were with standard trans fluid. All ran so hot during a road trip that you could not check the fluid with out burning your fingers. I switched to a full synthetic about ten years ago and have never failed a blower since. Heat is the enemy and the first thing I noticed after using synthetic is a drastic drop in blower temp. I could check the oil without burning my fingers. I do add a teaspoon of STP to the mix to insure oil hangs on the output race after cool down. That is something I do as it seemed to make sense. I don't care what everyone has heard, this is what I have done and I am absolutely sold on it.
    Good testimony, Nels. Which synthetic fluid do you use; brand and type? BP

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  • nels
    replied
    Bill, no specific info on temp measurements, just seat of the pants checks but easily noticed to anyone who has checked fluid in a hot blower. As for the blower prep, most were higher pressure plate loads, Erb impeller and tight scroll to impeller clearance.

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  • WCP
    replied
    Interesting, Nels - raises some questions. Any information regarding drive torque, blower output, and output air temp. comparisons before and after the change. Lower temp. has to indicate less frictional heating of the balls, races and ball driver. If there is no impact on the output, then it should be all plus.

    Leave a comment:


  • okc63avanti
    replied
    quote:Originally posted by jlmccuan

    John, I'll be testing out one of the dipstick coolers in the next week. I should be able to get temps of both the SC case as well as the air charge temps with and without the cooler. Although this information will not give direct evidence of extending SC life, one would think that if the dipstick cooler does in fact reduce the operating temp of both the SC and the air the SC delivers, it would be a good thing.

    As to the synthetic ATF, my understanding is similar to yours. One of the reasons Paxton recommended Type F ATF was to provide the friction modifiers necessary for ball driver traction. The full synthetic ATF's are lacking in this requirement.

    Jim
    Please update us on the dipstick cooler. Do you have a link to where you can order or purchase one of these dipstick coolers?

    <div align="left">John</div id="left">

    <div align="left">'63 Avanti, R1, Auto, AC, PW (unrestored)</div id="left">

    Leave a comment:


  • nels
    replied
    I'll bet I've burned up fifteen blowers in my day. All fifteen or so were with standard trans fluid. All ran so hot during a road trip that you could not check the fluid with out burning your fingers. I switched to a full synthetic about ten years ago and have never failed a blower since. Heat is the enemy and the first thing I noticed after using synthetic is a drastic drop in blower temp. I could check the oil without burning my fingers. I do add a teaspoon of STP to the mix to insure oil hangs on the output race after cool down. That is something I do as it seemed to make sense. I don't care what everyone has heard, this is what I have done and I am absolutely sold on it.

    Leave a comment:


  • WCP
    replied
    A few weeks ago I removed the S/C oil with a syringe and length of nylon tubing after some 3200 miles driven. As a check, I measured the volume of oil removed by this method at 225 ml. This compares with the 237 ml. put in over the winter for a 95% removal. The last bit of oil withdrawn from the bottom showed no sediment or metallic discoloration. I doubt if inverting the blower would remove any more and could very well yield less oil due to the dipstick tube.

    Leave a comment:


  • jlmccuan
    replied
    John, I'll be testing out one of the dipstick coolers in the next week. I should be able to get temps of both the SC case as well as the air charge temps with and without the cooler. Although this information will not give direct evidence of extending SC life, one would think that if the dipstick cooler does in fact reduce the operating temp of both the SC and the air the SC delivers, it would be a good thing.

    As to the synthetic ATF, my understanding is similar to yours. One of the reasons Paxton recommended Type F ATF was to provide the friction modifiers necessary for ball driver traction. The full synthetic ATF's are lacking in this requirement.

    Jim

    ____1966 Avanti II RQA 0088_______________1963 Avanti R2 63R3152____________Rabid Snail Racing

    Leave a comment:


  • okc63avanti
    replied
    quote:Originally posted by nels

    Blower failures are due to heat generated and very little way to get rid of it. A recirculating system is the best way to go using a reservoir and cooler but the easiest way out is to go with a full synthetic auto trans fluid. You won't believe how much the running temp of the unit drops.
    I've heard that synthetic ATF is not viscous enough or has too low a surface friction for the drive balls to correctly spin and drive the supercharger. Is there a brand of synthetic ATF that will work that some member has experience with.

    Also has anyone installed a SC cooler on a Paxton SN60 (it would take some drilling and tapping and adaptation but I wonder if someone has done it.

    <div align="left">John</div id="left">

    <div align="left">'63 Avanti, R1, Auto, AC, PW (unrestored)</div id="left">

    Leave a comment:


  • studegary
    replied
    quote:Originally posted by 53k

    quote:Originally posted by studegary

    I believe in changing the fluid every 3000-5000 miles, but I do not remove the S/C to do it. I have posted the technique in the past.
    I used to change my s/c fluid using the technique you mention. However, the member, Don Eireman, who you may remember from early SDC days, got after me about that saying that the only way to get ALL the old stuff out out the unit was to drain it upside down.



    Paul Johnson,
    There are different schools of thought on this. If there is something laying in the bottom that does not get suspended in the fluid, I would rather leave it there than dump the S/C over and get that item lodged in some unknown place. I believe that the important part is to change 99.5% of the fluid frequently.

    Gary L.
    Wappinger, NY

    SDC member since 1968
    Studebaker enthusiast much longer

    Leave a comment:


  • nels
    replied
    Blower failures are due to heat generated and very little way to get rid of it. A recirculating system is the best way to go using a reservoir and cooler but the easiest way out is to go with a full synthetic auto trans fluid. You won't believe how much the running temp of the unit drops.

    Leave a comment:


  • okc63avanti
    replied
    Has anyone every modified a supercharger so as to drill and tap threads on the bottom side where lubricating oil goes and then insert a drain plug with valve?

    <div align="left">John</div id="left">

    <div align="left">'63 Avanti, R1, Auto, AC, PW (unrestored)</div id="left">

    Leave a comment:


  • 53k
    replied
    quote:Originally posted by studegary

    I believe in changing the fluid every 3000-5000 miles, but I do not remove the S/C to do it. I have posted the technique in the past.
    I used to change my s/c fluid using the technique you mention. However, the member, Don Eireman, who you may remember from early SDC days, got after me about that saying that the only way to get ALL the old stuff out out the unit was to drain it upside down.



    Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia. '64 Daytona Wagonaire, '64 Daytona convertible, '53 Commander Starliner, Museum R-4 engine, '62 Gravely Model L, '72 Gravely Model 430

    Leave a comment:

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