302 in an Avanti?

[dixchief]

I like to keep my iron (Indian MC's and cars) as original as possible. But my 63 Avanti has a bad 259 block(wrong block)in it. I can get a built 302 Ford block for it. Has anyone dropped a small block into an Avanti? I would be interested in any suggestions as to how to proceed. Any major difficulties to expect? Who are the suppliers of the transition pieces (mounts)
TIA Richard dixchief@gmail.com

[Chris Pile]

I think a Bonneville racer has a Ford in his Avanti, but I don't know more than that.

Chris Pile
Midway Chapter SDC
The Studebaker Special

[64Avanti]

Anything can be done. First problem is most if not all Ford small blocks are front sump. You either have to find a rear sump setup or perhaps build one. The oil pump is in the front so the oil pump itself needs a front sump. Your best bet would be to use an external pump. Then with the engine and transmission sitting in the car determine what the engine mounts need to look like. The rear ones will be simple just a fabricated cross member bolted to the x-member. The problem will be front mounts. you will need to take extensive measurements and then design the mounts. You may want to fabricate something out of cardboard or foam board to verify your design. Of course you can design something properly just from accurate measurements.

The next problem will be your exhaust system. You may need to fabricate custom headers. The good news is the narrow width of the Ford engine will provide pleanty of room.

If you are getting the idea that I am saying that it is difficult to do, I am. I have installed many engines into many vehicles from automobiles to military vehicles. I have also installed a couple of different engines into Studebakers but would keep any new Studebaker project Studebaker powered. Anything can be done but I wouldn't recommend this combination. The one good thing about the Ford engine is that it is very light.

My first choice would be get a good rebuilt Studebaker with some minor hop-up. My second choice would be to install a Chevy. Mounts exist and are available since Studebaker and Avanti motors installed those engines.



David L

[Dick Steinkamp]

quote:Originally posted by dixchief

I like to keep my iron (Indian MC's and cars) as original as possible. But my 63 Avanti has a bad 259 block(wrong block)in it. I can get a built 302 Ford block for it. Has anyone dropped a small block into an Avanti? I would be interested in any suggestions as to how to proceed. Any major difficulties to expect? Who are the suppliers of the transition pieces (mounts)
TIA Richard dixchief@gmail.com

Nobody that I know of makes front or trany mounts to put a Ford in an Avanti. There may have been a couple of them done over the years, but I have never seen or heard of one. If you are a good fabricator and done other swaps, you could most likely pull it off. If not, it can be VERY frustrating. There are far more abandoned swap projects out there than completed ones.

Much easier and cheaper to find a good running 289 Stude and put it in there, or rebuild your 259 to 289 specs (just needs the 289 crank).

Dick Steinkamp
Bellingham, WA

[64Avanti]

Yes there is a Bonneville Avanti with a Ford engine in it. However the chassis is modified and uses a dry sump. It is a black and gold car and I should have a picture of it somewhere.

David L

[dixchief]

Wow! Thank you gentleman for the insights. I have so many projects already I don't need one like this. I got an R series block (frozen) which I believe was the original block. I will just rebuild it or the 259. This of course leads to new questions- see new posts.If you're ever in central FL, stop by the shop- I owe you big time. Richard

[rockne10]

The 289 or the 259 should be able to be pushed to R3 specs, if you want to go that route; no mounting issues.

[acolds]

Later 302 as used in full size Crown Vics and Lincoln Mark VII had mostly rear sump but small front sump for the oil pump both had drain plugs the Ford engine is a lot lower than the Studebaker engine. A lot of cheap horse power can be had from the small block Ford I would rather see a Ford than a Chevy

[buddymander]

I bet that small front sump on the SBF would interfere with the bellcrank. You'd have to raise the engine up to clear it and that would put the top of your bellhousing closer to the firewall where the trans tunnel meets it.

[hotrodstude]

the ford small block has a lot of rear sump pans.all mustangs from 1979-1995,1969-1974 ford vans e-100 series but they do hav a little sump in the front of the pan for the oil pump.but it dose make an easy swap for an xke jag.i have done serveral an much lighter that the straight 6. an it is easy to get lots of hp out of the small ford.ford trucks use rear sump pans on most of the v-8 from y-block-thru 385 series(429-460)

[Swifster]

A Chevy 302 would fit...[}]

Where in Central Florida is your shop?

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Tom - Mulberry, FL

1964 Studebaker Daytona - 289 4V, 4-Speed (Cost To Date: $2125.60)

1964 Studebaker Commander 170-1V, 3-speed w/OD (Cost to Date: $623.67)

[64Avanti]

The required front pan depth for the pump will interfere with the bellcrank. Someone once modified the front crossmember on an Avanti to get more clearance at the bellcrank for an engine swap. They cut a section out and lowered it some.

You don't want to raise the engine even though it is lower than the Studebaker engine. If your 259 block is a full flow block then it is the same block as the Avanti. You can perhaps use the crank from the Avanti engine if it is sevicable. The only difference between a 259 and 289 is the pistons. The cam is different in the R1/R2 engines as well as the cam gear so you would want to salvage that also. Your old block might be usable depending on what caused it to seize.

David L

[1962larksedan]

As per some of the other posters here:

#1: Stude V8
#2: Chevy V8

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Borrowed Bams50's sigline here:

"Do they all not, by mere virtue of having survived as relics of a bygone era, amass a level of respect perhaps not accorded to them when they were new?"

[sbca96]

Find out why the block is seized and go from there. Some have been
able to get them unstuck, and running ... for years! My dads '64 GT
Hawk had a stuck NEW motor, took some work, but we got it unstuck. I
this it was about 10 years later my dad sold the car when he moved to
Michigan ... still ran great.

Tom

'63 Avanti, zinc plated drilled & slotted 03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, soon: TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves, 'R3' 276 cam, Edelbrock AFB Carb, GM HEI distributor, 8.8mm plug wires