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62 hawk looking for a brake up grade.

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  • Brakes: 62 hawk looking for a brake up grade.

    Have a 62 Hawk with drum brakes. It needs a complete over haul of the braking system including replacing the drums/ lines/ MC. With all that it needs, I'm thinking about upgrading it with disc brakes. Is there a good reasonable kit out there for it? I do want to keep running the stock wheels.

  • #2
    Turner Brake has what you need, but you will need Wheels with more Clearance in back with ANY Disc Brake setup, even '63 to '66 Studebaker.

    http://www.turnerbrake.com/
    StudeRich
    Second Generation Stude Driver,
    Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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    • #3
      One of our chapter members has done Turner brakes on several cars, including a 62 GT. He loves the kits. If I had to do a complete brake rebuild I would go that route.
      "In the heart of Arkansas."
      Searcy, Arkansas
      1952 Commander 2 door. Really fine 259.
      1952 2R pickup

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      • #4
        I'd seriously consider leaving the drums, and installing shoes lined with, "the good stuff". Call Don Nowac, at 716-824-2292. He will want your shoe cores first, and will NOT negotiate on that. His shoe liners make the car stop like it did when it left the show room floor. The Chinese repro shoe liners sold by most vendors nowadays, if used on the front, will get you killed.

        That's one advantage of converting to DBs, is that you can find pads lined with modern materials. But not necessary if you use Don's shoes.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by JoeHall View Post
          I'd seriously consider leaving the drums, and installing shoes lined with, "the good stuff". Call Don Nowac, at 716-824-2292. He will want your shoe cores first, and will NOT negotiate on that. His shoe liners make the car stop like it did when it left the show room floor. The Chinese repro shoe liners sold by most vendors nowadays, if used on the front, will get you killed.

          That's one advantage of converting to DBs, is that you can find pads lined with modern materials. But not necessary if you use Don's shoes.
          Joe drives his cars, so if he says they stop like new, take it to the bank. If your drums can be turned back round and true, new wheel cylinders and master cylinder, the OEM system will be as good as the rest of the car.

          jack vines
          PackardV8

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          • #6
            I would do that; modern linings will give same or better performance as disc brakes. I have a Turner system; it is still in the box 'cause it would have required a major hack job on my car to install it and then, without cutting half the floor away, I could not figure out how I could actually check and/or add brake fluid. But I do like the idea. I like to keep cars as they were when new; its a little bit of history. Little things--like an electric fuel pump --are good because they improve reliability with the crap gas we have now. I agree with Jack.

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            • #7
              I'm still running drum brakes on my 62 Hawk. As long as you have decent brake shoes, good drums and a good hydraulic system there shouldn't be a problem stopping the car. If you want a good disc brake kit, contact Jim Turner at Turner Brake, he will sell you top quality parts for the job. Bud

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              • #8
                PM sent. **

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                • #9
                  The other source (other than Turner) for a disc-brake kit for Studebakers is Hot Rods and Brakes, URL: https://hotrodsandbrakes.com/

                  HR&B's kits are a bit cheaper and the adapter plates look quite a bit lighter, reducing unsprung weight (a good thing). Other than those issues I don't know of any other differences between HR&B's kit and Turner's kit.
                  -Dwight

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                  • #10
                    I used a HR&B front disc an my ‘60 Lark, I’m very satisfied with the new set up; it stops great! The original drum set up had shoes relined by a local brake shop, but they glazed up quickly and didn’t stop all that great. I blame the new asbestos free linings for the lousy stopping ability. FWIW I also installed a Turner dual master cylinder and had great service from Jim.

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                    • #11
                      The problem with shoes lined with, "modern" material is that it's designed with more EPA concerns than to actually stop the car. When I referenced Don Nowac above, I shoulda said his shoes come with, OLD TIME liners that are, "the good stuff". I would not install the repro shoes with Chinese liners if given to me. Been there-done that, and they are dangerous if used on the front.

                      As for installing a Turner or HR&B kit, be prepared to use a LOT of pedal pressure to stop the car. No problem if you are still squatting 300 pounds or more in the gym. LOL Properly set up 11" front drums will stop with less pedal pressure. But the secret is in the shoe liners. If you must have an easier pedal with front DBs, install an hydrovac, and only plumb the front discs through it. Plumb the rear drums directly from the MC.

                      To use a tandem MC, it is not necessary to, "cut half the floorboard away". DOn't even need to drill the 1" hole Turner suggests. Just maintain MC fluid level from under the car. I use a brake spoon to pop the wire off theMC cap and reinstall it. To check flip level, I use my fingertips. To top up the fluid, I use a 2.5 ounce syringe with rubber hose and u'shaped piece of copper line. The copper ling hooks over the side of the MC and into the reservoir. Pretty sure I posted pics here of the setup. I use this setup on the 62GT and 56J. The 63GT has a reservoir on the firewall, which I plumbed into the tandem MC; to insure both ends of the tandem MC stay topped off, I drilled a 5/16" hole in the inside wall between them.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by JoeHall View Post
                        The problem with shoes lined with, "modern" material is that it's designed with more EPA concerns than to actually stop the car. When I referenced Don Nowac above, I shoulda said his shoes come with, OLD TIME liners that are, "the good stuff". I would not install the repro shoes with Chinese liners if given to me. Been there-done that, and they are dangerous if used on the front.

                        As for installing a Turner or HR&B kit, be prepared to use a LOT of pedal pressure to stop the car. No problem if you are still squatting 300 pounds or more in the gym. LOL Properly set up 11" front drums will stop with less pedal pressure. But the secret is in the shoe liners. If you must have an easier pedal with front DBs, install an hydrovac, and only plumb the front discs through it. Plumb the rear drums directly from the MC.

                        To use a tandem MC, it is not necessary to, "cut half the floorboard away". DOn't even need to drill the 1" hole Turner suggests. Just maintain MC fluid level from under the car. I use a brake spoon to pop the wire off theMC cap and reinstall it. To check flip level, I use my fingertips. To top up the fluid, I use a 2.5 ounce syringe with rubber hose and u'shaped piece of copper line. The copper ling hooks over the side of the MC and into the reservoir. Pretty sure I posted pics here of the setup. I use this setup on the 62GT and 56J. The 63GT has a reservoir on the firewall, which I plumbed into the tandem MC; to insure both ends of the tandem MC stay topped off, I drilled a 5/16" hole in the inside wall between them.
                        Hmmm...that "good stuff" may have obtained its performance from vermiculite, mica and its grandparent...asbestos?! Whatever you choose, modern or old, please wear a mask and stay ventilated from this dust.

                        In spring 2019 I attended a tribology consortium in Miami and was astonished to see how far brake and other friction surfaces had come. Much of the world's braking materials come from South Asia.

                        From the latin for the cashew nut (genus Anacardium), there is some phenomenal and sustainable chemistry found in the shell of this nut, as the company's name here suggests:

                        https://www.cardolite.com/products/friction-particles/

                        (I don't work in this field - my chemistry is with the manufacture of tissue paper, where the science of wear and friction actually has a focus through the use of ceramic-tipped creping blades. (Wasn't the friction you were thinking of, I bet...))

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by NCDave51 View Post

                          Hmmm...that "good stuff" may have obtained its performance from vermiculite, mica and its grandparent...asbestos?! Whatever you choose, modern or old, please wear a mask and stay ventilated from this dust.

                          In spring 2019 I attended a tribology consortium in Miami and was astonished to see how far brake and other friction surfaces had come. Much of the world's braking materials come from South Asia.

                          From the latin for the cashew nut (genus Anacardium), there is some phenomenal and sustainable chemistry found in the shell of this nut, as the company's name here suggests:

                          https://www.cardolite.com/products/friction-particles/

                          (I don't work in this field - my chemistry is with the manufacture of tissue paper, where the science of wear and friction actually has a focus through the use of ceramic-tipped creping blades. (Wasn't the friction you were thinking of, I bet...))
                          I am aware how far technology in braking material has came, and it is readily available on DB pads. Something for everyone, no matter your intended use of the vehicle. But in the classic car world, we have no such choices. It's all about having to accept whatever is available, and the only thing available is those offered by our vendors, of questionable origin. There are no shoes lined with same materials available for pads, from major brake component companies. Good luck trying to find out the company/origin of the shoes currently available from our vendors. One thing I am sure of, thay are inferior in performance. You can get by with them on the rear, but it's dangerous to rely on them on the front, where 70 percent of the stopping power comes from.

                          If even one major company would line our shoes with modern material, as is available for pads, I'd pay 10 times as much as I'd pay for the off-shore sourced ones currently available. That's why I converted the last Hawk to DBs, properly lined shoes, that will actually stop the Stude safely, are simply unavailable.

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                          • #14
                            Good points, Joe. I agree.

                            I guess I drove slower in my last 10 classics? All the new shoes that I fitted for them stopped me perfectly: '60 Hillman Minx Series IIIA, '41 Nash 600 Slipstream Deluxe, '51 Willys 473-VJ, '56 Nash Metropolitan, '64 C-10 longbed, etc., etc..

                            With my conscience as my only co-pilot (see my recent rant on seatbelts...), we all have to be aware of the tires we roll on and the brakes that stop us from rolling. I won't drive faster than my angels can fly.....

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                            • #15
                              Is the "Good Stuff' you're speaking of, also called the "Green Stuff"
                              Last edited by 64V-K7; 01-28-2021, 11:31 AM.
                              64 GT Hawk (K7)
                              1970 Avanti (R3)

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