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Fuel Pump for '61 Hawk 259?

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  • Fuel System: Fuel Pump for '61 Hawk 259?

    Can anybody tell me the correct Carter fuel pump for a 259 V8 1961 Hawk with a 4 barrel Carter carb. I got a Carter 2211 from summit but the arm doesn't contact with the cam. It is the same length as the old one but the tip is lower down.

  • #2
    There is no Current Production Carter Fuel Pump like the OEM Original used on 259 and 289 V8's.
    The best option is a Rebuilding a OEM, Old, Original real Carter Pump with a Ethanol Resistant New Repair Kit.

    Option 2 is buying an expensive Real Carter Super Pump used on Avanti Engines modified by and from a Studebaker Vendor.

    What you have is a Airtex sold by the New Carter Co. a Federal Mogul Co. or whoever owns it this week.
    However it should connect to the Lobe on the Cam if it went UNDER the Lobe. Sounds like an improper installation.

    https://studebakervendors.com
    StudeRich
    Second Generation Stude Driver,
    Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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    • #3
      Thats the problem, it goes under the cam but does not make contact. the arm sits too low. The installation is correct . Can the arm be raised or do i go for an electric pump? The original pump works fine but leaks oil.

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      • #4
        Like StudeRich says, just buy a repair kit. Those pumps are easy to repair. Being in New Zealand, you are a long ways from the Studebaker vendors in the U.S., but maybe there is a vendor in Australia. Of course, an electric pump is always an option, but I think it is easier to just repair what you have. As for the Airtex pump from Summit, my guess is that it is not the correct one for a Studebaker V8. The arm should contact the cam.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by 61 Stude hawk View Post
          That's the problem, it goes under the cam but does not make contact. the arm sits too low. The installation is correct . Can the arm be raised or do i go for an electric pump? The original pump works fine but leaks oil.
          If it leaks Oil, it is not a OEM Carter, but an old Airtex with the wallowing Actuator Lever PIN.
          Drive the Pin back in, clean around the hole with Lacquer Thinner, Brake Clean etc. Dry and Silicone over both ends, or better yet a hardening Sealer like JB Weld.

          Click image for larger version

Name:	Carter M2211 Airtex.jpg
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ID:	1874011 If the Lever doesn't look like this it's not a M2211.

          Last edited by StudeRich; 01-08-2021, 10:59 PM.
          StudeRich
          Second Generation Stude Driver,
          Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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          • #6
            That seems the problem with the old pump the pin is not a tight fit

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            • #7
              I couldn't get my stock pump to stop leaking oil either. The electric pump I replaced it with was $8 from ebay (they're $11-$15 now). It is actually for a Toyota truck of some sort. It's been working fine for four years on my 4 barrel carbed R1. One nice thing about the electric is, I can turn it on and fill the carb before cranking the engine to start after sitting for a week, so no extended cranking. Plus, I can turn it off when I turn off the street and use the fuel from the carb going down my long driveway so there's much less to evaporate and fill my garage with gas fumes. With the gas we get here the carb will boil dry in 45 minutes on a hot engine.

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              • #8
                Regarding those new Airtex / Carter branded pumps.. I learned earlier this week that many of them are built without the oil seal for the diaphragm shaft. That’s why they leak oil right out of the box.

                I also learned that all of the new Airtex / Carter branded pumps are being discontinued.

                I’ve been pushing rebuild kits and rebuilt original pumps through our store as much as I can; they last for years without any trouble.

                As far as the Airtex pumps being discontinued; good riddance.

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                • #9
                  The pumps leak oil because the seal on the diaphragm shaft is leaking. Oil collects in the cavity where the pump arm connects to the diaphragm shaft. If the shaft seal on the shaft does not fit properly or is defective, oil will eventually pool on top of the diaphragm and every time the pump arm is actuated, the diaphragm moves upward and pushes oil out of the breather hole in the top section of the pump. I rebuilt the pump on my Avanti a few years ago and after a few months, it started leaking oil due to the shaft seal failing. There is now a rebuilt original Carter pump that was a spare for my 62 Hawk on the engine. I know that a stock smaller Carter pump isn't correct for the engine, but it hasn't given me any trouble and I'm not removing it until it does. Maybe then, I'll rebuild the correct pump again and it will go back on the engine. Bud

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                  • #10
                    Click image for larger version

Name:	20210110_084305.jpg
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ID:	1874082 New pump on the left
                    Attached Files

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                    • #11
                      Went thru several of these junk fuel pumps before I gave up and went to electric on Ceci's 61. Jon Myers told me that the angle of the arm is wrong and there is just not enough pumping going on. Had better luck with the one I got from him , but it still quit after a year. Best thing is rebuild or have original Carter rebuilt. If you go to electric use a pump for an 84 Accord. They are $30-$70 at RockAuto. Stay away from vane type pumps. If they lose prime they won't work. Sometimes spending a few extra $ is wise.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Jeffry Cassel View Post
                        /Cut/ If you go to electric use a pump for an 84 Accord. They are $30-$70 at RockAuto. Stay away from vane type pumps. If they lose prime they won't work. Sometimes spending a few extra $ is wise.
                        Jeffry, would you call the Acura Electric Pump a Diaphragm Type Pump or what?
                        StudeRich
                        Second Generation Stude Driver,
                        Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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                        • #13
                          I am looking for the correct fuel pump for my 1952 Commander V8. It currently has a AC casting but not sure of casting number. Any help would be appreciated.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by 61 stude hawk View Post
                            Can anybody tell me the correct Carter fuel pump for a 259 V8 1961 Hawk with a 4 barrel Carter carb. I got a Carter 2211 from summit but the arm doesn't contact with the cam. It is the same length as the old one but the tip is lower down.
                            Dene, I sent you a new PM message.
                            StudeRich
                            Second Generation Stude Driver,
                            Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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                            • #15
                              Do you have the engine s/n? Or a build sheet?
                              IIRC, '61 Hawks had 289's except for export versions.
                              I could be wrong, too.
                              Fuel pumps would be the same.
                              HTIH (Hope The Info Helps)

                              Jeff


                              Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain



                              Note: SDC# 070190 (and earlier...)

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