Water pumps (pics)

[Chucks Stude]

Have never had the opportunity, or the reason, to compare a regular versus an Avanti or heavy duty water pump. I know this is pretty basic stuff, but untill the end was broken off of my water pump did I even think about it. Here are a few side by side pics showing the differences, and why one costs more than the other. I guess as we hang heavy duty parts on our cars, such as AC, power steering, fan clutches, the strain on the parts becomes higher. Anyway, this is old hat to the veterans, but for some of the newer members, this may be enlightening.

[ivorydan]

Hey Chuck: which is which?
Thanks! Dan

[N8N]

The standard pump is the one on the left, without the reinforcing ribs in the casting.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[tbredehoft]

Glad you posted these, I've wondered just where the difference was.

Below is a drawing (.dwg) of the critical dimensions in the un-heavy duty pump.



The 15/16 dim. (.9375) is meant to wind up .016 from the back of the cavity at that point. The impeller should be adjusted to meet this dimension. The .240 dim is unique to the un-heavy duty pump.

[img=left]http://www.alink.com/personal/tbredehoft/Avatar1.jpg[/img=left]
Tom Bredehoft
'53 Commander Coupe (since 1959)
'55 President (6H Y6) State Sedan
(Under Construction 571 hrs.)
'05 Legacy Ltd Wagon
All Indiana built cars

[Chucks Stude]

You know, I didn't notice it, but in the last picture, notice how on the left, or std duty pump, the impeller looks to be off center. I went back and looked at the part, and it sure looks to be slightly off center. No such issue on the heavy duty pump. Better built, I guess. Both came from our vendors.

[ivorydan]

OK, what I'm tryig to figure out is which one is correct for a Hawk with an R1 engine? I seem to remember someone telling me I could not use the Avanti pump on an R1 Hawk!If not, why not? Thnks.

[N8N]

I thought that the larger nose wouldn;t fit into the viscous drive. I'd be happy to be proved wrong though.

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

[Chucks Stude]

I have just bench assembled the water pump, double pulley, spacer, viscous drive and 6 blade fan. Pics

[jimmijim8]

I used an avanti pump on my fan clutch/ac equipped 63 Hawk 289 non R engine. I had to make a spacer for in between where the fan clutch meets the pulleys. My car didn't come with a spacer as pictured in this post. Thickness was if I remember correctly 3/16".This was to keep the pump flange from bottoming out in the fan clutch pilot hole.
Let me know if this explanation is clear. As far as I am concerned, a heavy duty pump is needed for the x-tra weight of the clutch. I feel that the pump will last longer. jimmijim






"

[Chucks Stude]

The spacer that I used is a Studebaker item(avail from our vendors, even though the 4 blade fixed fan came with this one). I am going to take the spacer to a machine shop, and have the hole deepened about a 1/32", because the pulleys are still slightly loose, and have the nose on the other end of the spacer trimmed about .030, as the fan clutch does not seat completely. Neither of these things are a problem with the standard pump. Jim, I hope this fixes the prob for a while. I can tell you that I have had Studes with 200,000 miles on them, without a waterpump problem. This is all new to me.

[jimmijim8]

Chuck, possibly, make a spacer as I did. You then can use the standard stock studs and also forget the machine shop.Use a piece of scrap metal the right thickness, a vice, drill, and some bits, hack saw, and a file or 2. One file should probably be a rat tail. Your pump flange and shaft combination diameter will then fit into the fan clutch properly. The spacer thickness would be the difference between the raised portions of the 2 different pump flange/shaft height. The center and 4 stud holes are indicative. P.S. Heavy duty Stude pump and Avanti are two different animals. Regular duty Stude pump is also a different animal. jimmijim

[Green 53]

The Avanti pump is a bit too long for use on a Lark type. I tried to use one on my R1 64 Daytona and the blade touched radiator. In reverse I tried a standard HD pump on the R1 Avanti and the hub didn't stick out far enough for the clutch fan to mount on.
Denny L

[jimmijim8]

I think there may be differences in the Avanti car water pump pulley and whatever other pulley mounts to the water pump. Chime in John. jimmijim

[StudeRich]

Chuck that is really odd that you needed a spacer on a Viscous drive fan! The factory never used a spacer OR those outrageously LONG bolts! Are you building something different than stock?

Might the solution have been a Heavy Duty Pump, instead of an Avanti Pump?

Also, I find all your all your discussion about the heavy duty qualities of the Avanti Pump with it's heavier bearing boss to be a bit of a moot point, because in spite of all that, the BEARING is the same! I really expected it would have a better BEARING since that is where the load is exerted!


StudeRich at Studebakers Northwest -Ferndale,WA

[Chucks Stude]

The car origionally came with a fixed 4-blade fan, and this spacer. The car is an airconditioned GT. That fan made a lot of noise.When I went to the viscous drive,and 6 blade fan, the fan did not stick past the edge of the fan shroud without the use of the spacer. This caused the engine to run hotter than it had. Putting the spacer back in, took care of that problem, and driving the car in 100 degree heat, stop and go, did not overheat the car. It never went over 185 degrees. When the water pump failed, it was not the bearing that failed, it was the housing. Now, I have only found numbers for two water pumps, standard 1558224,and the Avanti unit. Am I missing something? The studs are too long, and that will be taken care of. Had to use studs, because the orig. Studebaker viscous drive had holes in it not slots. Bolts would not work because they would not go around the housing of the viscous drive.