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  • Brakes: 36237 MC Prep

    Does the 36237 Master Cylinder have two residual pressure valves to remove for a Turner Dual Master Cylinder conversion, or one?

  • #2
    That IS the AMC '72 Matador Drum Brake M/C with equal sized front and rear Reservoirs.
    NOT for Disc. Brakes.

    BRAKES are something you DO NOT want to play guessing games with, it could be Your Life or someone else's, be careful.
    Last edited by StudeRich; 03-14-2020, 10:52 AM.
    StudeRich
    Second Generation Stude Driver,
    Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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    • #3
      Originally posted by StudeRich View Post
      That IS the AMC '72 Matador Drum Brake M/C with equal sized front and rear Reservoirs.
      NOT for Disc. Brakes.

      BRAKES are something you DO NOT want to play guessing games with, it could be Your Life or someone else's, be careful.
      Pretty sure 36237 is the one recommended by Turner, and it is the one I have always used. I only buy NEW from NAPA, and do not use rebuilt or other brand MC, as they are prone to premature failure. Yes, you are supposed to remove the front RPV from the 36237 MC. See Jim's online instructions for how to do it.

      Rich, if you have a part number for a front disc/rear drum MC, with 1" piston, that will fit Studes with underfloor MCs, please give us the number. I have only ever seen one such MC in a Stude, and there were problems with it in the Hawk it was in; it had no internal front RPV, and whoever installed it had not installed an inline RPV. I have no idea what it was originally for, but would love to know.
      Please advise.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by phwold View Post
        Does the 36237 Master Cylinder have two residual pressure valves to remove for a Turner Dual Master Cylinder conversion, or one?
        That’s going to be a “Yes”
        64 GT Hawk (K7)
        1970 Avanti (R3)

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        • #5
          Originally posted by phwold View Post
          Does the 36237 Master Cylinder have two residual pressure valves to remove for a Turner Dual Master Cylinder conversion, or one?
          Is this a trick question, or did we just not read it correctly? Are you installing only the dual MC? Or are you also installing front disc brakes? Per the wording of your question, the answer is NO, you do not need to remove either one of the RPVs. If you are also installing front disc brakes, see Jim Turner's online instructions.

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          • #6
            My initial question came after reading the fine description with pictures on a topic called "36237 MC Prep" on Bob Johnstone's site "studebaker-info.org". In that description the writer refers to valves (plural), while only showing the removal of an internal valve from one port. Would I be right in assuming that there is an internal valve in each port that would need to be removed?

            I am helping a friend who has bought a Turner dual master cylinder conversion kit. He plans to retain his drum brakes all around on a one-ton Studebaker truck. The introductory words of "36237 MC Prep" seem to imply that every MC is designed for a particular brake system with various rate return springs and the like, so that the built-in internal valves in the MC would not necessarily be correct for alternate uses. So I am assuming, that we would need two 10 lb. external residual pressure valves, and the proportioning valve for fine tuning. Is this correct?

            And finally back to the original question. Does the 36237 MC have one or two internal valves to be removed?

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            • #7
              Drum Brake Systems require a Residual Pressure in the System all the time. The way I understand it, especially a "Lower mounted than the Wheel Cylinders System" needs them on the whole system, Front and Rear, the existing System had one for all 4 Wheels so there is no doubt this one also does need one, since nothing else in the "System" should have changed.

              No additional Proportioning Valves or Residual Valves should be needed. For DRUM Brakes you DO NOT REMOVE them.
              Jim Turner's Kit or Website should or did explain that.

              Just look in the 2 Holes and see if they are restricted.

              FYI and the Owner: a 1 Ton Stude. Truck uses a 1 1/4 Inch Bore Master Cylinder, so this 1 Inch Bore M/C is incorrect for this Truck.

              Refer to My Post #2, Sentence 2 again!

              Edit: Changed the 1 Ton M/C Piston size from 1 1/8" to 1 1/4", was thinking 3/4 Ton for some reason.
              Thanks Joe.
              Last edited by StudeRich; 03-15-2020, 03:13 PM.
              StudeRich
              Second Generation Stude Driver,
              Proud '54 Starliner Owner

              Comment


              • #8
                So now back to the original question, NO you do not need to remove either of the RPVs in the 36237. It was designed for cars with front & rear drums, which is what you intend to use it for in the truck. IF you had been planning to use it for a car with front discs and rear drums, you'd have needed to remove the RPV from the port you plan to plumb to the front discs. You coulda left the original RPV to the rear in place inside the MC, since it maintains the recommended residual PSI for drums.

                Now on to Rich's point about substituting a 1" piston MC for the original 1.125" piston MC in the truck. You are probably gonna find the 1" MC does not have enough, "hydraulic capacity" to work adequately in the truck. It will likely require less pedal pressure to apply the brakes, but the pedal will go MUCH lower, maybe even to the floor, unless pumped rapidly a few times before needing to stop.

                The good news is, MCs with 1.125" pistons are easier to find than those with 1" pistons. You wanna find one that was designed for front & rear drum braked vehicles, with external dimensions to fit the Turner kit and clearances in the truck. If you can only find one for disc brakes, or for front discs/rear drums, you can still use it, but will need to install a 10 PSI rated RPV inline MC's ports that were intended for discs.

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                • #9
                  Thanks guys for the correction on the right MC bore size for a one ton truck. It's 1 1/4". I've passed this and all your help on to my friend today and got to see his truck for the first time. It's a 1964, with duallys and a 289. Beautiful big truck. Thanks again to each of you for your helpfulness.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by phwold View Post
                    My initial question came after reading the fine description with pictures on a topic called "36237 MC Prep" on Bob Johnstone's site "studebaker-info.org". In that description the writer refers to valves (plural), while only showing the removal of an internal valve from one port. Would I be right in assuming that there is an internal valve in each port that would need to be removed?

                    I am helping a friend who has bought a Turner dual master cylinder conversion kit. He plans to retain his drum brakes all around on a one-ton Studebaker truck. The introductory words of "36237 MC Prep" seem to imply that every MC is designed for a particular brake system with various rate return springs and the like, so that the built-in internal valves in the MC would not necessarily be correct for alternate uses. So I am assuming, that we would need two 10 lb. external residual pressure valves, and the proportioning valve for fine tuning. Is this correct?

                    And finally back to the original question. Does the 36237 MC have one or two internal valves to be removed?
                    My apologies for not being more clear on that piece. I was in the process of adding that MC to my factory DB equipped Hawk after installing Turner Disc Brakes. There are quite a few more considerations that have to be thought through when you’re modifying a brake system, as noted above. The page was only to show how to remove the RPV’s, not to assign the requirement. I’ve made some editorial changes to reflect that. / rj
                    64 GT Hawk (K7)
                    1970 Avanti (R3)

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