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Drum to Disc system switch - 60's cars

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  • #16
    Turners system uses older style Ford rotors and GM calipers from the late '60's & early '70's. No late model stuff. I like 15" wheels just fine and don't plan on using 17's.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Tom - Mulberry, FL

    1964 Studebaker Daytona - 289 4V, 4-Speed (Cost To Date: $2125.60)

    Tom - Bradenton, FL

    1964 Studebaker Daytona - 289 4V, 4-Speed (Cost To Date: $2514.10)
    1964 Studebaker Commander - 170 1V, 3-Speed w/OD

    Comment


    • #17
      quote:Originally posted by buddymander
      That Mustang stuff is still pretty new. I was hoping for some older stuff, like dodge truck with the 5 on 4.5.
      quote:Originally posted by buddymander
      i'd like something from the late seventies or eighties for the sake of availability. Early nineties would probably be best. Maybe a crown vick.
      The 11" Mustang rotor that will fit in a modern 15" Crown Vic wheel &
      use a stock Stude hub cap is $33 bucks in stock at Autozone. It's the
      same bolt pattern as Studebaker = 5 on 4.5. This works with my CNC
      brackets and bolts onto an unmodified spindle. The Charger rotor that
      was mentioned earlier listed for $78 dollars each at Autozone, it is
      a special order item. The 11" Mustang rotor uses one of two calipers,
      a single and a two piston design. The two piston is a PBR aluminum.
      The basic single piston caliper lists for $55 dollars each, pads are
      $16 dollars a set. Thats $230 plus tax for everything but the machine
      work needed on the hub and the Dodge truck wheel studs. Then you need
      my brackets of course. Salvage yard wise, guys on the local Mustang
      forums are GIVING away their 11" GT brakes, thats how I got mine!

      quote:Originally posted by Swifster

      There is no such thing as overkill in a brake system. As for the cost, I guess I look at it as time is money. For $230 you get the brackets & adapters. Heck, you can't get a complete brake job for that. How long will it take to build a better mousetrap? I'll stop because I really am not looking to offend anyone, but for the money, I don't think you can beat it.
      quote:Originally posted by Swifster

      Turners system uses older style Ford rotors and GM calipers from the late '60's & early '70's. No late model stuff. I like 15" wheels just fine and don't plan on using 17's.
      The late '60's Mustang rotor that Turner uses lists for $152 dollars
      each at Autozone and is a special order part. If you do really feel
      nothing is overkill in brakes, then I suggest you buy my CNC brackets,
      then order Baer's 14 inch rotors and 6 piston calipers! Just select a
      94-04 Mustang when ordering. Though for those you will need to go
      at LEAST 17" wheels.

      I am running the Mustang Cobra front brakes, they are two piston PBR
      calipers (different then the GT two pistons) and 13" rotors. That is
      why I am running a 17" wheel, but as I said the 11" Mustang GT brakes
      fit fine in 15" wheels.

      Tom
      '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
      Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
      http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
      I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

      Comment


      • #18
        Tom,

        hate to threadjack, but do you have any idea if the 'stang brakes will fit in either a 15" MoPar wheel or a 15" typical 5-spoke alloy? (specifically Halibrands) also do they work OK with stock V-8 rear drums or would a prop valve be required? I am half fast thinking about taking the plunge, although I'd also need to acquire some hubs (as my front brakes are currently good usable 56-up V-8 finned drums.)

        thanks,

        Nate

        --
        55 Commander Starlight
        http://members.cox.net/njnagel
        --
        55 Commander Starlight
        http://members.cox.net/njnagel

        Comment


        • #19
          Nate, I can not confirm the fitment on those wheels, but the easiest
          way to check it is find someone with a 94-04 Mustang GT (they are
          everywhere) and ask nicely if you can mount your wheel on the front.
          Thats my best suggestion, as with offsets, and the shapes of the face
          of the wheel, there could be contact with the caliper somehow.

          I posted up my testing results with the GT front brakes and the Avanti
          rear drums. I didnt notice any difference in balance. It seemed as
          a good match. Granted I have a dual master cylinder and power brakes.
          That said, I put Stude disc brakes on my '60 Hawk without power assist
          and it worked fine. The testing results thread is one that is on my
          list of tech threads to update, unfortunately its locked and archived.
          Mr Shaw is feverishly working on how to allow me to update it & others.

          Tom
          '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
          Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
          http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
          I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

          Comment


          • #20
            So it sounds like I would want to find some Avanti rear brakes from somewhere if I were going to go with this conversion. I'll keep that in mind. I was not planning on adding power (as my car is a C-body) but I do have a Mitsu dual master that I was planning on adding when I get the chance to do it.

            nate

            --
            55 Commander Starlight
            http://members.cox.net/njnagel
            --
            55 Commander Starlight
            http://members.cox.net/njnagel

            Comment


            • #21
              I have the whole rear drum setup, as of the moment it is unspoken for.
              One of the drums I am told has two turns left, the other has one. The
              rear cylinders need rebuild, of course.

              I think the C/K cars have considerably better mechanical advantage. We
              put a Stude disc setup on my brothers '64 Daytona and it was undrivable
              without a power booster.[:0] Could also be the M/C bore size.

              Tom
              '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
              Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
              http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
              I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

              Comment


              • #22
                The '68 Ford LTD rotors are a drop on replacement on Studebaker spindles. That is what I have on my R1 Hawk. The only problem is they were a one year only Ford part. I got mine from a guy in GA that specializes in of all things '68 Ford LTD parts. Still plenty around but not available from NAPA or other sources I could find, and that was 13 years ago.

                Dan White
                64 R1 GT
                64 R2 GT
                Dan White
                64 R1 GT
                64 R2 GT
                58 C Cab
                57 Broadmoor (Marvin)

                Comment


                • #23
                  quote:Originally posted by Dan White

                  The '68 Ford LTD rotors are a drop on replacement on Studebaker spindles. That is what I have on my R1 Hawk. The only problem is they were a one year only Ford part.
                  I had to chuckle when I read this, so you replaced a four year Stude
                  part/30 year Avanti part with a one year only Ford part. The Stude
                  rotors are being reproduced, they are pricy, but probably easier to
                  find then the '68 Ford LTD part.

                  My goal was readily available virtually unmodified factory parts. The
                  only modification required is drilling the Ford rotor to the next size
                  SAE size for the wheel studs to locate them.

                  Tom
                  '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
                  Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
                  http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
                  I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Years ago I priced out doing the Turner system for my 62 Hardtop, I visited my local clutch and brake supplier to get an idea on rotor prices for the 69 mustang rotors needed...if I bought only the brackets from Turner. Looking through their parts books you could get rotors ranging from a low of $65.00 (China?) to $150.00+ but this was a couple of years ago and you do get what you pay for.

                    What is the difference between the Crown Vic wheels (15 X ?) and a set of 15 X 6 steel wheels from say a 1980s Mopar?

                    Jeff T.

                    "I'm getting nowhere as fast as I can"
                    The Replacements.
                    \"I\'m getting nowhere as fast as I can\"
                    The Replacements.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Buddy, The brakes come off 62-72 Mopar B bodies and 70-74 E bodies. I had some friends that raced 70-71 Dodge Chargers on circle tracks and they would give me their take offs since they used 11 3/4" JFZ parts for racing. I did notice that the rotors and hubs were different between some models and the single piston calipers had some variations.
                      We are talking about the early 80's so that has changed in the last 25 or 30 years. If you can get them free fine, otherwise buy them from Tom, or Turner.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Tom:

                        I am not as stupid as you apparently think I am! 13 years ago there were few options for Stude disk brake conversions. The PO of my car had switched the car back to drums and the only deal at the time was Dave Levesque's (early) kit that used the '68 Ford LTD rotors and large Mopar calipers. I figured that with no more than I drove the car the Ford LTD rotors would outlast whatever time I owned it. I can still find the LTD rotors from a number of Ford vendors I have checked just for fun over the years when I have gone to swap meets.

                        BTW the kit worked well when I installed it and it still works great today!!! It will also easily out brake my '64 R2 Hawk with stock Stude disks.

                        Also there was no modifications to the car, if one wanted to it could be changed back to stock without any problems.

                        Dan White
                        64 R1 GT
                        64 R2 GT
                        Dan White
                        64 R1 GT
                        64 R2 GT
                        58 C Cab
                        57 Broadmoor (Marvin)

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          quote:Originally posted by Dan White

                          I am not as stupid as you apparently think I am!
                          Dan,

                          I wasnt calling you stupid, I am sorry you took it that way. It was
                          just kinda funny how rare the part you found was, thats all I meant.
                          Needle in a hay stack for sure. If anything, I admire your resolve.

                          Tom
                          '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
                          Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
                          http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
                          I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Dan--How much larger in diameter are the Ford rotors over the Stude ones? And is that what you attribute your better braking to? (Over your 64)

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              quote:Originally posted by buddymander

                              Dan--How much larger in diameter are the Ford rotors over the Stude ones? And is that what you attribute your better braking to?
                              Probably is better due to the larger pad size, Stude discs have a very
                              small pad by todays standards. Most REAR pads are considerably larger
                              than Stude front pads. What IS interesting to note, the Stude discs
                              actually work very well, and quickly. The thin rotor heats up faster
                              than newer vented discs, which initially helps braking. As the rotor
                              expands the pads will bite harder, reducing your padal effort. The
                              extreme large brakes of today require more pedal effort usually. Some
                              racing brakes arent safe for street use simply because they stay so
                              cool, that unless they are being abused, the car is hard to stop. The
                              downside to the Stude brakes is also its "benefit", since they heat up
                              faster, they will fade quicker, so for serious stop and go, they are
                              going to fade, and make stopping at that point harder. Jag ended up
                              using the almost identical Stude/Jag front brake in the rear of their
                              later cars. Since rear brakes are like 30% stopping, you can see how
                              their rating ended up.

                              Tom
                              '63 Avanti R1, '03 Mustang Cobra 13" front disc/98 GT rear brakes, 03 Cobra 17" wheels, GM alt, 97 Z28 leather seats, TKO 5-spd, Ported heads w/SST full flow valves.
                              Check out my disc brake adapters to install 1994-2004 Mustang disc brakes on your Studebaker!!
                              http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.c...bracket-update
                              I have also written many TECH how to articles, do a search for my Forum name to find them

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Tom apology accepted. It was not me that found the '68 LTD rotors but Dave Levesque. He made quite a few of his early kits in the early to mid '90s and probably help deplete the OEM quantity of LTD rotors. Note the rotor disk are apparently still available new but the hubs themselves are not available new from any parts place I have checked.

                                Buddymander I will need to check when I get home this weekend I do not remember how much larger the LTD rotors are than the Studes but they are definitely larger, remember the '68 LTD was a pretty huge car and heavy. Also the LTD rotors were vented unlike the solid Stude ones so do not have the tendency to warp nearly as bad. I also believe that the Kelsey Hayes Mopar calipers in conjunction with the rotors are a major factor. These were used on Mopar large cars and police cars for many years so have some major grip. This kit along with the hydrovac booster will put you through the windshield if you stomp on it.

                                Obviously, the other kits available now with more common parts are as good and most likely better than this early kit but it was a great improvement over the original setup at the time and I like it much better than the front disk the PO had put on the car.

                                Dan White
                                64 R1 GT
                                64 R2 GT
                                Dan White
                                64 R1 GT
                                64 R2 GT
                                58 C Cab
                                57 Broadmoor (Marvin)

                                Comment

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