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Heater frustration

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  • Heater frustration

    The blower motor on my Lark has been non-op since I bought it. Studying the wiring diagram, I see that there's supposed to be a fuse in the WHT/BLK wire on the back of the switch, but I don't have one... all three wires disappear from the switch right into the wiring bundle.

    Can anyone tell me where this fuse can be found? I have a 63 Lark Standard.

    Thanks!


    [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

    Clark in San Diego
    '63 Lark Standard

    Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

  • #2
    The later factory wiring diagrams do leave a lot to be desired.
    The wiring diagrams say the heater fuse is above the hand brake, and it is. But it ain't easy to reach! Up in there you'll find the w/wiper circuit breaker with the purple wire on one post and a white/black wire along with a light grey wire on the other post. Follow that grey wire back a couple inches to where it becomes all but inaccessible and you'll see the fuse. I just verified this on a .......'63 Standard!
    I'll add this. You can see the back side of the blower switch pretty easy. Probe the terminals with a test light or voltmeter before you start fighting your way in to the fuse holder. Do you have a 1959-64 shop manual? The fuse is shown in a picture of the back side of the dash in the body section.


    Dwain G.

    Comment


    • #3
      quote:Originally posted by showbizkid

      The blower motor on my Lark has been non-op since I bought it. Studying the wiring diagram, I see that there's supposed to be a fuse in the WHT/BLK wire on the back of the switch, but I don't have one... all three wires disappear from the switch right into the wiring bundle. Can anyone tell me where this fuse can be found? I have a 63 Lark Standard.

      Clark
      Clark - I looked under the dash of my '63 station wagon. I don't see a fuse anywhere near the switch either, and I can't find a fuse holder in the wires to the motor. I checked the wiring diagram and, you are right, it shows a fuse in the wire from the heater motor switch. I always thought the heater motor was tied into one of the fuses on the fuse block under the left side of the dash. I haven't used this car for some time, so I have forgotten how this is wired. I guess I can't be much help without looking further in the daylight. Dale

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks for your help, Dwain. I got in there and traced things, but no joy. My harness is pretty beat up, and I think I'll eventually wind up replacing it.

        I found the windshield wiper breaker (that's the non-resettable one, right?). The gray wire splits into two; one of them runs back into the harness with no fuse holder in sight. The other one goes to a bayonet connector... and then nothing. Mine has no wire coming out the other side of the bayonet connector.

        Now, searching further, I found another gray wire with a bare end (!) sticking out of the wiring loom. The bare end looks slightly burnt. Feeling adventurous (and stupid), I stuck the gray wire into the bayonet connector and was rewarded with a spark, after which I disconnected them immediately [:I] But is this where it's supposed to go? Shouldn't gray go to gray?

        Sheesh. [xx(]


        [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

        Clark in San Diego
        '63 Lark Standard

        Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

        Comment


        • #5
          Yeah, it sounds like you found the two ends of the wire that used to have a fuse holder in between them. I think I'd pull the three wires off the blower switch, and then try touching the grey wire again. Maybe there won't be a spark this time.


          Dwain G.

          Comment


          • #6
            Today's update: I am more frustrated than ever [V]

            I measured the gray wire with the ignition in the ON and ACC positions, and it carried no voltage. Feeling confident that this was the lost heater power link, I jumpered it to the mystery bayonet gray wire coming off the wiper breaker, switched the key to ON and hit the fan switch.

            Nothing.

            Meanwhile, I did find a big, black wire in the area behind the speedometer with an inline fuse holder. It contains a 20-amp (!) fuse. Examining the wiring diagram, it calls for NO fuses in any black-wire circuit, and NO 20-amp fuses anywhere in the car. I checked the fuse; it is good. But I don't know what the hell this wire feeds.

            Finally, I tested the white/black wire connected to the Heater switch, which I assume is the hot wire (since the red and black correspond to the red and black that feed the heater blower motor). With the gray wire jumpered and without, in ON, ACC and OFF, there was no voltage.

            I curse the fleas of a thousand camels onto whatever "mechanic" took it upon themselves to futz with this car's wiring [}][xx(][8] Any ideas?


            [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

            Clark in San Diego
            '63 Lark Standard

            Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

            Comment


            • #7
              When you jumped the grey (beige, off-white, whatever it is) wire ends together, you certainly should have had power to the same wire at the blower switch. Is there power to the w/wiper circuit breaker? You mentioned red and black wires at the blower switch? Besides the grey wire, there should only be a red and a yellow wire there. There might be a black ground wire coming out of the blower motor though. I'm not surprised the fan didn't work. It's probably seized up or shorted out.
              The black wire with a 20a fuse probably comes from the ammeter terminal with the red wire, and goes to the cigarette lighter.


              Dwain G.

              Comment


              • #8
                quote:Originally posted by Dwain G.

                When you jumped the grey (beige, off-white, whatever it is) wire ends together, you certainly should have had power to the same wire at the blower switch. Is there power to the w/wiper circuit breaker?
                Yes, and the wipers work normally with both speeds.

                quote:You mentioned red and black wires at the blower switch? Besides the grey wire, there should only be a red and a yellow wire there.
                Sorry, I meant red and yellow [:I] Too many colors to keep track of here!

                quote:There might be a black ground wire coming out of the blower motor though. I'm not surprised the fan didn't work. It's probably seized up or shorted out.
                There is a black wire coming from the blower motor, but it's soldered to a ground lug on the blower case itself. Guess my next test is to apply 12v to the motor and see if it turns.

                quote:The black wire with a 20a fuse probably comes from the ammeter terminal with the red wire, and goes to the cigarette lighter.
                Guess I'll have to trace it... the cigarette lighter doesn't work either Thanks Dwain! Stand by for the next installment!


                [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

                Clark in San Diego
                '63 Lark Standard

                Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  Well, I think the heater blower is bad. I removed the leads and applied 14v direct and got nothing back. Voltmeter measured 9.5 volts, so something was drawing 5 volts and doing nothing.

                  I think I'm going to have to put a new harness in this car. Every time I get under the dash I find something else weird. Today I found evidence of a previous wire fire - the plastic tape on the main harness split all along the length of a blue wire, and melted insulation on that wire.

                  She's sleeping with the battery disconnected tonight [:0]

                  Thanks for the help!


                  [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

                  Clark in San Diego
                  '63 Lark Standard

                  Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    i think blue is the feed to the horn relay, bad juju, that's one of the few unprotected wires in the harness. the others are the ones between the starter solenoid and ammeter, and also ammeter to ignition switch. If any one of those are in any way questionable, it's probably a good idea to replace them or carefully insulate the trouble spots before rewrapping. If you're going to patch up the existing harness and aren't concerned about originality for shows, a couple well placed fusible links wouldn't be an entirely bad idea.

                    nate

                    --
                    55 Commander Starlight
                    http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel
                    --
                    55 Commander Starlight
                    http://members.cox.net/njnagel

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Frankly N8N, I'm scared sh**less to drive it anywhere but the shop until I replace the harness [8)] No way do I want something to let go in transit, and I just discovered another unidentified wiring bundle under the dash - 2 red wires, both with bare ends, and a big black one that measures 14 volts with the key off - bare end wrapped in black tape [:0] I'm surprised this car hasn't burnt up.


                      [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

                      Clark in San Diego
                      '63 Lark Standard

                      Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If it had a "melt-down", it was more than likely from the horn relay.... they are noted for shorting out and as Nate says, they are not protected by a fuse, circuit breaker or a fuseable link. Check to see if the harness thst goes to the horn relay has been melted and retaped....it probably has.[xx(]
                        Dan

                        Road Racers turn left AND right.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          You're right, that's the wire. It's been replaced with a stretch of brown zip cord [xx(]


                          [img=left]http://members.cox.net/clarknovak/lark.gif[/img=left]

                          Clark in San Diego
                          '63 Lark Standard

                          Clark in San Diego | '63 Standard (F2) "Barney" | http://studeblogger.blogspot.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            One thing to keep in mind (and Dwain sorta alluded to it in one of his replies) is that after 43 years, this plastic wiring has held up pretty well but it's colors haven't always stayed true. Yellow can look white or vise versa. Black can be blue, red can look pink and so on and so on. Further, the "tracer" colors can be gone or tainted by the main color of the wire or the black wrapping tape. It's not that they didn't use quality wire, it's just 43 years old and colors can leach, fade, or turn altogether.[B)]
                            In your case, with obvious modifications that defy deciphering, a new harness (NOS ones aren't that expensive)would put things right again. Add an inline fuse holder to the feed to the horn since they're a known problem.

                            Miscreant at large.

                            1957 Transtar 1/2ton
                            1960 Larkvertible V8
                            1958 Provincial wagon
                            1953 Commander coupe
                            1957 President 2-dr
                            1955 President State
                            1951 Champion Biz cpe
                            1963 Daytona project FS
                            No deceptive flags to prove I'm patriotic - no biblical BS to impress - just ME and Studebakers - as it should be.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I'm not going to say that you *need* a new wiring harness... I patched up one almost as bad in my '55 coupe (heater blower section had burned up due to having the circuit breaker bypassed) BUT I will say this - you're having trouble with your headlights as well, you are finding little surprises everywhere, and unless you know the Stude wiring harness color codes off the top of your head you will probably feel a lot more confident in your car if you just go ahead and replace it. For the price of a NOS harness, that seems to be a pretty good return on investment.

                              Now for the bad news - the easy way to replace the wiring harness in a Lark is to pull the whole dashboard out of the car and set it on your lap while you're working.

                              good luck,

                              nate

                              --
                              55 Commander Starlight
                              http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel
                              --
                              55 Commander Starlight
                              http://members.cox.net/njnagel

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