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Chevy 292 in 1940 commander coupe?

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  • #16
    I've done a lot of these types of conversions, and I wish you hadn't committed to the S-10 deal. I see two very simple solutions. Are you sure you aren't just a TRAIN engineer??? First;; Where in the world did you get those humongous u-joints?? Try some smaller u-joints and closer to the box (or farther away; weld a longer shaft on the box) and closer to the firewall. Second, if you bend the steering arms down, you can lower the box and the idler. That would be like the avanti quick arms. Also, you can twist the box slightly up or down and drill new frame holes ; that would relocate the lower u-joint. Are you sure you even need TWO u-joints? Looks like you might be able to snake that shaft thru the headers. If you could move the box closer to the frame, you might be able to eliminate both u-joints. I've done the front stub dealie enough times to know it creates the necessity of fabbing up a ton of extra brackets.

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    • #17
      I can see where you are coming from, and have thought about moving everything down and getting rid of the large u-joints. The u-joints aren't much of a problem. But keeping the old stuff, I'm still left with a primitive suspension that most likely won't stand up to the increased weight, horsepower, and needs of today's driving.

      It's basically a 3-way struggle. 1) keep the stock frontend and try to track down new replacement bushings, brake parts, etc and try to salvage it, hope for the best once I start bending and tweeking the 68yr old parts. Pray that I don't end up with bump steer. 2) Put in a newer more modern frontend that uses cheap readily available parts. End up waiting for the right one to come along 3) Just say screw it and wait around until I can afford to drop in a Fatman frontend.

      I did try the S-10 front. Would go in perfectly if it wasn't for the steering box. It pushed out too far past the front wheels. Ends up being about 5" too long at the box. It was worth the try to know that if I was to go for modern IFS I could modify this clip easier with a smaller steering box (vega style) and push all the stuff up front closer to the rear. It would work pretty well then.

      Still not any closer to a decision. But I did have a buddy offer to give me a Chevy 250 inliner for free. I'm thinking of running it anyway just to have something different than a SBC. Could sell the SBC that I already built to get up $ for the fatman front. All just a matter of making the choice that makes the most sense. Still thinking it all over.



      Looking for 1939-1940 Commander coupe running boards.

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      • #18
        Put in a 4.3 Chev. V6 A few aluminum parts and the front end is 400lbs. lighter than stock. And the weight is further back. That and you can get over 500 HP out of 'em if you want.

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        • #19
          What Alan said. My buddy has a 4.3 in his 39 and its stock and runs like a dream.

          David Baggett '53 coupe

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          • #20
            You won't end up with bump steer if your tie rods are level when the car is loaded. I'd love to see that transverse spring all powdercoated and trimmed out with polished stainless bolts. Add disc brakes and a thick sway bar and by golly you got something there. I guess I could see a six if it was to be a daily driver, but fuggetaboutit if you wanna call it a hot rod.

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            • #21
              quote:Originally posted by buddymander

              I could see a six if it was to be a daily driver, but fuggetaboutit if you wanna call it a hot rod.
              Probably have a mis-comunication on terms here. When I think of hot rod, I think traditional loud, uncomfortable, easy to fix, fun play toy that would have scared the pants off your date's parents when you pull in the driveway. Street rod to me is something that you get in turn on the a/c and buy all the billet you can throw at it from a catalog. When you roll to the supermarket the old ladys call it "cute". I'm sure that there are a lot of people that disagree, but that's not the issue at hand.

              Part of the hot rodding experience (in my opinion) is doing something slightly different then the rest of the guys out there. I really don't find a cookie cutter tri-5 chevy with a 350 all that interesting because everybody has one. That's why I ended up with a studebaker!

              As for the straight 6's not being a hot rod motor, you might want to take a look back at history. They have massive amounts of torque and there are plenty of aftermarket parts available. Lots of these sixes were on the strip back in the 60's. Guys like Santucci, Sissel, Langdon, Kirby, etc were pushing these things into the record books.

              Check out some of these links, you might end up retracting that hot rod comment.
              http://www.customdesignperformance.com/leo/leo.html
              http://www.sissellsautomotive.com/
              http://www.goravenswood.com/six.htm
              www.cliffordperformance.com

              In any event, I tried the S-10 frontend. It would have been a good fit if it wasn't for the forward mounted steering box. Would need to lop 5" out of the box to make it work. The stock frontend is not going to stay. I can't find the proper replacement parts to rebuild it safely and I have been finding some redneck engineering that it has received over the years that I'm not comfortable with.

              So what I've decided, is to sell my sbc and use the $ to fund the Fatman frontend. As much as I hate to do it, it is probably the most logical decision in consideration of time and long term cost.

              I'm using the remainder of teh funds to buy some performance parts for the 292 that I recently picked up. I considered sticking with the V8, but after some soul searching, I came to the realization that I would probably end up with a 6er in it anyway just for cool factor. You don't see a 292 powered stude biz coupe very often, plus the low end torque would be perfect for getting that big body moving. I also wanted to stay somewhat true to the original spirit of the car. A 6er would look right at home under the hood.

              Additionally the 292 will bolt right to my trans without any work, which also saves me from having to mess with more obstacles. The only other issues I'll have are having to recess the firewall 3" and having to trim the driveshaft.

              I'll update as the project moves forward. Maybe I can convert some non-believers in the end....

              Looking for 1939-1940 Commander coupe running boards.

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              • #22
                Also might tell these fellas that they don't have hot rods....cause they might not know yet:







                Looking for 1939-1940 Commander coupe running boards.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Have you ever considered installing a Mustang ifs using the factory Mustang crossmember ? I've done it several times. I've done Chevys , including my own 40 sedan , and some Studebakers. Although I have not done a 40 model I did a 50 starlite and a 64 Commander.On the Studebakers I've done the Mustang crossmember gets cut into three pieces , like the aftermarket ones. Thanks.

                  thom
                  thom

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                  • #24
                    my sensitive ears can't stand the sound of a six. I had one in a 69 chevy van and it kept giving me a headache. I put a 400 sbc in it and presto; no more aspirin! That fatman stuff is just a bunch of outdated aftermarket ripoff moneymaker for some lucky stiff. I'd go with Aerostar way before I laid out my hard earned cash for a bunch of metal plate that incorporates a ton of expensive aftermarket components.

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                    • #25
                      So here's the follow-up.... I decided to go with a parallel leaf straight axle frontend. I'm using a 7" drop axle with a set of new 48-54 chevy spindles and a new disk brake conversion kit. I'll mount a vega or similar steering box for cross-steering and should be good to go.

                      I have no illusions that this set-up will handle as well as a MII. I know it's still going to handle like a car with a straight axle, but I got everything for this frontend for $942 shipped from MAS. That's less than half of what a MII frontend would cost me even before shipping.

                      I'm going to lop the frame behind the stock front suspension then weld in 2x4 box channel to make the front frame rails. Since the frame pinch will no longer be there, the springs will be able to sit wider and I won't have to deal with as much body roll. I'll also have plenty of room for just about any steering box I use.

                      I think the straight axle will look more at home in the car as well. And, if I ever decide to go gasser, all I have to do is whip a different axle in there. Hoping to start in on it this coming weekend. I'll post pictures once I get started.

                      Looking for 1939-1940 Commander coupe running boards.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        I like the way this guy took an oil filter cover and made a distributor cover out of it..
                        Must have taken a whole six pack (pun intended) to thread the plug wires through there[:0]
                        Jeff[8D]



                        quote:Originally posted by trump

                        Also might tell these fellas that they don't have hot rods....cause they might not know yet:
                        http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock
                        HTIH (Hope The Info Helps)

                        Jeff


                        Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain



                        Note: SDC# 070190 (and earlier...)

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                        • #27
                          quote:Originally posted by trump

                          I'm stuck in my project. <snip>
                          I've been watching this thread with some interest..
                          I can tell a lot of poster's havent seen a Planar suspension setup all denuded.
                          I can see some of your angst about making a big project a HUGE project.
                          But just take it in steps.
                          Your thought process about the GM six has merit.
                          Plenty of power, and hop up stuff available.
                          But...
                          If you 'only' choose the powerplant change to solve your Planar issues...
                          You'll still be stuck with the Planar..
                          What would be pretty neat would be to play up on the Planar wierdnass and science that out...
                          You'd turn heads for sure...
                          And, with a six in there... You'd be able to see the Planar down there...
                          Interesting thread....
                          Jeff[8D]


                          http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock
                          HTIH (Hope The Info Helps)

                          Jeff


                          Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain



                          Note: SDC# 070190 (and earlier...)

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I'm leaving the planar in my CE project.No reason it wont work ok and there is a local Stude guy working on a bolt on disc brake kit for his planar.Since the 4.0 Jeep engine wont work(I wont cut the firewall)I'm still investigating drivetrain options.
                            Another thought...there has been some discussion on Hamb and some Gasser sites that the MAS axle is too light and has bent under use.I should qualify that by saying the problems have occured under drag racing situations.Your results may vary.
                            Mono mind in a stereo world

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                            • #29
                              quote:Originally posted by DEEPNHOCK

                              quote:Originally posted by trump

                              I'm stuck in my project. <snip>
                              I've been watching this thread with some interest..
                              I can tell a lot of poster's havent seen a Planar suspension setup all denuded.
                              I can see some of your angst about making a big project a HUGE project.
                              But just take it in steps.
                              Your thought process about the GM six has merit.
                              Plenty of power, and hop up stuff available.
                              But...
                              If you 'only' choose the powerplant change to solve your Planar issues...
                              You'll still be stuck with the Planar..
                              What would be pretty neat would be to play up on the Planar wierdnass and science that out...
                              You'd turn heads for sure...
                              And, with a six in there... You'd be able to see the Planar down there...
                              Interesting thread....
                              Jeff[8D]


                              http://community.webshots.com/user/deepnhock

                              I originally planned on trying to use the I6 as a way of getting around having to change the frontend. But along the way, I fell in love with the idea of having the 6 banger in there despite whatever my frontend choices happened to be. As many SBCs as I have built and used, I'm just tired of them and want to give something else a try.

                              During this thought process, I also came to the realization that:
                              -The old suspension is not up to snuff for the job and would require replacement parts that would still cost money
                              -I'd still be stuck with old drum brakes
                              -$2225 after shipping for a Fatman MII is obscene! Plus it would look out of place on this project.

                              I went with the straight axle front because:
                              -It was a reasonable price (comparatively)
                              -It gives me new, easily replacable suspension/brake parts that aren't expensive to replace when needed
                              -I can run disk brakes
                              -I've had pick-up trucks that have has straight axles and don't mind the ride
                              -It would look more at home in this type of project
                              -The 7" drop should allow me to get a nice looking stance
                              -I'll have plenty of room between the frame rail afterward to mount just about anything I want in there if I end up not liking the 6 banger.

                              I'm kind of excited to try it all out. I've heard amazing stories about the Chevy 292 when hopped up. I'm also starting to delve into some other unfamiliar territory by using a 200R4 overdrive. I've always run TH-350s, but going to try out an overdrive this time.

                              With everything hot rodding, trial and error is part of it. But I guess we'll never know until we try.

                              As for the MAS axles bending, I'm sure with enough abuse anything will bend. I've been following the same threads over there and it seems that those that are happy with them out number those who are unhappy with them. Still to this day, I have never seen a picture or example of one of their axles that have been bent after use. Which makes me wonder if it's all just typing for the sake of typing something. I don't plan on racing, so the biggest problem I'll most likely face would be a road trip through michigan's pot holes. Either way, I'm sure I'll find out soon enough for myself whether it's a good product or not. If I bend it somehow, I'll post some backup support to let everybody know so they don't have to make their decision based on hear-say.

                              I'll try to keep current on this thread and let everybody know how it goes. I plan to take a lot of pictures.

                              Looking for 1939-1940 Commander coupe running boards.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                If getting the exhaust out is your major problem Crane offers just the plates that bolt to the heads and you can build your own manifolds like I did for my 64. I used round and square tubeing and welded them with a wire welder. I am on my second set in twenty years.

                                The inline bowtie six will also fit but you will have to channel your firewall cause the engine is to long and run an electric radiator fan.

                                I have a bowtie 250 in the 54 with a manual sanginaw three speed transmission. I used a Firebird hydraulic belhousing and have the master cylinder mounted underneat and it works off the stock clutch linkage with a custom end pivot. I use remote resevoirs to keep the master cylinder and hydraulic clutch resevoirs filled.

                                Yes I have a hill holder too that was a bugger to get ajusted because of the different throw of the hydraulic linkage.

                                If you car is ugly then it better be fast.....

                                65 2dr sedan
                                64 2dr sedan (Pinkie)
                                61 V8 Tcab
                                61 Tcab 20R powered
                                55 Commander Wagon
                                54 Champion Wagon
                                46 Gibson Model A
                                50 JD MC
                                If you car is ugly then it better be fast.....

                                65 2dr sedan
                                64 2dr sedan (Pinkie)
                                61 V8 Tcab
                                63 Tcab 20R powered
                                55 Commander Wagon
                                54 Champion Wagon
                                46 Gibson Model A
                                50 JD MC
                                45 Agricat
                                67 Triumph T100
                                66 Bultaco Matadore

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