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6 Cyl OHV Red Line ?

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  • Engine: 6 Cyl OHV Red Line ?

    I have a very smooth running 6 in my 1963 Champ. Studebaker rated this engine as 110 HP at 4500 RPM. However, 4000 RPM seems to be the maximum in my truck. At 4000 RPM it sounds and feels maxed out and there's no way I'm going to push it any further. Question is what is the maximum RPM these engines are capable of ?

  • #2
    Some years ago, John R. Bond, a former Studebaker engineer and later editor of Motor Trend and founder of Road & Track stated the Champion was the first engine of its era that would take 5,000 RPM at full throttle for hours on dyno tests.

    Just remember, that was a new engine just off the assembly line. Your results may vary after more than fifty years of questionable maintenance, possibly a shadetree rebuild and wear in parts unknown.

    Two points of clarification, as Bond's comment was the early, shortest stroke design:

    The OHV heads cracked in normal use. Extended high RPM full throttle use might be not a good thing.

    Also, the longer stroke '55-58 engines definitely don't appreciate more than 4,000 RPM.

    jack vines
    Last edited by PackardV8; 08-24-2019, 10:23 AM.
    PackardV8

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    • #3
      If the engine "feels" maxed out as you put it, you are most likely dealing with weak valve springs that won't allow you to go to 4500 or 5000 rpm. This is not uncommon in an older engine with a lot of miles on it, or an engine that has been rebuilt somewhat recently...but the rebuilder did not check the actual spring pressure and either replace them or shim them to the proper seat pressure.

      As Jack sorta notes, just drive it as is. If you want more horse power, then do a "proper" rebuild buy someone than knows engines and that the valve springs are actually a big part of the rebuild.

      Mike

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      • #4
        What your Champ needs is HIGHER gearing, if you do not have Overdrive you need that as well.

        Both will work well for a "Grocery Getter" driver, Pickup, not used to haul much more than a Passenger.

        A 3.73 to 1 Ratio Ring and Pinion can be installed in your Differential, and a T-89 Borg Warner Overdrive Trans. can be found, not as easily, but they ARE out there.
        StudeRich
        Second Generation Stude Driver,
        Proud '54 Starliner Owner



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        • #5
          My 53 stump puller would do 45MPH flat out no OD, I don't know the RPMs but it was howling. It started its life as a farm truck and I used it for similar purposes to build my house, it carried most of the materials. One time my friend had a quantity of 18 foot 2X6 and we placed our pickups back to back and loaded the planks in the boxes. We drove about a mile him forward and me reverse, what you won't do for free lumber.

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          • #6
            I agree with the OP, about 4000 RPM is all I ever felt comfortable with in Stude V8 motors. They are versatile, and will do anything for a little while, but seem happiest at 2000-3000 RPM (quieter, cooler, less gas and oil consumption). WIth a V8 there's more power to work with, so there's a wider variance of power and speed combos. With the lil 6, you can gear up to slow the motor down, but still may hit a wall of about 70 MPH due to power limits. The motor will probably be much happier though if turning 3000 or less at 70, versus 4000+.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by JoeHall View Post
              I agree with the OP, about 4000 RPM is all I ever felt comfortable with in Stude V8 motors. They are versatile, and will do anything for a little while, but seem happiest at 2000-3000 RPM (quieter, cooler, less gas and oil consumption). WIth a V8 there's more power to work with, so there's a wider variance of power and speed combos. With the lil 6, you can gear up to slow the motor down, but still may hit a wall of about 70 MPH due to power limits. The motor will probably be much happier though if turning 3000 or less at 70, versus 4000+.
              For true, Joe; engines are most efficient at their torque peak. The regular Studebaker V8s make their peak torque @ 2800-3000 RPM.

              1964
              1 Bbl 3.0 x 4.0 170 8.25 112 @ 4500 154 @ 2000
              2 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.25 259 8.5 180 @ 4500 260 @ 2800
              4 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.25 259 8.5 195 @ 3000 265 @ 3000
              2 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.625 289 8.5 200 @ 4500 295 @ 2800
              2 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.625 289 8.5 210 @ 4500 300 @ 2800
              4 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.625 289 8.8 225 @ 4500 305 @ 3000
              R1 3.5625 x 3.625 289 10.25 240 @ 4500 305 @ 3000
              R2 3.5625 x 3.625 289 9.0 289 @ 4500 305 @ 3000
              R4 3.6563 x 3.625 305 12.0 280 @ 4500 340 @ 3000
              R3 3.6563 x 3.625 305 9.6 335 @ 4500 305 @ 3000

              Anyone notice at least five contradictions in the above chart edited from carnut.com ?

              jack vines
              Last edited by PackardV8; 08-25-2019, 04:01 PM.
              PackardV8

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              • #8
                Originally posted by PackardV8 View Post
                For true, Joe; engines are most efficient at their torque peak. The regular Studebaker V8s make their peak torque @ 2800-3000 RPM.

                1964
                1 Bbl 3.0 x 4.0 170 8.25 112 @ 4500 154 @ 2000
                2 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.25 259 8.5 180 @ 4500 260 @ 2800
                4 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.25 259 8.5 195 @ 3000 265 @ 3000
                2 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.625 289 8.5 200 @ 4500 295 @ 2800
                2 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.625 289 8.5 210 @ 4500 300 @ 2800
                4 Bbl 3.5625 x 3.625 289 8.8 225 @ 4500 305 @ 3000
                R1 3.5625 x 3.625 289 10.25 240 @ 4500 305 @ 3000
                R2 3.5625 x 3.625 289 9.0 289 @ 4500 305 @ 3000
                R4 3.6563 x 3.625 305 12.0 280 @ 4500 340 @ 3000
                R3 3.6563 x 3.625 305 9.6 335 @ 4500 305 @ 3000

                Anyone notice at least five contradictions in the above chart edited from carnut.com ?

                jack vines
                The R4 Dual 4's could not have 340 Ft. Lbs.

                The R3 cannot be: Rated 335 @ 4500 and ONLY 305 @ ONLY 3000

                The Std. 4V 289, R1 and R2 cannot be 305 Ft. Lbs. Torque at 3000! Only the first one is correct!

                The 4 Brl. 259 Cannot be 265 ft. Lbs.@3000
                Last edited by StudeRich; 08-25-2019, 05:00 PM.
                StudeRich
                Second Generation Stude Driver,
                Proud '54 Starliner Owner



                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by StudeRich View Post
                  The R4 Dual 4's could not have 340 Ft. Lbs.

                  The R3 cannot be: Rated 335 @ 4500 and ONLY 305 @ ONLY 3000

                  The Std. 4V 289, R1 and R2 cannot be 305 Ft. Lbs. Torque at 3000! Only the first one is correct!

                  The 4 Brl. 259 Cannot be 265 ft. Lbs.@3000
                  Very good, Rich.
                  (Of course you meant to write:
                  "The 4-bbl 259" should have its horsepower peak at 4500, not 3000.
                  And how can the 259" 4bbl make 15 more horsepower, than the 2bbl, but only 5 more lbs/ft of torque?)
                  Last edited by PackardV8; 08-25-2019, 05:10 PM.
                  PackardV8

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                  • #10
                    I admit I do not have it ALL correct, but I think they pulled these numbers from SOMEWHERE besides an Engine Dyno!
                    StudeRich
                    Second Generation Stude Driver,
                    Proud '54 Starliner Owner



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