Engine: Swap to Ford 390fe

[Sumo]

Hello ,

I have a Studebaker gt hawk 1964, I bought the gt already with a 302 and c4.now the 302 has a blow by.
here is my question: did anybody swap to 390fe with fmx ?( got a nice offer)
already,read that the fmx was an additional option for the gt.
As I am located in Germany I need some details concerning, the subframe,oilpan,and steering...if there too close to 390fe...

Many thx....greetings from berlin

[WinM1895]

Hello ,

I have a Studebaker GT Hawk 1964, I bought the GT already with a 302 and C4, now the 302 has a blow by.
Here is my question: did anybody swap to 390FE with FMX? (got a nice offer) already, read that the fmx was an additional option for the GT Impossible!

As I am located in Germany I need some details concerning, the subframe, oilpan, and steering...if there too close to 390FE...

Many thx....greetings from Berlin

No Studebaker used an FMX because it was introduced in 1969. Plus, it was not installed with FE engines.

390 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars: 1961/66, some 1967: MX Cruise-O-Matic // some 1967, 1968/71 C6.

360/390 1968/76 F100/350: C6.

On sale day, 352 & 360 magically become 390's! Measure the stroke to verify: 352/360 = 3.50" .. 390 = 3.78."

IMO you should either stick with the 302 or install a 351W .. FE engines are huge heavy boat anchors.

I don't know if any members of this Studebaker forum will know about FE engines or how they would fit into a GT

[Sumo]

No Studebaker used an FMX because it was introduced in 1969. Plus, it was not installed with FE engines.

390 Ford/Merc Passenger Cars: 1961/66, some 1967: MX Cruise-O-Matic // some 1967, 1968/71 C6.

360/390 1968/76 F100/350: C6.

On sale day, 352 & 360 magically become 390's! Measure the stroke to verify: 352/360 = 3.50" .. 390 = 3.78."

IMO you should either stick with the 302 or install a 351W .. FE engines are huge heavy boat anchors.

I don't know if any members of this Studebaker forum will know about FE engines or how they would fit into a GT

Hello,

okay, thx for the quick response, only seen that the studebaker woodie from the sema had a 390fe....but I think will use again 302... much easier...
and concerning the 390 , my Idea was using the c4 with adapter plate..., I think to the passenger / driverside the 390fe needs about 4 cm more than the 302...and there is the steering and the oilpan the problem... and i wont weld the subframe or the sidewalls..so thx for the support...

[t walgamuth]

I have a Cobra replica now and so belong to two Cobra forums. The FE is discussed there because the 427 version of it was original equipment on the late cobras with dry sump to lower the hood line. Traditionalists insist on the FE but It is a very big heavy engine ...(though probably not heavier than the Studebaker engine).

I'd recommend a Windsor based ford engine. I know they can be built up to at least 427 CI. They are also available in aluminum now so can be pretty light.

My cobra has a 350 based aluminum 427 ci Chevy engine. It was already built when I bought it. Chevy parts are a lot more available but the Ford engines are a lot more compact. If I were building a cobra from scratch I'd probably use a Ford small block (Windsor).

With a Studebaker there is plenty of room in the engine bay for even the uber bulky original Hemi.

The small block Chevy is so common that that is a negative for me but the availability of after market parts is nothing to sneeze at.

[Mike Van Veghten]

Sumo -

Seems no one recognizes that you "have" access to the 390 and trans.

It really doesn't matter if anyone else has done this swap. If you have the parts, the wherewith all and the ability...do it.
As noted, the 390 is a large heavy engine. Horse power to weight might be better served with a 351C (Cleveland). If you are going to swap in a Ford of some sort, I would NOT use a 289, 352, 360 engine.
But again, if the 390 is on hand and cheap...go for it.

Mike

[WinM1895]

Seems no one recognizes that you "have" access to the 390 and trans.

I recognize it and I also know quite a bit about FE engines. I've owned dozens of Ford vehicles with FE engines, was a Ford parts guy for 30+ years, have been a member of a Ford truck site (ford-trucks.com) for 12 years where I have over 80,000 posts.

I'd be willing to bet that the OP doesn't know what the "390" is from. 1958/64 FE engines are different than 1965/76 FE engines, the OP will need to find the block casting number and date code to determine what year it is. There no way to determine the size by looking at it, measuring the stroke will pin it down somewhat.

Parts for any Ford V8 engine will be difficult to find in Europe, the last year/vehicles FE engines were installed: 1976 F100/350 360/390.

[swvalcon]

Only reasons I can see to use a 390 is it's free and even then may not be worth it. It's just a big heavy gas eating boat anchor. If you want the most bang for your buck get a LS motor with trans with all the electronics even if you have to buy it state side and have it shipped.

[acolds]

Being a Studebaker person makes you a different kid of person using a unusual Fe Ford motor is a sign to me that you march to a different drum. If you do the swap almost for sure you won't be one of the many .Different by Desire rather than be a copy cat type of swap.

[WinM1895]

IMO, the OP should fix what he's got (302), then won't need to swap anything. OP says there's blow by, but it might not be blow by...at all.

If the smog valve is defective, engine fumes will waft thru the engine compartment, eventually into the passenger compartment.

[Noxnabaker]

Difficult to find US Ford parts in Europe? Why? At least not in Sweden & I reckon there's quite a few Fairlanes & such in Germany too...

[bensherb]

IMO, the OP should fix what he's got (302), then won't need to swap anything. OP says there's blow by, but it might not be blow by...at all.

I agree! However, how do you guys determine the FE is a huge heavy "boat anchor"? Compare it to the Stude 289 and the weight is the same, the overall dimensions are also very very close, and mine get about the same mpg as my Stude. The FE is no more an anchor than is the Stude V8.

I see no reason the FE would not fit as well as the stock Stude V8. If the price is right, why not try it? Though, rings and bearings in the small block would be cheaper and easier.

I've installed an FE in my 1954 Chevy wagon and my '29 Model A, also had them in my Thunderbird and F100. All have/had a C6 trans. The FMX is basically the heavy duty MX internals in the smaller FX case, roughly the same size as the Stude Flight-o-matic/Ford-o-matic so I wouldn't expect a lot of fitment problems there.

[WinM1895]

Difficult to find US Ford parts in Europe? Why? At least not in Sweden & I reckon there's quite a few Fairlanes & such in Germany too...

Yes, there are US cars in Europe, one guy in Sweden has 100's, but who has replacement parts in Europe?

On the Ford truck site I'm on, there are people in Europe crying for parts. If they were readily available, then no one would be asking.

Green Sales Co. in Cincinnati OH has the largest stock of Ford obsolete parts on the planet, ships "across the pond" via Fed-Ex.

But most people don't want to pay the expensive shipping charges. Same thing holds true for Carpenter and all the other repro parts sellers.

[Sumo]

Hello,many thx for the answers ..I already had several t Birds with 390fe,for me a good reliable engine,and concerning the weight it about 45kg heavier than the original 289 stude,
Actually, I bought now an Aussie 302/351.
Normally,I would go for an original 289,but here in Europe it's impossible, and I don't have the connection to the Swedish guys.
And from US ,I would have to pay a lot of taxes for import...

[bensherb]

Hello,many thx for the answers ..I already had several t Birds with 390fe,for me a good reliable engine,and concerning the weight it about 45kg heavier than the original 289 stude,

?? 45kg heavier; 99.2lbs? No. Here's some info from google and this forum.

"A Ford FE from the factory weighed 650 lb (295 kg) with all iron components, while similar seven-liter offerings from GM and Chrysler weighed over 700 lb (318 kg). With an aluminum intake and aluminum water pump the FE could be reduced to under 600 lb (272 kg)."

( From personal experiance I know swapping the iron manifold for an aluminum one will cut 45-50 lbs)

" To get a Studebaker V8 down to 620# would be without bellhousing, clutch, flywheel, starter, generator, carburetor and maybe a few other externals.

From an observed weight on a certified scale, a 259" Studebaker V8, with all the above accessories, ready-to-run, but dry, weighs 695#.

jack vines"

"Well here are some of the big engines from the same era and a couple perhaps a little newer

331 Hemi - 745 lbs
331 Cad - 699 lbs.
390 Cad - 720 lbs.
BBC/Mark iV - 685 lbs.
401 Buick - 685 lbs.
352 Packard - 698 lbs.
374 Packard - 705 lbs"

[Buzzard]

Hello Berlin,
Perhaps a little off topic but some random comments on your proposal:
We had a customer with a bone stock 1968 Mustang Fastback (Steve McQueen lookalike), 390, 335HP, 4 speed and it ran real strong. Definitely NOT boat anchor territory.
As for auto transmissions, my trans expert custom built my '63 Stude GT powershift automatic using specialty parts for an FMX from TransGo in California. This combined with a custom built 10" Pinto converter makes it superb in my R4 clone GT. So it is doable and satisfying when completed.
Good luck and keep us posted with your progress.
Bill