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Starter keeps spinning even when the key is in the off position on a French 62 Daytona 6 cyl auto.

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  • Electrical: Starter keeps spinning even when the key is in the off position on a French 62 Daytona 6 cyl auto.

    G'day blokes.
    yesterday I liberated a Belgian registered, but Paris delivered from Du Jardin, 62 Daytona hardtop 6 cyl car to the UK. A low mileage 64 GT was also purchased at the same time, but it is a D'Ieteren assembled car.

    The car has a genuine 55k original km on the clock and has not been run in about 10 years. It came from the last surviving Studebaker dealer in Belgium who died a few years ago at 101 Karl Goret.

    Anyway, today in my garage back in the UK I put a battery in the car and turned the key to the 'on' position check lights and systems. Everything worked except the blinkers. Then I turned the key all the way to crank it a few times after I had checked that the motor actually turned by hand.

    The motor only cranked slowly. So even though I had charged my own battery for this, the battery may be useless anyway.

    When I turned the key back to the off position, the engine kept slowly cranking and then the negative terminal on the battery started smoking a bit. So I just pulled the leads off.

    The car has been running previously and is a good car so this has to be simple. The only modification seems to be that it has a set of factory disc brakes with correct rear drums added.

    Do I have a problem with the starter motor locking in, the starter solenoid or something else?

    Your advice would be helpful for those who are masters of the dark arts of electrical stuff.

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    Regards
    Greg
    Attached Files
    Greg Diffen

    Editor Studebaker Owners Club UK magazine

    Australian Stude guy living in Warwick, United Kingdom

    1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 delivered new in the Netherlands
    1937 Dictator sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards RHC
    1937 Packard Super 8 Limousine UK delivered RHC
    1939 Packard Super 8 Seven Passenger sedan monster UK delivered RHC
    1939 Commander Cabriolet by Lagenthal of Switzerland
    1963 Lark Daytona Hardtop
    1988 Avanti Convertible

  • #2
    I suspect either the ignition switch is defective, or your solenoid is having the problem. On the solenoid... It could be that the internal return spring has either broken, or something like internal corrosion has set in to the point of not allowing the heavy current contacts to release when the switch power is off. In other words , the solenoid is "hanging up" and sending battery power to the starter. If you have a spare solenoid, a quick change should confirm if the one on now is the culprit.
    John Clary
    Greer, SC

    SDC member since 1975

    Comment


    • #3
      go-studebaker;
      As jcjary said and. Check for a loose battery terminal. It should never smoke.
      One way to check if it is the key or the solenoid. disconnect a battery terminal. Remove the small wire from the solenoid.
      Reinstall the battery terminal. The engine should not crank. If it does the solenoid is bad
      With the key off touch the small wire to the small terminal. The engine should not crank. If it does the key switch is bad
      Now with the small wire touching the small terminal turn the key to start. The engine should crank.
      Remove the small wire with the key in the crank position the engine should stop cranking.
      Ron

      Comment


      • #4
        Most likely the points are stuck in the voltage regulator, and the power is running backwards is the best way to describe this. It turns the generator into a motor. try removing the cover, and be sure the points are not stock. if they are, pry them back open, try 'polarizing' the voltage regulator, it may save it. If not replace it, or it will burn up the car. Be careful!

        Comment


        • #5
          Wow! A Skytop, too.

          Check for a wiring error that causes the starter solenoid to act as a latching relay. If the "S" and "I" terminals on the solenoid were somehow connected together, this might happen.
          One test you could do: disconnect both factory wires from the "S" and "I" terminals. Install the battery and connect the cables. If the starter immediately begins cranking, your solenoid is stuck, and must be replaced. Connect a 12-volt test light between the "I" terminal and ground. Momentarily connect the "S" terminal to battery positive; the starter should commence cranking, and the test lamp should illuminate. When you disconnect the "S" terminal, the starter should cease cranking, and the test lamp should go out. Any other behavior indicates a fault in the solenoid, which is normally very reliable.

          If the solenoid checks out OK, then the fault is in the wiring harness or ignition switch. If the car is an automatic, scrambled wiring to the neutral safety switch might cause this.
          Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

          Comment


          • #6
            My '61 Hawk did this on several occasions. I replaced the ignition switch and it hasn't done it any more. Turn key to start, if it continues to turn when you release it, pull the "s" wire on the solinoid and if it stops you've found the problem. -Jim

            Comment


            • #7
              I had a solenoid that was hanging up and continued to crank with everything off, it had welded itself together inside. With my curious mind I drilled out the rivets and found one of the brass contacts was only touching by a pencil point and welded itself together. When it was assembled, the first nut that was put on to hold the contact in place allowed the contact to rotate slightly, enough to effect the contact area to a point the size of a pencil point. The other side had full contact about 1/4 inch square. Just replace the solenoid they are sometimes made faulty.

              Comment


              • #8
                The solenoid is the quick check, and easy to do, If that is not the problem, Gord's and Jim's suggestions are also very good. you can disregard my post, It only happend to me twice, I am not sure why, but on both occasions, it was on a stude 6, I heard what sounded like the starter turning over, but it was being dragged by the Gen when it 'motored' , Not sure why. In any case, always 'polarize' the system if the battery dies, or any major power wires get disconnected, as per the shop manual.....

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thanks guys for the input.

                  I will check the voltage regulator contacts first, then polarise it. I do have quite a few new solenoids here as well so will move onto that if the genny thing does not pan out.

                  Will get back to you later with some details.

                  Greg
                  Greg Diffen

                  Editor Studebaker Owners Club UK magazine

                  Australian Stude guy living in Warwick, United Kingdom

                  1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 delivered new in the Netherlands
                  1937 Dictator sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards RHC
                  1937 Packard Super 8 Limousine UK delivered RHC
                  1939 Packard Super 8 Seven Passenger sedan monster UK delivered RHC
                  1939 Commander Cabriolet by Lagenthal of Switzerland
                  1963 Lark Daytona Hardtop
                  1988 Avanti Convertible

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thanks guys.

                    After checking the voltage regulator points were free, it was still doing it.

                    So I disconnected the wires as per gordr's post and had the same problem. Changed out the starter solenoid with a new one I had on the shelf here and hey presto with a different battery in the car it was doing what it was supposed to do.

                    After checking the oil and thinking I might as well go for the start at this point, I dumped some fresh petrol down the carb and soon had the car running fine on 10 year old petrol. It was smooth as silk and the auto selected all gears with the handbrake on.

                    Since it has no brakes - they will come apart shortly for a full service. Then it's just sorting the blinker problem out and a new set of tyres and it should be properly ready for MOT.

                    Yes Gordr it is a skytop. I would have had no interest in the car if it did not have that option. Since I have never had any experience with OHV 6 cyl cars before, I am looking forward to how they will go compared to all the V8's I am more familiar with.

                    Thanks for the tips guys.
                    Greg
                    Greg Diffen

                    Editor Studebaker Owners Club UK magazine

                    Australian Stude guy living in Warwick, United Kingdom

                    1933 St Regis Brougham Model 56 delivered new in the Netherlands
                    1937 Dictator sedan Australian Body by TJ Richards RHC
                    1937 Packard Super 8 Limousine UK delivered RHC
                    1939 Packard Super 8 Seven Passenger sedan monster UK delivered RHC
                    1939 Commander Cabriolet by Lagenthal of Switzerland
                    1963 Lark Daytona Hardtop
                    1988 Avanti Convertible

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Sounds like the disc in the solenoid has welded itself to the posts . This happens often with low voltage. A quick check on the gen is to remove the armature wire there should be no voltage there with the engine stopped. Don't mess with voltage reg,
                      Hawkowner

                      Comment

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