Question Answered: Why 44% don't have a clue....

[wittsend]

Point well made about the job availability for teens these days. That said, my teen daughter made a decent wage walking dogs, teaching violin and sitting kids. It averaged $15 an hour and being her total income never reached an amount to pay taxes it was equivalent to making $17-$18 an hour. Every job she got came about by people contacting her. How one presents themselves DOES make a difference. While less successful my son was a State Science Fair champion and shortly after a newspaper write-up got an offer to work at a Robotics Summer Camp for kids. The down side was we parents had to drive them most of the time. Insurance not withstanding my wife and I agreed that we didn't want the liability for a child under 18 driving.

We home-schooled our kids. Terrain and climate difficulties did not apply. However Parent/Teacher meetings were 24/7.

[jnormanh]

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I’m ...

I'll go first:....

I've ]

Whoop, whoop, hooray for you, Bob.

I've never (or at least seldom) read such a self aggrandizing screed.

You're an old man and have absolutely no idea what young people do today.

I know many, many young folks who work like dogs. Forget your two-bit paper routes. I have a granddaughter who, on non-class days works at her church, school and freelance tending to young children, 30+ hours a week, unpaid.

And little Bobby had a paper route.

You haven't a clue, crybaby.

[BobPalma]

I hear stuff all the time about how kids today don't work, etc., etc., etc. Like many of you when I was young, very young, I mowed lawns, delivered newspapers, sold Christmas card, bagged groceries and a few other things. Today most of these jobs are either not available or not safe. I would not let my 5th grade kid pedal 6 miles delivering newspapers before sunup, nor would i want him or her going door to door collecting money for those subscriptions. The same goes for selling anything door to door. In our area both newspapers and lawn mowing are done by adults who deliver ( in the case of our area) over a hundred newspapers and never collect money (that has to be sent in by mail ) ad with most of the lawn mowing being down by guys who come by with a trailer full of mowers and such and knock out your lawn in a short amount to time for 60 to 100+ bucks a shot. As has been said earlier working in other types of jobs here cannot be done by those under 16 and from what I see at my local grocery store, many of the baggers, etc are high school kids. Other jobs for younger folks include baby sitting, but few if any want boys to do that work and I am not sure I would want a daughter younger than 17 to baby sit late the way things are that time of night. It is easy to blame youth for all sorts of things but I think we need to see why things are the way they are before we begin to criticize.

All true as to opportunities and the realties of today, Joe. We keep overlooking today's #1 job opportunity for high-schoolers, and one that, for all practical purposes, didn't exist in the 1950s and barely existed in the 1960s; that of working in a fast-food restaurant. Talk to anyone in that industry and they'll tell you they are crying for youngsters who will work dependably even 10 or 12 hours per week. The life-long work lessons to be learned are more valuable than the pay received; that of being on time, courteous to customers, well-groomed, basic money-management for one's earnings, and, importantly, the self-respect to be enjoyed from being self-sufficient, and so on.

People eat out so much more frequently than they used to that it creates job opportunities not only for entry-level jobs, but also for advancement in the industry if one wants to stay in it. It's relatively safe work environment, too, as regards to being exposed (door-to-door selling, etc.) to the harsh realities of today's culture versus the somewhat safer general environment of years past, pollyanna attitudes expressed here to the contrary, of course! BP

[JoeHall]

Bob,
I agree, fast food is a good first job for high schoolers, and in KY if 16-17, they can work up to 25 hours per week, but time frames are restricted. After 18, the law does not apply. My daughter had applied at Taco Bell, Kohls, and Baskin & Robins, and they all wanted her. She even went to orientation with TB, but I talked her into B&R. It was minimum wage, but they average about $1 per hour in tips. IMHO, it helped her in developing all the life skills you mentioned, and probably more. She is now in college working on a music degree, and also doing pre-med. She could easily work a job, if only doing a music degree. But pre-med has her in the library often till 2AM or so. Good thing it is open practically 24x7.

If you believe in the blank slate theory, kids learn mostly from the environment, and the journey begins at home. I am sure she will do well, no matter what she decides.

Whew, don't get me started braggin on my kids. LOL

[BobPalma]

Bob,
I agree, fast food is a good first job for high schoolers, and in KY if 16-17, they can work up to 25 hours per week, but time frames are restricted. After 18, the law does not apply. My daughter had applied at Taco Bell, Kohls, and Baskin & Robins, and they all wanted her. She even went to orientation with TB, but I talked her into B&R. It was minimum wage, but they average about $1 per hour in tips. IMHO, it helped her in developing all the life skills you mentioned, and probably more. She is now in college working on a music degree, and also doing pre-med. She could easily work a job, if only doing a music degree. But pre-med has her in the library often till 2AM or so. Good thing it is open practically 24x7.

If you believe in the blank slate theory, kids learn mostly from the environment, and the journey begins at home. I am sure she will do well, no matter what she decides.

Whew, don't get me started braggin on my kids. LOL

BINGO! Well-stated, Joe; thanks.

At the Taco Bell here in Brownsburg, they are so desperate for employees that they offer a $250 bonus at the end of what I believe is 6-months' employment. It may be fewer months than that, but it isn't any more than six.

That's a ton of money for a teen-ager to receive as a bonus, but it testifies to the dearth of qualified youngsters willing to work in that type of job....and this certainly isn't a wealthy community of pampered rich kids, either. BP

[t walgamuth]

Whoop, whoop, hooray for you, Bob.

I've never (or at least seldom) read such a self aggrandizing screed.

You're an old man and have absolutely no idea what young people do today.

I know many, many young folks who work like dogs. Forget your two-bit paper routes. I have a granddaughter who, on non-class days works at her church, school and freelance tending to young children, 30+ hours a week, unpaid.

And little Bobby had a paper route.

You haven't a clue, crybaby.

Tough crowd tonight!

[jclary]

Tough crowd tonight!

I don't think the "crowd" is all that tough. With only a couple of exceptions, the "Crowd" has engaged in a rather civil discussion on a subject that, as mentioned by some, is as old as mankind. Most comments, have been reasonable, well presented, with views that encompass the beliefs, and life experiences of each contributor. Some of the posters, have serious differences of view, but manage to state their case with eloquence and decorum. That is the respectful way to approach any discussion. Be it a discussion about raising kids, carburetors, distributors, or which vehicle in which they are installed.

From my lowly perch, standing on tiptoe to get a view of the "crowd," or dare offer a comment...it only takes a couple of malcontents, to begin personally attacking a participant, in a feeble attempt to elevate their own standing over everyone else. It is as if they are jealous, perhaps envious, of the original poster's long standing, as a respected contributor across a broad spectrum of subjects.

The unpleasant result is that, not only do they drag down the discussion, but stink up the the atmosphere of the discussion. On the subject of this discussion, I may have missed it, but I don't recall the original poster disparaging a single individual. For the most part, others taking an opposing view, have managed to respond without personally attacking the character of fellow contributors. This is the way such things should be approached. We should all recognize the possibility that there is value, and insight that can be gained by the cumulative contributions of those who's life experiences are different than any one individual.

To attack one person's character, or motives, is about the same as attempting to speak from the lips of the lowest sphincter on the human body, instead of the one closest to the brain. So sad...so obvious...a "stinking" shame.

While I am familiar with the term "STOVE HUGGERS,"...and grew up where such sessions could be found at country stores, community centers, cotton gins, or the local livestock sale barn...even a crowd of perceived hayseed, bib overall clad, farmers...lacking formal education...knew how to be civil and kind to each other.

[8E45E]

I have a granddaughter who, on non-class days works at her church, school and freelance tending to young children, 30+ hours a week, unpaid.

Is she performing this community service work as a result of a minor misdemeanor charge?

Craig

[toymobile]

I went to taco Bell yesterday and the bottom of my receipt was a note that read HELP WANTED.

I worked from a young age picked cotton at age 12 for Christmas money, mowed lawns for years worked in a bowling alley setting pins at 14 along with any other job I could come up with.

Today's kids want every thing given to them, I didn't raise my kids that way and two of the three turned out very good(2 out of 3 not bad I guess).

I feel lucky being born in sept 42 I had a leg up on baby boomers being a couple years ahead of them.

Johnny

[jclary]

Funny...this particular "turn" in the discussion. For "not so fast" food, I like Waffle House. The food is simple, (mostly stuff your stomach is familiar with), you are able to observe the food preparation, and the cockroaches are dead on the floor instead of climbing the walls.

Sometimes, a "long line," means "Good Food!" Other times...something else. Around here, for fast food, CHICK-FIL-A has long lines at every mealtime. Hardee's, only breakfast. McDonalds...easy locations, steady, & kids... TACO BELL, only if there's a staff problem, or someone at the drive-in window line is trying to get the order right.

[Packard53]

jnormanh: I agree with your post concerning the person who started this thread. He always seems to able to take subject matter and use it to turn it into look what I have DONE look at ME. Heck Bob and I are about the same age I see things differently looking back on those times than he does. MY parents when it came time me to go to school never pressured me into trying to work part time. They both insisted that getting a good educations comes first while in high school. very few kids that I grew up with ever worked a part time job while going to high school. My parents in my young years managed to instill a good work ethics into my brother and me.

John S.

[wittsend]

I think it has been established that one of the few places a teen can find a job today is in the fast food world. And, while it is certainly a place to gain a work ethic I don't think most parents see it as a "career" for their kids. With respect to people whose teens work(ed) in that field my homeschooling wife used that career path as a motivation often asking my kids if that can say "would you like fries with that" when they balked at doing their school work. And, let's be frank when you look at the job turnover it seems like an employment of last resort. I don't say that to demean anyone, but to call it what it is, primarily entry level, low paying, short term employment. Sadly it becomes more than that for some. I remember being on vacation (I think it was Virginia) and everyone working at the Wendy's was 40 and up. This was prior to the economic turn down and seemed unjustified. It was rather a profound experience, one of both humble gratitude for my place in life and empathy for those in the situation they were.

As has been mentioned many jobs that were formerly done by teens now fall to adults. I realize this can depend on where one lives, but in suburbia there are fewer opportunities for teens short of working a register that today doesn't even require them to "do math." So, where as the main topic is teens and their willingness to work I think we need to look to the home first. It seems the car now goes through the car wash rather than Jr. washing it. people eat out so often that dishes become few and those that are get crammed in the dishwasher for a late night run. The gardener now takes care of the property least Jr. fail to get the job done (or damage expensive plants) when a good presentation is most important to the parent. The potential damage to the pool is not worth the cost of assigning Jr. the responsibility. In essence many parents have neglected to include their teens in the responsibility of caring for the home. The understanding of what a job means should start there.

Sports. I'll say it again SPORTS. It amazes me the time, money and effort that goes into sports today. With all the various sports, clinics, training (injury recovery) and the travel to participate there of, it is simply astonishing. Today you would think every child was a future Olympic athlete. Years ago a kid rode his bike to most all his ball games. Today whole families travel hundreds of miles (sometimes flying thousands) with overnight stays for the sake of the sports experience. When I ask would these teen EVER have any time for a job?

I live in a mildly affluent area but on the lesser side of it. The church I attend (and thus the teens I've associated with) primarily come from blue to gray collar family's. Maybe because I come from a "children should be seen and not heard" background I find shocking that even families with limited means seem to overextend themselves in an attempt to buy their children's happiness - in the hope that it keeps them from going wayward. And while it seems to come across as "loving" I see way too many of these kids marry, fall rapidly into debt and quickly find out they are not really the offspring of kings and queens. So, once again a source of why teens don't have jobs might not always be themselves.

Each of use come at this from our upbringing, cultural, financial backgrounds and our opinions. Personally for me it is the attitude of entitlement I find so frustrating. Where that comes from is the real souse of the problem regarding work ethic.

I'm a bit baffled by the comments towards Bob Palma. He posts an article (not written by him) and then relates his own life experience. I'm inclined to think had he not done the latter the question might have been asked, 'who are you to speak.' If he is to be ostracized for his experience then it would seem it should apply to everyone else as well. The absence of that seems to speak for itself.

[48skyliner]

I certainly agree with the part about working around the home as a starting point. I designed and built my home and shop over a 15 year period, starting when my kids were pretty young, and finishing when they were college age. They helped me with carpenter, plumbing and electrical work, and when they were older, with interior woodwork and finishing. Once the shop was usable, I was back to buying some wrecked cars, which I did since I was in college, and my sons learned about sheet metal work, welding, bondo work, painting and virtually every kind of mechanical work.

One son is a lead engineer with a moderate sized company, the other has his own company building high-dollar custom gates, railings and fences. Neither of them works doing plumbing, electrical or carpenter work, or as a mechanic or body man, but they can do their own home and auto repairs if they choose to. When the exhaust guy says "You really should replace these shocks", the response they get from my son is "Thanks for calling that to my attention. I will have my alignment guy look at them and if he thinks they need replacement, I will order them on line and do it myself."

[showbizkid]

It amazes me that intelligent people with a common interest cannot disagree in a friendly, civil manner.

A reminder: no threats against a Forum member by any other Forum member will be tolerated. You get one warning on that one; repeated offenses earn 30 days off.

Now, in the words of Sgt. Esterhaus, "Let's all be careful out there."

[Blue 15G]

I went to taco Bell yesterday and the bottom of my receipt was a note that read HELP WANTED.

I worked from a young age picked cotton at age 12 for Christmas money, mowed lawns for years worked in a bowling alley setting pins at 14 along with any other job I could come up with.

Today's kids want every thing given to them, I didn't raise my kids that way and two of the three turned out very good(2 out of 3 not bad I guess).

I feel lucky being born in sept 42 I had a leg up on baby boomers being a couple years ahead of them.

Johnny

Like you, I also worked at a bowling alley setting pins as a youth! I was pleasantly surprised to hear from someone else who did that. You don't hear much about THAT job anymore!