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  • Grill Surrounds for '53's

    Does anyone have a pair of crummy surrounds for sale cheap & are going to be at South Bend in a few weeks? I am finally getting back to a project I started a couple years ago & am going to have some tooling quoted for making them (unless you tell me somebody already has....I've been away from the hobby a couple years now). Good Friend Dale Mcphersand had gotten the drawings & I'm having one of our cad guys turn it into a solid model for quoting purposes. I would be most helpful to have an actual sample to send with the prints.

    My company has a plant in china & thru our connections, I can still get things tooled at reasonable prices. I'm not really looking at becoming a vendor, but wanted to take a stab at getting some parts made. I'm also having some bullet nose headlite rims quoted. I already have some NOS samples of those.
    thanks,
    Mike Sal

  • #2
    I'll bring a crummy one for the right side, free loaner (or keep it if needed).
    If anyone else has a helper sample I would encourage you to bring it also.
    This could turn into something worthwhile.

    LP

    sigpic
    Lark Parker --Just an innocent possum strolling down life's highway.

    Comment


    • #3
      It would be awesome for grill surrounds to be reproduced and I would probably be one of the first to buy. I still don't understand why they haven't been reproduced yet. GOOD LUCK!


      Alex Nelsen, 15 year old Studebaker nut.
      1954 Champion Coupe
      Lizella, GA
      Alex Nelsen, certified Studebaker nut.
      Driving a 1954 Champion Coupe powered by a Chrysler 383.
      Lizella, GA

      Comment


      • #4
        quote:Originally posted by Mike Sal

        Does anyone have a pair of crummy surrounds for sale cheap & are going to be at South Bend in a few weeks? I am finally getting back to a project I started a couple years ago & am going to have some tooling quoted for making them (unless you tell me somebody already has....I've been away from the hobby a couple years now). Good Friend Dale Mcphersand had gotten the drawings & I'm having one of our cad guys turn it into a solid model for quoting purposes. I would be most helpful to have an actual sample to send with the prints.

        My company has a plant in china & thru our connections, I can still get things tooled at reasonable prices. I'm not really looking at becoming a vendor, but wanted to take a stab at getting some parts made. I'm also having some bullet nose headlite rims quoted. I already have some NOS samples of those.
        thanks,
        Mike Sal
        Check with Dave Tbow, he has the reproductions in brass, ready to plate.

        JDP Maryland
        JDP Maryland

        Comment


        • #5
          Mike,
          I have looked at and test fit both the brass ones mentioned and another set of repro cast ones. The problem I had, was both repro sets were thick and would not "give" like the stock ones and thus would not fit the grill sheet metal nearly as well as the stockers. The originals were thin pot metal that would give some in those areas for a better fit(not that the sheet metal fitment was great anyway). I actually think if these could be made in fiberglass and then plated, they would fit better than the thick cast ones.
          64 Champ long bed V8
          55/53 Studebaker President S/R
          53 Hudson Super Wasp Coupe

          Comment


          • #6
            I would like to see these grilles available,so good luck on the project. Also looking forward to the So Bend meet in May. Ed

            Comment


            • #7
              Go for it Mike, I'm positive there is a market. Kdancy...I'm confused, my grill surrounds are not that thin, they don't give, and they are not sheet metal, but are cast zinc or some sort of pot metal. What year are yours? Thanks, Junior. BTW, talked to my father the other day and he informed me he bought a 53 Champion coupe in 1969 as a parts car for $10 (that's correct, ten dollars) but he was in too much of a rush to strip it for trim parts that he needed that he left the perfect grill bars and surrounds on the car. He was in the middle of moving from Calgary to Edmonton, about 200mi. and couldn't be bothered to take these parts...can you believe it?? I was only 9 years old at the time, at least I had enough 'studebaker' in me to pry the cool mapleleaf emblem off the glove box door (Hamilton car) but lost it sometime when I was in high school.



              54 Champ C5 Hamilton car.
              sigpic
              1954 C5 Hamilton car.

              Comment


              • #8
                Mike,
                I wish you well on you project. I would be interested in buying a set if you can make this happen.
                Good luck.



                Gary Sanders
                Nixa, MO
                President Toy Studebaker Collectors Club. Have an interest in Toy Studebakers? Contact me for details.
                Gary Sanders
                Nixa, MO

                Comment


                • #9
                  I gotta believe that fiberglass is too flimsy for chrome and the plating would chip and crack unless it was carbon fiber.


                  Alex Nelsen, 15 year old Studebaker nut.
                  1954 Champion Coupe
                  Lizella, GA
                  Alex Nelsen, certified Studebaker nut.
                  Driving a 1954 Champion Coupe powered by a Chrysler 383.
                  Lizella, GA

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    quote:Originally posted by Mike Sal

                    Does anyone have a pair of crummy surrounds for sale cheap & are going to be at South Bend in a few weeks? I am finally getting back to a project I started a couple years ago & am going to have some tooling quoted for making them (unless you tell me somebody already has....I've been away from the hobby a couple years now). Good Friend Dale Mcphersand had gotten the drawings & I'm having one of our cad guys turn it into a solid model for quoting purposes. I would be most helpful to have an actual sample to send with the prints.

                    My company has a plant in china & thru our connections, I can still get things tooled at reasonable prices. I'm not really looking at becoming a vendor, but wanted to take a stab at getting some parts made. I'm also having some bullet nose headlite rims quoted. I already have some NOS samples of those.
                    thanks,
                    Mike Sal
                    quote:Originally posted by JDP

                    Check with Dave Tbow, he has the reproductions in brass, ready to plate.
                    Mike since you say tooling, would your intent be on die casting or injection molding?
                    As JDP pointed out T-Bow has had brass ones available for quite a few years now, IIRC they are sand cast and finished for the most part. I hesitate to call them platable as finished, not rough, but better than pitted cores.
                    quote:Originally posted by Kdancy


                    I have looked at and test fit both the brass ones mentioned and another set of repro cast ones.
                    Who did you source your other repros from? I can't imagine the market is big enough for two or more manufacturers of expensive slow moving repops.

                    Mike, I admire your desire bring the grill surrounds to market and I wish you luck, this is a tough crowd. If you are going with a polymer based product I'd be intrested to see how the market reacts. IMHO injection molded surrounds may be the only economical method; barring tooling and set up.
                    As a side note I think if it was profitable S.I. would have been doing them for years now

                    Jon Krimm
                    1962 Lark Sedan

                    1961 Champ

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Someone has ti give it a try, as it seems they are the hardest part to find in goood condition[] Look what Sals went for on ebay last week
                      Good Roads
                      Brian

                      Brian Woods
                      woodysrods@shaw.ca
                      1946 M Series (Shop Truck)
                      Brian Woods
                      woodysrods@shaw.ca
                      1946 M Series (Shop Truck)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        quote:Originally posted by junior

                        Go for it Mike, I'm positive there is a market. Kdancy...I'm confused, my grill surrounds are not that thin, they don't give, and they are not sheet metal, but are cast zinc or some sort of pot metal.
                        Mike, I changed it to pot metal. Yes, mine are 53 surrounds and "move" or give from end to end.

                        quote:I gotta believe that fiberglass is too flimsy for chrome and the plating would chip and crack unless it was carbon fiber.
                        http://www.mmmetalizing.com/services.html
                        http://www.onemagictouch.com/
                        http://www.sprayonchrome.com/Gallery.html (has anyone seen this to compare to metal plated process?)
                        http://www.chrometech.com.au/
                        http://www.chrometech.com.au/guide.html
                        http://www.alsacorp.com/products/mir...ACHROME-lg.jpg (compare spray to electroplated)
                        link to photobucket test fitting
                        http://s294.photobucket.com/albums/m...ll%20surround/
                        64 Champ long bed V8
                        55/53 Studebaker President S/R
                        53 Hudson Super Wasp Coupe

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          All those flashy chrome grills on the later model pickups are certainly a chromed plastic. Its not "vacuum formed" either where its a sticky backed foil glued over the plastic; but a plating process of some kind. I've got some peeling chrome on my old '80s beater car emblems (20+ salty winters will do that) and its clearly got a copper base over the plastic and chrome plated over that. There are ways to plate copper on most anything, conductive like potmetal or not like plastic.

                          We have a lot of prototype parts made for different projects here. Since I am not a ME I am not sure of all the particulars but from what I gather, one method is to have what is called a stereolithography model made off the computer CAD model/file. A plastic part is either carved via CNC or made from liquids/laser cure. That plastic "master" part is then used to make a "rubber" mold and from there the actual prototype parts are cast. The rubber mold is only good for a few dozen parts though.

                          If a true "production" grade mold were to be made, I would expect that they are mostly done with a CNC machine and the work of getting the old prints for the grill redrawn as a CAD file will still apply. So, having those drawings on CAD is a important first step no matter what method is used.

                          I can understand why a sample part would be needed as well as the drawing. I've not seen the print for the '53 grill shell but I bet its pretty large. Probably has several section views and detail views. The original die casting molds may or may not match the print very well either. Also, there might be "missing" dimensions on the print that the moldmaker in the day sort of took their own initiative with based on the hand drawn print. Then, the castings are going to be somewhat shrunken as they cool so the mold maker would estimate that when making the molds. The molds would not dimensionally match the drawing for the part or the part, but are larger than the finished part due to the shrinkage. So, to get the finished part to match the drawing, they needed to estimate the shrinkage and size the mold accordingly. Depending on the material being cast, its different. Plastic would be different from pot metal and aluminum, etc different again.

                          As a student in the late 80s working as a intern I was assigned the task of taking a print for a diecast aluminum chainsaw engine part (E size paper if I recall, done in the 70s) and redrawing it into a CAD system. I had a couple samples of the part on hand too fortunately. I found lots of missing stuff on the print and had to resort to measuring the sample parts to get what I needed. I am not sure the "boss" really needed that part redrawn, but he used it as a good training exercise on using the CAD software and how to measure parts. Probably AutoCAD version 8 or 9 on DOS running on a '286 based PC with a '287 coprocessor and a 20MB harddrive. Feeling old now....

                          Jeff in ND

                          '53 Champion Hardtop

                          Jeff in ND

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                          • #14
                            quote:Originally posted by woodysrods

                            Someone has ti give it a try, as it seems they are the hardest part to find in goood condition[] Look what Sals went for on ebay last week
                            Good Roads
                            Brian

                            Brian Woods
                            woodysrods@shaw.ca
                            1946 M Series (Shop Truck)

                            T-Bow tried, and lost his butt on the project since very few will pay the cost of the castings he had made.

                            JDP Maryland
                            JDP Maryland

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Midwest Studebaker is in the process of having them CNC machined out of aluminum. I have another pair in the shop which will be ready by the Intl. meet.

                              Barry'd in Studes
                              Barry'd in Studes

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