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Still more frustrated 51 commander Fuel gauge and sender

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  • Still more frustrated 51 commander Fuel gauge and sender

    OK, so I Replaced the Fuel gauge with a working unit. It was from a 52 but works fine. When I ground the sender it pegs all the way full. I purchased a new Moeller 33-240 Ohm sender and the sender checks out correctly. Combine the new sender to the gauge and it reads half full when the sender is at full. It does move between these settings. Is this a 33-240 gauge or is it like a 0-90 ohms? Is there a way to test the gauge to see the ohms it is supposed to have?
    51 Studebaker Starlight State Commander Coupe
    53 Studebaker Starlight Regal Commander Coupe
    62 Volvo PV544 Sport

  • #2
    Is your car 6 volt or has it been changed over to 12 volts? Did you purchase a sender to match the voltage of the car?
    Frank van Doorn
    Omaha, Ne.
    1962 GT Hawk 289 4 speed
    1941 Champion streetrod, R-2 Powered, GM 200-4R trans.
    1952 V-8 232 Commander State "Starliner" hardtop OD

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    • #3
      It is 6volt gauge, The car is converted to 12v but has a reducer to 6volts and works. The sender was one that was recommended on the forum. I have read that the senders only read resistance. Several sites indicate that the volts do not effect the sender. It is a universal Moeller sender. I am only going on what I read and was told.
      51 Studebaker Starlight State Commander Coupe
      53 Studebaker Starlight Regal Commander Coupe
      62 Volvo PV544 Sport

      Comment


      • #4
        The angle and length of your Sender Float "Rod" has to match the OEM Original one to read correct, it may require some bending or shortening. I am Sure that this "Moeller" ???????? Sender (why not Stewart Warner?) is not configured for a Stude. Tank depth, unless you adjusted it correctly.

        Anyway, this 33 to 240 Sender IS for a 12 Volt and you were told in your "Other" String, that it DOES Matter.

        Your Dash gauge is 6 Volt, so you can't bi-pass the 6-12 Converter and go with 12 Volts to match the Sender.
        What you need to do also, is find out what exact Voltage that Resister is putting out, 4 or 8 probably will not work.
        Last edited by StudeRich; 04-30-2018, 05:37 PM.
        StudeRich
        Second Generation Stude Driver,
        Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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        • #5
          OK, yes some said that it matters and I have read in other places that it does not matter. The recommendation of the Moeller sending unit was from this forum. I am not testing it in the tank. I have it outside the tank hooked up with a sending wire and grounded. The arm would not need to be adjusted since I can move it all the way up or down. The ohm meter confirms the correct ohms. Why does it matter? How are the senders different? Tanks inc sells senders that are universal that work either 6 or 12 volt. Is not resistance resistance? I do take much of the advise here but there are conflicting views. I assume the the gauge is OK since it does peg out when sending wire is grounded.
          51 Studebaker Starlight State Commander Coupe
          53 Studebaker Starlight Regal Commander Coupe
          62 Volvo PV544 Sport

          Comment


          • #6
            Stewart Warner 385C-F R Swing 6-12 Fuel Level Sending Unit 240/33 Ohm

            Is this the unit you mentioned?
            51 Studebaker Starlight State Commander Coupe
            53 Studebaker Starlight Regal Commander Coupe
            62 Volvo PV544 Sport

            Comment


            • #7
              Just to make sure I understand. Are you saying I can run 12volts through the gauge without frying it? The resistor/ voltage reducer is sending out 5.96 volts. I will find a 6volt sender before frying the gauge.
              51 Studebaker Starlight State Commander Coupe
              53 Studebaker Starlight Regal Commander Coupe
              62 Volvo PV544 Sport

              Comment


              • #8
                In your particular car's case, both the gauge and the sender have to be 6 volt units, so they match each other resistance-wise. In addition, the gauge must have the voltage dropping circuit on it.

                You CANNOT apply 12 volts to the six volt gauge/sender without the voltage reducer. It will burn it up.

                You CANNOT mix a 6 volt gauge with a 12 volt sender, or a 12 volt gauge with a 6 volt sender. The readings will be wildly inaccurate, or they might not work at all, or they might burn up.

                The polarity (positive/negative ground) of the voltage is not important, but the actual voltage (6 or 12) is. The 5.96 volts out of the reducer should do the job if it holds relatively steady at that voltage. It won't hurt anything, but the gauge may seem to wander/drift. It would be nice to see if that voltage changes when revving the engine.

                If you want to keep the stock gauge in the dash, you MUST use the proper 6 volt sender in the tank and you MUST use a voltage reducer on the gauge.

                If you eventually need the same knowledge about the temperature gauge/sender, the same MUSTS and CANNOTS apply.
                Last edited by RadioRoy; 04-30-2018, 07:50 PM.
                RadioRoy, specializing in AM/FM conversions with auxiliary inputs for iPod/satellite/CD player. In the old car radio business since 1985.

                17A-S2 - 50 Commander convertible
                10G-C1 - 51 Champion starlight coupe
                10G-Q4 - 51 Champion business coupe
                4H-K5 - 53 Commander starliner hardtop
                5H-D5 - 54 Commander Conestoga wagon
                56B-D4 - 56 Commander station wagon
                60V-L6 - 60 Lark convertible

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by lelshaddai View Post
                  I think the "6-12" notation on this part description is the adjustable length of the swing arm, not the working voltage. That "6-12" designation might be causing some confusion.
                  RadioRoy, specializing in AM/FM conversions with auxiliary inputs for iPod/satellite/CD player. In the old car radio business since 1985.

                  17A-S2 - 50 Commander convertible
                  10G-C1 - 51 Champion starlight coupe
                  10G-Q4 - 51 Champion business coupe
                  4H-K5 - 53 Commander starliner hardtop
                  5H-D5 - 54 Commander Conestoga wagon
                  56B-D4 - 56 Commander station wagon
                  60V-L6 - 60 Lark convertible

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by lelshaddai View Post
                    /Cut/ OK, I am not testing it in the tank. I have it outside the tank hooked up with a sending wire and grounded. The arm would not need to be adjusted since I can move it all the way up or down./Cut/
                    Jim; most all "Universal" Sending units do have adjustable Float Arms to adjust to the Tank Depth, unless the "drop" of the Float stops about a 1/4" to 3/8" before ridding on the Tank bottom, it will not read FULL, 1/2, 3/4 and Empty correctly, that is why the length and shape of the Rod or "Arm" is so critical.

                    You can't just move it all the way UP and DOWN out of the Tank and call it good, because when you install it, it's range of motion will be different.

                    ______________________________________________

                    Thanks Roy for explaining again exactly what I said back in Post #4 about NOT running 12 volts to a 6 Volt Gauge.

                    I think maybe now, Jim will get it straight and return that Wrong Sender, IF they will take an Electrical item back.
                    StudeRich
                    Second Generation Stude Driver,
                    Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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                    • #11
                      Reading the product description I don't see any mention of voltage. Given that, I would assume it is 12V.
                      Don Wilson, Centralia, WA

                      40 Champion 4 door*
                      50 Champion 2 door*
                      53 Commander K Auto*
                      53 Commander K overdrive*
                      55 President Speedster
                      62 GT 4Speed*
                      63 Avanti R1*
                      64 Champ 1/2 ton

                      * Formerly owned

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                      • #12
                        I just went through the ordeal of getting the fuel gauge reading on our 54 Commander. Everything RadioRoy said is spot on. Here are a few other things I discovered along the way on my car. It may not apply to yours, but it worth a try. The 6V negative supply wire must be connected to the "ign" (lower terminal) on the gauge. The sending unit wire connects to the upper unmarked terminal. On my 54 the gauge case grounds itself through its mounting screws to the dash. You have to have a good ground to the gauge case. My gauge works as a voltage divider and would not work without a good case ground. The resistance range is 90ohms at empty and 0 ohms full. I bought a P/N: 525548 from Stephen Allens. The same P/N is listed as a replacement for all 47-55 cars. I checked and the sender resistance matches (pretty close) to the ohm values stated. The 33 to 240 ohm unit you have is for a 12V system and will not work with your 6V gauge. When you get you new 6V sender and test it out of the tank make sure you connect a good ground to the sender mounting flange before you test otherwise it will not work.
                        Wayne
                        "Trying to shed my CASO ways"

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                        • #13
                          So this is where I get confused. I have seen the 0-90ohms mentioned before. So which is it for this gauge it is number 526738?
                          51 Studebaker Starlight State Commander Coupe
                          53 Studebaker Starlight Regal Commander Coupe
                          62 Volvo PV544 Sport

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Your gauge is a different part number from mine. However, SI and Stephen Allens list the same sender (P/N: 525548) as a reproduction replacement for your car and mine. That sender is 0 to 90 ohms.
                            Wayne
                            "Trying to shed my CASO ways"

                            sigpic

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                            • #15
                              If it's a six volt gauge, you need the 0 - 90 ohm sender. The 33 - 240 ohm sender is for 12 volt gauges only. If you can find the fuel gauge out of the cluster from a Lark, I think you may find it will physically fit in the '51 cluster, in which case you could use the 12-volt sending unit, and dispense with the voltage reducer. I seem to remember doing this once, maybe on a '54 Champion. You can swap the dial plate from the old gauge housing to the new, and carefully clip the "black light" pointer off the old gauge and cement it over the red one on the new gauge.
                              Gord Richmond, within Weasel range of the Alberta Badlands

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