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Research help please: Stude / Ford 289 urban mythology

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  • Research help please: Stude / Ford 289 urban mythology

    It's a safe bet "you all" who subscribe to Hemmings Classic Car will enjoy my up-coming column in the December 2017 issue, which is probably being printed about now and that you'll have by mid-October. It was a lot of fun researching and writing it; Hemmings Editor Richard Lentinello said he enjoyed it and was happy to have misinformation clarified and documented once and for all. (Incidentally, not that anyone is keeping track, it's a bit of a milestone; my 25th column for the magazine....every third month beginning December 2011...time flies when you're having fun! )

    Along those lines in a future column, I'd like to some day defuse the myth that Studebaker and Ford 289 V-8 engines are the same. That's easily done physically, of course, but I'd like to locate and document an original quote I THINK (but do not know for sure) was printed long ago in Hot Rod or another publication, saying the 289 Studebaker engine was "a Ford engine." To be sure, I've never seen that falsehood printed in a major magazine and would not credit anyone with having said so unless and until I personally saw it in print.

    Does anyone have a copy of an old magazine, possibly Hot Rod, in which that myth is published as fact? If I had a publication name and cover date [month], I could research the matter and use it in a future "Myth Busters" column.

    In advance, thanks for any assistance. BP
    We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

    Ayn Rand:
    "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

    G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

  • #2
    I have an old collection and will take a look.....
    Lou Van Anne
    62 Champ
    64 R2 GT Hawk
    79 Avanti II

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    • #3
      StudeFolk know the truth, but I think we could dispel this undying myth by pointing out that Studebaker produced a 289 BEFORE Ford issued a 289. How could Studebaker steal it before Ford made it? Time travel, perhaps?
      The only difference between death and taxes is that death does not grow worse every time Congress convenes. - Will Rogers

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      • #4
        Not being a Ford guy, didn't their 289 start out as a 221 and then evolve into a 260 then their 289

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        • #5
          In sixty years of subscribing to Hot Rod and most of the others off and on over those years, I've never seen that statement in a major magazine article.

          Not being a Ford guy, didn't their 289 start out as a 221 and then evolve into a 260 then their 289
          Yes, and then into their 302"/5.0, 351" and 400".

          jack vines
          PackardV8

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          • #6
            One thing I do remember reading about the little "thinwall" 221 when it came out was that Ford had chosen that size as a tribute to the old 221 cubic inch flathead that "started it all" for them. I still can't figure out how anyone that has even a molecule of "car nut" in them could possibly confuse the Studebaker engine with the Ford. Well, come to think of it, there was a "car guy" I worked with at an aircraft repair station that got in a real ugly argument about Ford getting sued by GM for stealing the 302 and just turning it around so the distributor was on the right end to define it as a Ford, ha ! He was actually serious !!!!!!!

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Chris Pile View Post
              StudeFolk know the truth, but I think we could dispel this undying myth by pointing out that Studebaker produced a 289 BEFORE Ford issued a 289. How could Studebaker steal it before Ford made it? Time travel, perhaps?
              AMC people say the same about the 327, which came out before Chevrolet's 327.

              Craig

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              • #8
                The thing that not very knowledgeable "Car Guys" seem to get wrong is that when it comes to Engine Design comparisons, it is much more about the Design and Shape than the NUMBERS as in C.I.D. !

                Those really mean nothing when comparing Engines.
                StudeRich
                Second Generation Stude Driver,
                Proud '54 Starliner Owner

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by PackardV8 View Post
                  In sixty years of subscribing to Hot Rod and most of the others off and on over those years, I've never seen that statement in a major magazine article. jack vines
                  Thanks, Jack; you would have been one to remember it. Perhaps it was in a lesser magazine with sloppier editing / fact-checking, and someone will remember that. BP
                  We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

                  Ayn Rand:
                  "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

                  G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    AMC people say the same about the 327, which came out before Chevrolet's 327.
                    They probably wouldn't argue about Packard's 327 engine.... since it's an awesome straight eight.
                    The only difference between death and taxes is that death does not grow worse every time Congress convenes. - Will Rogers

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                    • #11
                      I had a guy tell me Saturday that they are still making Studebakers in Brazil...
                      Join me in removing narcissists, trolls, self annoited "experts" and general idiots via the Ignore button.

                      The official SDC Forum heel nipper ���

                      �Middle age is when your broad mind and narrow waist begin to change places.� E. Joseph Cossman

                      For every mile of road, there are 2 miles of ditch. ���

                      "All lies matter - fight the kleptocracy"

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Guido View Post
                        I had a guy tell me Saturday that they are still making Studebakers in Brazil...
                        They aren't? BP
                        We've got to quit saying, "How stupid can you be?" Too many people are taking it as a challenge.

                        Ayn Rand:
                        "You can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality."

                        G. K. Chesterton: This triangle of truisms, of father, mother, and child, cannot be destroyed; it can only destroy those civilizations which disregard it.

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                        • #13
                          Ford had three different 351's.
                          351W
                          351C
                          351M

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                          • #14
                            Found this old post. Not from Hot Rod even though that incident does sound vaguely familiar to me too.......
                            12-15-2015, 11:10 AM
                            Dan Timberlake

                            President MemberJoin DateMar 2008Location, , .Posts1,247

                            Original info was in "Chevrolet Small-Block V-8 Id Guide" Chapter 17.
                            Published by MotorBooks , by Pierre Lafontaine

                            https://books.google.com/books?id=V7...%20all&f=false

                            On Amazon one review ranked it 1 star claiming misinformation on Chevy engines.



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                            • #15
                              I have been reading car magazines since about 1960 (I started in elementary school) and I don't ever remember an automotive magazine stating that there was any relationship between the ford and Studebaker engine. Many people have stated that the similarity between the Studebaker and Cadillac engine is due to Studebaker copying the Cadillac engine. However the dates on the Studebaker drawings predate the public release of the Cadillac.

                              John McKusick told me the Studebaker and Cadillac were working on a V8 engine for the Army towards the end of the war. I have never found any information that would support that. But it might explain the similarity.
                              David L

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