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View Full Version : When did hanging pedals debut?



Guido
01-06-2008, 08:36 PM
Obviously not Stude related, but I am curious as to when swinging pedals debuted. Being a child of the '50's, I first remember them in my Dad's 1954 Ford Ranch Wagon. However, our '55 Chevy truck did not have them (nor did a friend's '58), but I know the '58 IH trucks did.

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/62/562/2/21/69/2353221690097493054hwathP_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/60/460/3/91/1/2433391010097493054nAMBKh_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/24/565/2/49/65/2603249650097493054XvpTUI_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/64/564/6/89/77/2752689770097493054skXzAT_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/22/22/0/2/68/2589002680097493054ftBuBw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/8/30/30/2075830300097493054aSSlFv_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/24/565/5/22/8/2609522080097493054ZNRJeA_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/69/169/4/66/56/2729466560097493054oBZsXT_th.jpg
Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

Studebaker horse drawn doctor’s buggy; Studebaker horse drawn “Izzer” buggy; 1946 M-16 fire truck; 1948 M-16 grain truck; 1949 2R17A fire truck; 1950 2R5 pickup; 1952 2R17A grain truck; 1952 Packard 200 4 door; 1955 E-38 grain truck; 1957 3E-40 flatbed; 1961 6E-28 grain truck; 1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck; 1962 7E-7 Champ pickup; 1962 GT Hawk 4 speed; 1963 8E-28 flatbed; 1964 Avanti R2 4 speed; 1964 Cruiser and various other "treasures" (including a 1959 IH B-120 4 wheel drive, a 1970 Dodge W-200 Power Wagon and numerous Oliver and Cockshutt tractors).

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

N8N
01-06-2008, 08:40 PM
For Studebaker, I believe they were introduced with the cowl redesign for the '61 Lark. Hawks never got them, as I'm sure you know.

I kind of prefer the bottom hinged pedals for the feel, although the Stude implementation isn't as wonderfully ergonomic as I remember Porsche's being. (my 944 sadly has top hung pedals unlike the 911 and 914.)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

N8N
01-06-2008, 08:40 PM
For Studebaker, I believe they were introduced with the cowl redesign for the '61 Lark. Hawks never got them, as I'm sure you know.

I kind of prefer the bottom hinged pedals for the feel, although the Stude implementation isn't as wonderfully ergonomic as I remember Porsche's being. (my 944 sadly has top hung pedals unlike the 911 and 914.)

nate

--
55 Commander Starlight
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Mark57
01-06-2008, 08:42 PM
1963 models for the Champ pick-ups.

<h5>Mark
'57 Transtar
3E-6/7-122 </h5>
[img]http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x153/MarkH57/MrGreenJeans1003b.jpg

Mark57
01-06-2008, 08:42 PM
1963 models for the Champ pick-ups.

<h5>Mark
'57 Transtar
3E-6/7-122 </h5>
[img]http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x153/MarkH57/MrGreenJeans1003b.jpg

BobPalma
01-06-2008, 08:51 PM
:) No set answer, Gary; it varied by manufacturer, and whether it was cars or trucks.

1952 Ford was the first of The Low-Price Three; it would be 1955 before Plymouth and Chevrolet had suspended pedals in their passenger cars.

Studebaker was pretty much dead last, in 1961! :(

Have you ever seen a 1955 or 1956 Packard with power brakes and a manual transmission? The clutch pedal is through the floor and the brake pedal is suspended! Weird. [8D] BP

BobPalma
01-06-2008, 08:51 PM
:) No set answer, Gary; it varied by manufacturer, and whether it was cars or trucks.

1952 Ford was the first of The Low-Price Three; it would be 1955 before Plymouth and Chevrolet had suspended pedals in their passenger cars.

Studebaker was pretty much dead last, in 1961! :(

Have you ever seen a 1955 or 1956 Packard with power brakes and a manual transmission? The clutch pedal is through the floor and the brake pedal is suspended! Weird. [8D] BP

StudeRich
01-06-2008, 08:55 PM
I think it was pretty much 1955 for most big three cars, GM had them just like the cowl vent heating systems. Ford as Guido mentioned had the suspended pedals in '54 along with their recirculating ball steering gear.

Looks like Bob remembers them in '52 on Fords, that sounds right. On most things the General was pretty slow advancing, like their vacuum wipers!

But they did jump the gun with their 12 volt systems in 1955, probably due their Delco Division which was always ahead of GM itself!

StudeRich Studebakers Northwest Ferndale, WA

StudeRich
01-06-2008, 08:55 PM
I think it was pretty much 1955 for most big three cars, GM had them just like the cowl vent heating systems. Ford as Guido mentioned had the suspended pedals in '54 along with their recirculating ball steering gear.

Looks like Bob remembers them in '52 on Fords, that sounds right. On most things the General was pretty slow advancing, like their vacuum wipers!

But they did jump the gun with their 12 volt systems in 1955, probably due their Delco Division which was always ahead of GM itself!

StudeRich Studebakers Northwest Ferndale, WA

arkiejazz
01-06-2008, 10:54 PM
[:o)]Not that anyone would care, but Hudson got them in 1954 on power brake equipped cars only.[:o)]

steve blake
http://tinyurl.com/kr3gt
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l68/arkiejazz/thumbnails/p1010078-200x104.jpghttp://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l68/arkiejazz/thumbnails/p1010009-225x107.jpg

arkiejazz
01-06-2008, 10:54 PM
[:o)]Not that anyone would care, but Hudson got them in 1954 on power brake equipped cars only.[:o)]

steve blake
http://tinyurl.com/kr3gt
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l68/arkiejazz/thumbnails/p1010078-200x104.jpghttp://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l68/arkiejazz/thumbnails/p1010009-225x107.jpg

jnewkirk77
01-07-2008, 03:19 AM
I know the Packards had the suspended pedal in '55-56, but doesn't the rod for the Easamatic (Treadle-Vac?) go through the floor directly behind the pedal, Bob? Kind of seems like they added the suspended part just so they could say they were up to date ... ;)

Jacob Newkirk - Owensboro, KY

Currently driving an '87 Ford F-150, but I dream of having a Hawk one day. Don't we all?

jnewkirk77
01-07-2008, 03:19 AM
I know the Packards had the suspended pedal in '55-56, but doesn't the rod for the Easamatic (Treadle-Vac?) go through the floor directly behind the pedal, Bob? Kind of seems like they added the suspended part just so they could say they were up to date ... ;)

Jacob Newkirk - Owensboro, KY

Currently driving an '87 Ford F-150, but I dream of having a Hawk one day. Don't we all?

lstude
01-07-2008, 03:58 AM
This is a picture of the interior of our 61 Lark with suspended pedals.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/61LarkinteriorFeb62indrivewaycc.jpg

Below is a picture I took of the 56 Packard Clipper with a straight drive transmission that ran at Osceola Drag Strip last summer. Both pedals are in the floor, but I don't know if it is original or if it was converted from an older model Packard.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/OsceolaDragstripClipperint.jpg

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/MeatSouthBendsm1.jpg

lstude
01-07-2008, 03:58 AM
This is a picture of the interior of our 61 Lark with suspended pedals.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/61LarkinteriorFeb62indrivewaycc.jpg

Below is a picture I took of the 56 Packard Clipper with a straight drive transmission that ran at Osceola Drag Strip last summer. Both pedals are in the floor, but I don't know if it is original or if it was converted from an older model Packard.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/OsceolaDragstripClipperint.jpg

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/MeatSouthBendsm1.jpg

BobPalma
01-07-2008, 04:22 AM
quote:Originally posted by lstude

Below is a picture I took of the 56 Packard Clipper with a straight drive transmission that ran at Osceola Drag Strip last summer. Both pedals are in the floor, but I don't know if it is original or if it was converted from an older model Packard.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/OsceolaDragstripClipperint.jpg

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/MeatSouthBendsm1.jpg


:) Leonard: That's because the Packard at Osceola had manual (not power) brakes (note my original answer to Gary's question). If it had had Easamatic Power Brakes (a fairly popular option), the pedal would appear suspended...and, in fact, the pedal itself is! Jacob is correct; from the back of the pedal is a small actuating rod to the power brake unit, but the pedal itself is suspended and does pivot from a bracket on the bottom of the dash, per Gary's inquiry. ;) BP

BobPalma
01-07-2008, 04:22 AM
quote:Originally posted by lstude

Below is a picture I took of the 56 Packard Clipper with a straight drive transmission that ran at Osceola Drag Strip last summer. Both pedals are in the floor, but I don't know if it is original or if it was converted from an older model Packard.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/OsceolaDragstripClipperint.jpg

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/MeatSouthBendsm1.jpg


:) Leonard: That's because the Packard at Osceola had manual (not power) brakes (note my original answer to Gary's question). If it had had Easamatic Power Brakes (a fairly popular option), the pedal would appear suspended...and, in fact, the pedal itself is! Jacob is correct; from the back of the pedal is a small actuating rod to the power brake unit, but the pedal itself is suspended and does pivot from a bracket on the bottom of the dash, per Gary's inquiry. ;) BP

Guido
01-07-2008, 05:42 AM
Thanks for the responses, I should have specified that I had the Stude info down. ;) Anyone know about AMC? (Bigsy?). I think Willy's was like Studebaker, the '62 4x4 wagon I had was through the floor, but the '65 Wagoneer was suspended. I suspect the suspended pedals debuted with the Wagoneers and Gladiators.

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/62/562/2/21/69/2353221690097493054hwathP_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/60/460/3/91/1/2433391010097493054nAMBKh_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/24/565/2/49/65/2603249650097493054XvpTUI_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/64/564/6/89/77/2752689770097493054skXzAT_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/22/22/0/2/68/2589002680097493054ftBuBw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/8/30/30/2075830300097493054aSSlFv_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/24/565/5/22/8/2609522080097493054ZNRJeA_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/69/169/4/66/56/2729466560097493054oBZsXT_th.jpg
Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

Studebaker horse drawn doctor’s buggy; Studebaker horse drawn “Izzer” buggy; 1946 M-16 fire truck; 1948 M-16 grain truck; 1949 2R17A fire truck; 1950 2R5 pickup; 1952 2R17A grain truck; 1952 Packard 200 4 door; 1955 E-38 grain truck; 1957 3E-40 flatbed; 1961 6E-28 grain truck; 1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck; 1962 7E-7 Champ pickup; 1962 GT Hawk 4 speed; 1963 8E-28 flatbed; 1964 Avanti R2 4 speed; 1964 Cruiser and various other "treasures" (including a 1959 IH B-120 4 wheel drive, a 1970 Dodge W-200 Power Wagon and numerous Oliver and Cockshutt tractors).

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

Guido
01-07-2008, 05:42 AM
Thanks for the responses, I should have specified that I had the Stude info down. ;) Anyone know about AMC? (Bigsy?). I think Willy's was like Studebaker, the '62 4x4 wagon I had was through the floor, but the '65 Wagoneer was suspended. I suspect the suspended pedals debuted with the Wagoneers and Gladiators.

http://thumb14.webshots.net/t/62/562/2/21/69/2353221690097493054hwathP_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/60/460/3/91/1/2433391010097493054nAMBKh_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/24/565/2/49/65/2603249650097493054XvpTUI_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/64/564/6/89/77/2752689770097493054skXzAT_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/22/22/0/2/68/2589002680097493054ftBuBw_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/28/28/8/30/30/2075830300097493054aSSlFv_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/24/565/5/22/8/2609522080097493054ZNRJeA_th.jpghttp://thumb14.webshots.net/t/69/169/4/66/56/2729466560097493054oBZsXT_th.jpg
Guido Salvage - "Where rust is beautiful"

Studebaker horse drawn doctor’s buggy; Studebaker horse drawn “Izzer” buggy; 1946 M-16 fire truck; 1948 M-16 grain truck; 1949 2R17A fire truck; 1950 2R5 pickup; 1952 2R17A grain truck; 1952 Packard 200 4 door; 1955 E-38 grain truck; 1957 3E-40 flatbed; 1961 6E-28 grain truck; 1962 7E-13D 4x4 rack truck; 1962 7E-7 Champ pickup; 1962 GT Hawk 4 speed; 1963 8E-28 flatbed; 1964 Avanti R2 4 speed; 1964 Cruiser and various other "treasures" (including a 1959 IH B-120 4 wheel drive, a 1970 Dodge W-200 Power Wagon and numerous Oliver and Cockshutt tractors).

Hiding and preserving Studebakers in Richmond, Goochland & Louisa, Va.

lstude
01-07-2008, 06:47 AM
quote:Anyone know about AMC? (Bigsy?). I think Willy's was like Studebaker, the '62 4x4 wagon I had was through the floor, but the '65 Wagoneer was suspended. I suspect the suspended pedals debuted with the Wagoneers and Gladiators.

I am not Bigsy, but the 56 Rambler got suspended pedals.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/56Ramblerwagoninteriorcrop.jpg

The big Nashes and Hudsons never got them (on manual brakes, I don't know about power). The later re-introduced Rambler American didn't get them until the restyle in 1961.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/53Nashint.jpg

Aero Willys and Kaisers never got them either.

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/MeatSouthBendsm1.jpg

lstude
01-07-2008, 06:47 AM
quote:Anyone know about AMC? (Bigsy?). I think Willy's was like Studebaker, the '62 4x4 wagon I had was through the floor, but the '65 Wagoneer was suspended. I suspect the suspended pedals debuted with the Wagoneers and Gladiators.

I am not Bigsy, but the 56 Rambler got suspended pedals.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/56Ramblerwagoninteriorcrop.jpg

The big Nashes and Hudsons never got them (on manual brakes, I don't know about power). The later re-introduced Rambler American didn't get them until the restyle in 1961.

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q8/LHSJR/53Nashint.jpg

Aero Willys and Kaisers never got them either.

Leonard Shepherd
http://leonardshepherd.com/

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/lstude1/MeatSouthBendsm1.jpg

53k
01-07-2008, 07:35 AM
quote:Originally posted by StudeRich
...But they did jump the gun with their 12 volt systems in 1955, probably due their Delco Division which was always ahead of GM itself!

Actually, some GMs had 12 volts in '54 (Olds and Caddy for sure). My neighbor had an '54 Olds 98 hardtop with 12-volt.
When I was a kid living on a poor dirt farm, my dad's tractor was a '20s something Dodge truck made into a tractor. It came originally with a 12-volt battery.


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine
1962 Gravely Model L (Studebaker-Packard serial plate)
1972 Gravely Model 430 (Studebaker name plate, Studebaker Onan engine)

53k
01-07-2008, 07:35 AM
quote:Originally posted by StudeRich
...But they did jump the gun with their 12 volt systems in 1955, probably due their Delco Division which was always ahead of GM itself!

Actually, some GMs had 12 volts in '54 (Olds and Caddy for sure). My neighbor had an '54 Olds 98 hardtop with 12-volt.
When I was a kid living on a poor dirt farm, my dad's tractor was a '20s something Dodge truck made into a tractor. It came originally with a 12-volt battery.


[img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/R-4.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64L.JPG[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/64P.jpg[/img=right][img=right]http://www.frontiernet.net/~thejohnsons/Forum%20signature%20pix/53K.jpg[/img=right]Paul Johnson, Wild and Wonderful West Virginia
'53 Commander Starliner (since 1966)
'64 Daytona Wagonaire (original owner)
'64 Daytona Convertible (2006)
Museum R-4 engine
1962 Gravely Model L (Studebaker-Packard serial plate)
1972 Gravely Model 430 (Studebaker name plate, Studebaker Onan engine)

Jerry Forrester
01-07-2008, 11:08 AM
quote:Originally posted by 53k


quote:Originally posted by StudeRich
...But they did jump the gun with their 12 volt systems in 1955, probably due their Delco Division which was always ahead of GM itself!

Actually, some GMs had 12 volts in '54 (Olds and Caddy for sure). My neighbor had an '54 Olds 98 hardtop with 12-volt.
When I was a kid living on a poor dirt farm, my dad's tractor was a '20s something Dodge truck made into a tractor. It came originally with a 12-volt battery.


I know Olds and I think Caddy got 12 volts in '53.
AFAIK 1955 Pontiac was the last GM car to have pedals through the floor.
Jerry


Jerry Forrester
Douglasville, Georgia
Be sure to check out my eBay store
http://stores.ebay.com/CHROME-CHROME-CHROME_
for your shiny Stude stuff
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/jerrystudebaker/11Sept2007e.jpg
More pix of Leo the '55 Pres HT here...http://tinyurl.com/2gj6cu

Jerry Forrester
01-07-2008, 11:08 AM
quote:Originally posted by 53k


quote:Originally posted by StudeRich
...But they did jump the gun with their 12 volt systems in 1955, probably due their Delco Division which was always ahead of GM itself!

Actually, some GMs had 12 volts in '54 (Olds and Caddy for sure). My neighbor had an '54 Olds 98 hardtop with 12-volt.
When I was a kid living on a poor dirt farm, my dad's tractor was a '20s something Dodge truck made into a tractor. It came originally with a 12-volt battery.


I know Olds and I think Caddy got 12 volts in '53.
AFAIK 1955 Pontiac was the last GM car to have pedals through the floor.
Jerry


Jerry Forrester
Douglasville, Georgia
Be sure to check out my eBay store
http://stores.ebay.com/CHROME-CHROME-CHROME_
for your shiny Stude stuff
http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd123/jerrystudebaker/11Sept2007e.jpg
More pix of Leo the '55 Pres HT here...http://tinyurl.com/2gj6cu

Shawn
01-07-2008, 12:40 PM
I just looked at a 55 Mercedes that had them. The SL I was looking at goes back to 54 So I am guessing it had them also. Looked at BMW but could only find the Isetta.

Former owner/owner with Dad:
58 Packard Golden Hawk
62 Hawk
62 Lark
63 Lark
64 Lark
63 Champ
Currently I own:
84 Mercedes 380SL
92 Range Rover (for sale)
99 BMW 323I
and helping a 16 year old rebuild an 86 Saab 900

Lakeland, FL

Shawn
01-07-2008, 12:40 PM
I just looked at a 55 Mercedes that had them. The SL I was looking at goes back to 54 So I am guessing it had them also. Looked at BMW but could only find the Isetta.

Former owner/owner with Dad:
58 Packard Golden Hawk
62 Hawk
62 Lark
63 Lark
64 Lark
63 Champ
Currently I own:
84 Mercedes 380SL
92 Range Rover (for sale)
99 BMW 323I
and helping a 16 year old rebuild an 86 Saab 900

Lakeland, FL

Johnnywiffer
01-07-2008, 10:26 PM
I remember the '52 Ford ads on TV (Didn't they sponsor Tennessee Irving?) They showed how the arc of your leg worked better on a suspended pedal than one thru the floor. Of course, they had produced zillions of cars in the previous umpteen years...when did they learn that great truth?

John

Johnnywiffer
01-07-2008, 10:26 PM
I remember the '52 Ford ads on TV (Didn't they sponsor Tennessee Irving?) They showed how the arc of your leg worked better on a suspended pedal than one thru the floor. Of course, they had produced zillions of cars in the previous umpteen years...when did they learn that great truth?

John

curt
01-08-2008, 11:29 AM
The Dodge brothers used 12 volt on the early cars; as I understand, if the car stalled in a turn the 12 volt starter would be able to pull the car through the turn.

curt
01-08-2008, 11:29 AM
The Dodge brothers used 12 volt on the early cars; as I understand, if the car stalled in a turn the 12 volt starter would be able to pull the car through the turn.

studegary
01-08-2008, 02:52 PM
quote:Originally posted by curt

The Dodge brothers used 12 volt on the early cars; as I understand, if the car stalled in a turn the 12 volt starter would be able to pull the car through the turn.


I have driven a six volt car out of an intersection on the starter. I don't see that as a reason to utilize 12 volts.

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY

SDC member since 1968
Studebaker enthusiast much longer

studegary
01-08-2008, 02:52 PM
quote:Originally posted by curt

The Dodge brothers used 12 volt on the early cars; as I understand, if the car stalled in a turn the 12 volt starter would be able to pull the car through the turn.


I have driven a six volt car out of an intersection on the starter. I don't see that as a reason to utilize 12 volts.

Gary L.
Wappinger, NY

SDC member since 1968
Studebaker enthusiast much longer

LarkMC
01-10-2008, 02:52 AM
1950 was the year Ford introduced 5 star motoring. The 3rd star is Pendent(Hanging)Brakes. The first Fords to have pendent brakes were the 1950 English Ford (EnFo) Mk1 Consul/Zephyr. They were also the first true unibody constructed vehicles. Interesting side note is both Chevy and Dodge produced unibody constructed cars domestically first before Ford 10 years later 1960 beating Ford to the punch by a year.

LarkMC
01-10-2008, 02:52 AM
1950 was the year Ford introduced 5 star motoring. The 3rd star is Pendent(Hanging)Brakes. The first Fords to have pendent brakes were the 1950 English Ford (EnFo) Mk1 Consul/Zephyr. They were also the first true unibody constructed vehicles. Interesting side note is both Chevy and Dodge produced unibody constructed cars domestically first before Ford 10 years later 1960 beating Ford to the punch by a year.

Frank Starr
01-11-2008, 06:32 PM
"The first Fords to have pendent brakes were the 1950 English Ford (EnFo) Mk1 Consul/Zephyr. They were also the first true unibody constructed vehicles" ???????

I don't think so. Try Lancia Lambda (1922) and Citroen Traction Avant (1934).

Frank Starr
Seattle

Frank Starr
01-11-2008, 06:32 PM
"The first Fords to have pendent brakes were the 1950 English Ford (EnFo) Mk1 Consul/Zephyr. They were also the first true unibody constructed vehicles" ???????

I don't think so. Try Lancia Lambda (1922) and Citroen Traction Avant (1934).

Frank Starr
Seattle

LarkMC
01-11-2008, 10:12 PM
Mr. Starr, Neither Lancia Lambda 1922 or the Citroen Traction Avant 1934 would qualify as modern integral body/chassis construction-unibody because each of their body and chassis were constructed separate and then attached together to form a single unit. Each though were forebears or originators of some of the engineering techniques used in the unibody construction process. Each vehicle you cite represent important evolution steps in the engineering process but neither vehicle can stand alone or qualify as the first unibody.

LarkMC
01-11-2008, 10:12 PM
Mr. Starr, Neither Lancia Lambda 1922 or the Citroen Traction Avant 1934 would qualify as modern integral body/chassis construction-unibody because each of their body and chassis were constructed separate and then attached together to form a single unit. Each though were forebears or originators of some of the engineering techniques used in the unibody construction process. Each vehicle you cite represent important evolution steps in the engineering process but neither vehicle can stand alone or qualify as the first unibody.

Shawn
01-12-2008, 08:43 AM
quote:Originally posted by Frank Starr

"The first Fords to have pendent brakes were the 1950 English Ford (EnFo) Mk1 Consul/Zephyr. They were also the first true unibody constructed vehicles" ???????

I don't think so. Try Lancia Lambda (1922) and Citroen Traction Avant (1934).

Frank Starr
Seattle



Hi Frank, can you clarify for me if you were talking pedals or unibody? I am confused and between your post and LarkMC's reponse... Well not enough caffiene yet this morning..

Thanks

Former owner/owner with Dad:
58 Packard Golden Hawk
62 Hawk
62 Lark
63 Lark
64 Lark
63 Champ
Currently I own:
84 Mercedes 380SL
92 Range Rover (for sale)
99 BMW 323I
and helping a 16 year old rebuild an 86 Saab 900

Lakeland, FL

Shawn
01-12-2008, 08:43 AM
quote:Originally posted by Frank Starr

"The first Fords to have pendent brakes were the 1950 English Ford (EnFo) Mk1 Consul/Zephyr. They were also the first true unibody constructed vehicles" ???????

I don't think so. Try Lancia Lambda (1922) and Citroen Traction Avant (1934).

Frank Starr
Seattle



Hi Frank, can you clarify for me if you were talking pedals or unibody? I am confused and between your post and LarkMC's reponse... Well not enough caffiene yet this morning..

Thanks

Former owner/owner with Dad:
58 Packard Golden Hawk
62 Hawk
62 Lark
63 Lark
64 Lark
63 Champ
Currently I own:
84 Mercedes 380SL
92 Range Rover (for sale)
99 BMW 323I
and helping a 16 year old rebuild an 86 Saab 900

Lakeland, FL