Is there a real market for 'driver quality' paint jobs?

[Bob Andrews]

[showbizkid]

You might be onto something there. My wife keeps encouraging me to get Barney painted, but I'm resistant for the very reasons you cited.

[Flashback]

I think there is a market in my area. However the quality of the "drivers" here has gone up drastically. Most people into cars around my area call their once a month started and driven to a local tri-county area show, a driver. The real drivers are fewer and fewer. So I think the market is going slowly away here rather than getting better.

[qsanford]

Perhaps the "Driver Quality" paint would more closely approximate the original factory applied finish? My first car was a 1960 Morris Minor and we treated it to an Earl Scheib paint job in 1977 and it stil is on the car and looks fairly good. We splurged for Matador Red as the advertised low price paint job colors weren't so hot! One that still comes to mind was Celery Green!

[8E45E]

There has to be some middle ground. But where do they go? Most body shops are production shops that are only interested in collision work, where the quicker money is. Most could not care less about classic cars, let alone try to figure out how to make money on them.

This is where you as the owner, come into the picture. A bodyman told me, the more YOU do, and the less I do, the less its going to cost for the job. And you will no doubt have more appreciation for the vehicle. Having done that, I agree the 'sweat equity' route is the ONLY way to get a decent paint job at a reasonable price.

Craig

[52-fan]

The only way my car will ever get painted is if I do it. It won't be show quality, but I don't care. I know a decent paint job can be done in less than perfect conditions because I helped my father-in-law paint my Cuda years ago in a small shop using a catalyzed enamel. It came out really nice and turned heads, but it was not a show car.

[Bob Andrews]

[Bob Andrews]

The only way my car will ever get painted is if I do it. It won't be show quality, but I don't care. I know a decent paint job can be done in less than perfect conditions because I helped my father-in-law paint my Cuda years ago in a small shop using a catalyzed enamel. It came out really nice and turned heads, but it was not a show car.

That's a good point, and I know there are folks like you out there. But I've come to realize that there are a lot of people that don't have the time, building, equipment, skills, ability, or inclination to even attempt something like that. Those might be the kind of people I could help.

[karterfred88]

There is certainly a market for the product. But, in order to do it and make a profit, will depend on where you set up shop. MAACO already exists for the newer model cars. How much teardown do you think most cars would require? At least fixed glass and seal removal, molding and insignia, or else you get the Earl Scheib (long gone by the way) job look. The local air quality rules will play a part also, as water born paint mandates are sweeping the country, making a two stage paint job almost a requirement, and the additional labor costs with it. Centralization of the shop, shipping the vehicle and material acquisition would have to be carefully coordinated to keep the cost down to where you envision it. But yes, I think the market is there. I love painting cars by the way, when I retired (the first time) from 26 years in the insurance industry I seriously thought about a franchise purchase, but didn't like the "rules" and costs. Now I'm even older and block sanding is no longer as satisfying.

[t walgamuth]

That's about what I paid for my paint on my CE project. Of course it was already apart with the trim off etc. There were so many dents I ended up paying him some extra (he did not ask for it) because that seemed fair. I'd say the paint is as good as the original paint or better. its not a concours quality job though, as I am planning to drive it a lot. We did not shortcut quality. The frame is painted with por 15 and the inside of the fenders are coated with bed liner.

[Bob Andrews]

In this version, no glass and seal removal. That extra labor would take it to a whole different level. Trim, emblems and bumpers are easy to remove. It can be done and still look right. It depends on the owner. Some would never consider a driver-level job; for others, it would be a blessing from Above. Or at least, I think it would be. Imagine fresh, shiny paint with a turnaround of less than a month, sometimes as little as a couple weeks, for $2500? I'm thinking it's possible- as long as the customer clearly understands what they're getting.

[karterfred88]

In this version, no glass and seal removal. That extra labor would take it to a whole different level. Trim, emblems and bumpers are easy to remove. It can be done and still look right. It depends on the owner. Some would never consider a driver-level job; for others, it would be a blessing from Above. Or at least, I think it would be. Imagine fresh, shiny paint with a turnaround of less than a month, sometimes as little as a couple weeks, for $2500? I'm thinking it's possible- as long as the customer clearly understands what they're getting.

That may be the sticking point. Having also managed a paint shop for a number of years, way back when, managing expectations was the hardest part.

[swvalcon]

What I call a driver paint job is just a step up from a used car quickie. You prep it right, remove dents but if you should miss a small hail dent or there is a slight wave somewhere that's part of the cost cut. You only remove the easy to remove chrome the rest gets taped and it's a single stage or at best a min. of clear no cut and buff. It's most time easy to please the customer and he's totally happy with the job. Until he lets his bird brain buddies cut it to peices thinking it should be a barret jackson type job.

[55s]

I have driven my 1955 Commander - to Ottawa, Kingston, London and other Ontario meets. (we are a very big province!) I have hesitated to drive it down to the states. In twenty five years of driving it, it has only had two paint jobs, and now could use number three. (due to a few bubbles on the front fender seam.) First one was a Maaco for $600, and number 2 was $300 repaint of the whole car after it almost went in a pool (that's another story). If I had a $10,000 paint job, I would freak whenever it rained or there was a stone chip. I have some trophies from other cars and stuff, but I learned many years ago that a perfect car and trophies can be bought. If that is your priority, have it your way. I am just as content to have a drive and go and look at other people's cars. I like them all. As a judge, I have listened to people's stories about restoring something that was their parent's pride and pleasure, about spending too much, about the fun of restoration, about pride of their own workmanship. They know it isn't perfect.

In my stints as a judge, I (with fellow judges) have awarded best paint to a car that had a Tremclad paint job, (he told me after), awarded 400 points to a perfect pick up truck (it was. The person told me about another restoration where he was fretting about making floorboards that didn't have some of the small molding creases for the floorboard ribs), and talked to many people that have poured their heart and soul (but little money) into a restoration and nice car that will not be a winner. BUT THE PRIDE OF THEIR ACCOMPLISHMENT IS BIG.

I did my first "restoration" on my avatar car in two weeks on vacation. It was purchased vandalized. Most trim was either bent or missing, many and big dents, broken glass, filled up with garbage, seats slashed, dash gauges broken. For Maaco, all glass and trim were removed. Dents were successfully removed without filler. Extremely minor bodywork otherwise, except for sanding. I sent it off to Maaco 6 days after I started, then did my own upholstery on a Singer. Not perfect, but I did it. Renovated and replaced the dash. After it came back, it took me another week of nights to put the trim back on.

To answer your question, Bob, some people are complainers and the car will never be perfect enough for them, even with a top dollar paint job. Some of the complainers have 390+ point cars and complain to judges about why they didn't get 400. Others, who made it into the 390s, are pleasantly surprised, and kind of laugh and say "Ha, ha, the judges missed this and they missed that!"

So Bob, I would definitely agree, there is a market. The previous comments about managing expectations are spot on.

[8E45E]

The bodymen I referred to in my first post are chapter members and one did own, and the other still owns a certified body shop. Communication is the key with anyone in the business! Show them, either in person, or in photos what you have done, and ask them what their materials-of-choice are to ensure compatability with the finishers they are going to use.

Craig