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SN-60
12-13-2013, 07:05 PM
Here's a sight that You don't see every day. Two 1956 Packard Caribbean HARDTOPS parked side-by-side! They were brought to the Ocean Bay Chapter's 'Octoberfest' that was held in Brookline, Massachusetts. The tri-tone example is absolutely pristine. The two-tone job was also in very nice shape, and is actually the rarer of the two, as very few '56 Caribbeans, whether hardtop or the more numerous convertible, were painted two-tone. Old SN-60 really did a double take when the two-tone job arrived, as years ago I owned the twin to this car....except Mine was the convertible version.
I began to explain to the owners of these two Packards all the problems that are inherent with Packard V8 engines. Strangely, they both jumped in their Packards and quickly drove away!

WinM1895
12-13-2013, 07:39 PM
1956 Caribbean Hardtop (5680-5697): 263 assembled.

1956 Caribbean Convertible (5680-5699): 276 assembled.

I also owned a 1956 Caribbean H/T, this was in 1975/76, so don't recall the colors.

AFAIK, only one 1956 Caribbean Convertible was painted all black, the same person that ordered it also ordered an all black 1955 Caribbean Convertible (5580-5588).

Both cars are now owned by a PI member in Anaheim.

SN-60
12-13-2013, 07:45 PM
WinM1895....You seem to know Your Packards! Would You happen to know: 1) How many two-tone Caribbeans (both body styles) were produced in 1956? and 2) Were there actually ANY special order standard shift Caribbeans built in 1956?

WinM1895
12-13-2013, 08:04 PM
WinM1895....You seem to know Your Packards! Would You happen to know: 1) How many two-tone Caribbeans (both body styles) were produced in 1956? and 2) Were there actually ANY special order standard shift Caribbeans built in 1956?
I don't recall how many tu-tone Caribbeans were sold, but I once owned a 1955 Patrician that was tri-toned (dark blue/white/light blue).

It was sold new at Simonson-Schactmayer, the S-P dealer in Santa Monica.

I later traded it straight across for a 1947 Custom Super 8 sedan to a pal of mine, he still owns it today.

Borg Warner T-85 3 M/T with or without O/D could ordered on all 1955 & 1956 Packards and Clippers.

I once owned 2 1955 Clipper Deluxes, one with, t'other w/o O/D. Both were mangy curs, the only reason I bought them was for the T-85's.

bezhawk
12-13-2013, 09:38 PM
I owned a 56 Patrician with OD, wish I still did!

63t-cab
12-13-2013, 09:52 PM
Ed, is that a vinyl top I think I see.and if so is it factory ?,should be a nice solid driving car.

Here's a sight that You don't see every day. Two 1956 Packard Caribbean HARDTOPS parked side-by-side! They were brought to the Ocean Bay Chapter's 'Octoberfest' that was held in Brookline, Massachusetts. The tri-tone example is absolutely pristine. The two-tone job was also in very nice shape, and is actually the rarer of the two, as very few '56 Caribbeans, whether hardtop or the more numerous convertible, were painted two-tone. Old SN-60 really did a double take when the two-tone job arrived, as years ago I owned the twin to this car....except Mine was the convertible version.
I began to explain to the owners of these two Packards all the problems that are inherent with Packard V8 engines. Strangely, they both jumped in their Packards and quickly drove away!

EssexExport
12-13-2013, 10:11 PM
Would not mind owning a Packard with a V-8 myself.

sals54
12-14-2013, 12:26 AM
I posted this one on the other thread about Packards…. But here goes again. Anyone know if this is the real deal or if its a custom?
http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm197/sals54/IMG_0058_zpsbaa639af.jpg (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/sals54/media/IMG_0058_zpsbaa639af.jpg.html)

SN-60
12-14-2013, 12:46 AM
Ed, is that a vinyl top I think I see.and if so is it factory ?,should be a nice solid driving car.

Joe, Yes, I'm quite sure that the '56 Packard Caribbean Hardtops came standard with a vinyl roof. I believe the material was referred to as 'Hypalon'. Could this have been the auto industry's first use of a vinyl-like covered roof panel in production?

avantilover
12-14-2013, 03:08 AM
I posted this one on the other thread about Packards…. But here goes again. Anyone know if this is the real deal or if its a custom?
http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm197/sals54/IMG_0058_zpsbaa639af.jpg (http://s296.photobucket.com/user/sals54/media/IMG_0058_zpsbaa639af.jpg.html) Sal, it looks like the real deal to me, something like a 1937 with a Cantrell body, nice wagon.

8E45E
12-14-2013, 03:19 AM
Joe, Yes, I'm quite sure that the '56 Packard Caribbean Hardtops came standard with a vinyl roof. I believe the material was referred to as 'Hypalon'. Could this have been the auto industry's first use of a vinyl-like covered roof panel in production?

The '56 Caribbean hardtop vinyl roof was a notorious water trap, and many rusted out fast. Probably the first postwar car with a vinyl top was the 1949 Kaiser Virginian.

Craig

southbend
12-14-2013, 07:48 AM
One of the the few times when seeing double is a good thing. Thanks for posting the pics of these rare and beautiful cars.

SN-60
12-14-2013, 07:56 AM
One of the the few times when seeing double is a good thing. Thanks for posting the pics of these rare and beautiful cars.

You are very welcome....they ARE true beauties.....Imagine..two cars, FOUR carburetors! I'll post a photo of that equally beautiful '54 Caribbean later today. (You can just see it to the right of the black and white '56 Caribbean.

SN-60
12-14-2013, 09:58 AM
Here's a photo of the beautiful '54 Packard Caribbean that was shown at the SDC 'Ocean Bay Chapter' Octoberfest meet!

clifford
12-14-2013, 10:39 AM
I own the match of the tri toned Caribbean, same colors, and in reasonably good condition. I bought it in Ontario about 20 years ago and drove it home to Nova Scotia. I have put a lot of miles on it since with no major problems. The engine problems that are referred to are mostly due to the oil pump, which was a double pump, one section for oil and a second section which was a vacuum pump to keep the vacuum wipers going when the engine was revved. Problems would develop when air was drawn into the system. I had quite an experience with the pump in my car. I belonged to the Packard Club, and had read all kinds of write-ups on the pump, claiming that air was getting in along the drive between the two sections of the pump. A member sold rebuilt pumps with a brass bushing on the drive, which would cure the problem. Although I wasn't having any problems except a bit of lifter clatter at idle and during slow drives such as in parades, I ordered a rebuilt pump. When I dropped the pan to install it, the first thing I found was that someone was in there before, as the vacuum pump was gone, and a solid plate closed off the face where the vacuum pump would mount. I installed the new pump, and my troubles really began. Now the lifters rattled continually, so bad that you didn't dare drive the car. I called the supplier, and he sent me a second pump. I installed it with the same result. He claimed there must be something other than the pump causing the problem. I installed a new set of lifters- same result. I changed main bearings [they had some wear, and I'm sure they were why my lifters would go down at idle or slow drives]- same result. At this point I rebuilt my original oil pump, without a vacuum pump as it was when I first dropped the pan. Put everything back together and have had no problem since. The vacuum pump is the problem with these engines- don't let anyone tell you different. It cost me about $1500.00 and lots of frustration to find this out. Lots of miles have gone on the car since with no lifter noise.
Yes, the cars did come with vinyl roofs, and originally the roof was not painted, so when water got under the vinyl you can imagine the result. Mine had been replaced before I bought the car.

8E45E
12-14-2013, 10:43 AM
Here's another '54 Caribbean: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?51526-Orphan-of-the-Day-05-25-1954-Packard-Caribbean

Craig

8E45E
12-14-2013, 10:48 AM
Sal, it looks like the real deal to me, something like a 1937 with a Cantrell body, nice wagon.

I think that one is a '40 with the glass windows in the rear quarters. Here's a '37: http://www.oldcarbrochures.com/static/NA/Packard/1937%20Packard/album_001/1937%20Packard%20Wagon-02.html

http://www.oldcarbrochures.com/static/NA/Packard/1937%20Packard/album_001/1937%20Packard%20Wagon-04.html

Craig

sals54
12-14-2013, 12:36 PM
Thanks for the heads up. I was wondering about that car for a long time.

8E45E
12-14-2013, 12:44 PM
Thanks for the heads up. I was wondering about that car for a long time.

Here's more! http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?23318-Woodn-t-you-ask-the-man-that-owns-one&highlight=imperial

Craig

studegary
12-14-2013, 01:39 PM
Joe, Yes, I'm quite sure that the '56 Packard Caribbean Hardtops came standard with a vinyl roof. I believe the material was referred to as 'Hypalon'. Could this have been the auto industry's first use of a vinyl-like covered roof panel in production?

There were other vinyl roofs before that, such as the 1950 Ford Crestliner and the 1950 Mercury Monterey (and as Craig mentioned. 1949 Kaiser).

8E45E
12-14-2013, 01:55 PM
There were other vinyl roofs before that, such as the 1950 Ford Crestliner and the 1950 Mercury Monterey (and as Craig mentioned. 1949 Kaiser).

Yep, and the Austin Atlantic coupe in England which also had a vinyl roof which also came out in 1949. I posted a photo of a Ford Crestliner here: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?53014-Orphan-of-the-Day-07-22-1958-Edsel-Pacer

Craig

WinM1895
12-14-2013, 03:05 PM
There were other vinyl roofs before that, such as the 1950 Ford Crestliner and the 1950 Mercury Monterey.
Both these cars were also offered in 1951 and there were two 1950/51 Lincoln versions. The 'baby' Lincoln was called the Lido and the Cosmopolitan was called the Capri.

GM introduced three hardtops in 1949: Buick Rivera, Cadillac Coupe DeVille, Olds 98 Holiday. The Rivera was introduced first, so it gets the credit for the first hardtop.

In 1950, GM introduced the Chevy Bel-Air, Pontiac Catalina and Olds 88 Holiday hardtops.

FoMoCo was caught flatfooted when the three hardtops were introduced in 1949, had nothing to counter them with. So they installed vinyl roofs on two door coupes, the Crestliners also came with 'swoopy' side mouldings.

Packard prewar station wagons could be ordered with either Cantrell or Hercules bodies.

Derham formal sedans were offered by Packard on 1951/54 400 Patricians, came with padded vinyl roofs w/a small rear window.

I once owned Earle C. Anthony's personal 1951 Packard Derham, it didn't have a vinyl roof, but it did have a power divider window.

8E45E
12-14-2013, 03:36 PM
I once owned Earle C. Anthony's personal 1951 Packard Derham, it didn't have a vinyl roof, but it did have a power divider window.

Here is one that is very similar modified by Dietrich: http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?67908-Orphan-of-the-Day-12-28-1951-Packard

Craig

southbend
12-14-2013, 04:17 PM
In 1950, GM introduced the Chevy Bel-Air, Pontiac Catalina and Olds 88 Holiday hardtops.

FoMoCo was caught flatfooted when the three hardtops were introduced in 1949, had nothing to counter them with. So they installed vinyl roofs on two door coupes, the Crestliners also came with 'swoopy' side mouldings.




Back in the early '50s my dad owned a '51 Ford "Vicky." He once told me that he bought a set of "swoopy" '50 Crestliner side moldings from the local Ford dealer for the Vicky but never put them on. His folks were pack rats and never threw out anything--except for the side moldings, apparently. Dad never did find them, even after grandma passed and we cleaned out the house. Also, in the mid 60s when my dad first got into Model A's he passed on a rare (then, they're repopped now) original 3 door hood that his friend offered him for free, not knowing at the time they were a very rare "A" accessory. The hood ended up in some landfill somewhere. Dad kicked himself over that one for many, many years. Moral of that story: Never turn anything down, especially if it's free. And I don't think he ever did again.

studegary
12-15-2013, 11:11 AM
Both these cars were also offered in 1951


Yes, I know. I just gave the first year, 1950, to show how much they predated the 1956 Packard mentioned as a possible first.
For 1951, I can understand carrying over the Monterey with the vinyl top, but I do not understand carrying over the Crestliner with a vinyl top since Ford came out with the Victoria hardtop for the 1951 model year. Sales held up my opinion. There were 8703 Crestliners and 110,286 Victorias for 1951. The Victoria cost $330 more than the Crestliner. It was the idea of a new car/body/hardtop at that time. Of course, Studebaker and Mercury were even later to the party with a hardtop in 1952.

SN-60
12-15-2013, 01:02 PM
A memory I have of My old '56 Packard Caribbean convertible was the problematic electronic push button gear selector for its Twin Ultramatic. In dry weather it USUALLY worked OK....but sometimes in cold, damp weather, no matter what button was pushed, It suddenly had SIX 'drive' positions!! (Henry Ford might have said....."Push any button You want, as long as You want to go forward")

SN-60
12-15-2013, 05:18 PM
Now THAT'S a wheel opening moulding!

SN-60
12-15-2013, 08:03 PM
Here's a few more shots of that wonderful tri-tone '56 Caribbean!

WinM1895
12-15-2013, 10:17 PM
Now THAT'S a wheel opening moulding!
452052 Right & 452053 Left .. Front Wheel Opening Mouldings ~ 1953/54 Packard Caribbean

I bought the last two of these that SASCO had...in 1971.

clifford
12-16-2013, 03:01 PM
Again I want to come to Packard's defense on the comment from SN-60 about problems with the push button gear selector on the 56 Caribbean. I have put between 10,000 and 20,000 miles on my 56 over the last 20 or so years, with absolutely no problems with the selector. I did take the selector and the transmission shifting unit apart and cleaned them up when I first bought the car, with no problems since.

SN-60
12-16-2013, 07:43 PM
Again I want to come to Packard's defense on the comment from SN-60 about problems with the push button gear selector on the 56 Caribbean. I have put between 10,000 and 20,000 miles on my 56 over the last 20 or so years, with absolutely no problems with the selector. I did take the selector and the transmission shifting unit apart and cleaned them up when I first bought the car, with no problems since.

Most of them probably did work well Clifford, but the ones that didn't sure did not help Packards reputation in 1956!

clifford
12-17-2013, 08:13 AM
Most of them probably did work well Clifford, but the ones that didn't sure did not help Packards reputation in 1956!

I agree that there were problems with Packard's 56 cars, but would suggest that most of them related to service issues on the twin Ultramatic [or lack of service once dealerships closed shop], and that stupid vacuum pump that ran in conjunction with the oil pump. That was not a good idea, I've had former owners tell me you could not cure the lifters from rattling. I know that is not correct, as I previously posted. The cure is to eliminate the cause of the problem, and that is the vacuum pump. It's a shame that Packard didn't survive to deal with these issues, because otherwise it was a good car. We lost an important piece of American automotive history when Packard went under.

8E45E
12-17-2013, 08:20 AM
We lost an important piece of American automotive history when Packard went under.

Not to mention, Pierce Arrow, Duesenberg, etc. I will also include Cadillac and Lincoln after the late '60's when they horrendously went cheap on them while Mercedes Benz went upmarket and did well with their S-class.

Craig

SN-60
12-17-2013, 07:51 PM
I agree that there were problems with Packard's 56 cars, but would suggest that most of them related to service issues on the twin Ultramatic [or lack of service once dealerships closed shop], and that stupid vacuum pump that ran in conjunction with the oil pump. That was not a good idea, I've had former owners tell me you could not cure the lifters from rattling. I know that is not correct, as I previously posted. The cure is to eliminate the cause of the problem, and that is the vacuum pump. It's a shame that Packard didn't survive to deal with these issues, because otherwise it was a good car. We lost an important piece of American automotive history when Packard went under.

VERY well said Clifford!

SN-60
12-18-2013, 05:05 PM
Here's a couple more views of that beautiful '54 Caribbean!

SN-60
12-19-2013, 07:28 PM
Note the hood prop. This was used on the '53-'54 Caribbean to support the extremely heavy hood, which had a leaded in 'scoop' on these fancy sports models.

63t-cab
12-19-2013, 07:37 PM
Ed, I didn't know there would be a straight 8 in any of these.what are the cubes in this monster?

Here's a couple more views of that beautiful '54 Caribbean!

SN-60
12-19-2013, 07:43 PM
Ed, I didn't know there would be a straight 8 in any of these.what are the cubes in this monster?

I believe the cubic inch of the senior '54 Packard engines was (is) 359.

WinM1895
12-19-2013, 07:56 PM
1953 Packard Caribbean/Cavalier/Mayfair: 327 cid straight 8 with 5 main bearings, only Patricians had a 327 with 9 main bearings.

1954 Packard Caribbean/Pacific/Patrician: 359 cid straight 8 with 9 main bearings. This engine was only used in 1954.

SN-60
12-21-2013, 07:40 AM
These '54 Packard Caribbean models also utilized an early version of our old friend.......the Carter WCFB four barrel carburetor. This early type WCFB will not 'bolt on' a Stude though......The base, and its mounting pattern, is considerably smaller than later versions. The center housing and the air horn & choke assy look to be about the same as later Stude types though.

SN-60
12-21-2013, 08:34 AM
Another group of fine Packards (including another Caribbean) that were displayed at an earlier SDC Ocean Bay Chapter 'Octoberfest'!

SN-60
12-28-2013, 06:33 PM
How about this handsome dark blue two-door on the left....I believe this model Packard was called the 'Custom Eight'.

WinM1895
12-28-2013, 11:09 PM
How about this handsome dark blue two-door on the left....I believe this model Packard was called the 'Custom Eight'.
22nd series (1948, early 1949) Custom 8 2 door Club Sedan, a very rare car today.

SN-60
12-29-2013, 11:03 AM
Here's a couple more shots of the rare two-tone Caribbean brought to the 'Octoberfest' this year. I've heard that there was at least one '56 Packard Caribbean that was painted in a monotone from the factory, (all black exterior), and the car definitely still exists, but I don't know for sure about it being a 'factory job'. Once again, these very limited production cars were painted predominantly in the tri-tone color scheme.

SN-60
12-29-2013, 06:01 PM
Back in the thirties, Rolls-Royce really had nothing on the high end senior Packards!