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Anne F. Goodman
11-25-2013, 12:28 PM
What number do use as Vehicle Identification number? Do you use the engine number? or the number on the frame? For a California Bill of Sale.
Thank you

289stude
11-25-2013, 12:45 PM
Not sure Anne. Did you end up with that CE? Pete called me back a while ago. I've been so busy at work I forgot to call him back.

WinM1895
11-25-2013, 01:25 PM
AFAIK, there is no VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) on any vehicles of this vintage. Vehicles were registered by their specific engine number, the problem was, if the engine was changed, the numbers no longer matched. On FoMoCo vehicles, the engine number was also stamped on the hogshead.

AFAIK, the first trucks with VIN's were 1948 Ford/Mercs, the first cars were 1949 FoMoCo's. The VIN registers the complete vehicle.

Les Kelley, the largest used car dealer in the world (Kelley Kar Co., 1225 S. Figueroa St in LA) and a Ford dealer came up with the VIN system. Kelley is far better known for Blue Books.

A VIN tag refers the plate that was riveted to the left corner of the dash, visible thru the windshield. First appearance: 1968 US/Canadian Passenger Cars, mandated by the US Gov't.

There's an SDC member who is the manager of a DMV office. She helped me register a 56J that I bought that hadn't been registered in over 20 years. Previous owner never filled out a Certificate of Non-Op, I shuddered to think what the back fees were gonna be. Out came her blue pencil...and I had a new title, cost me next to nothing.

Anne F. Goodman
11-25-2013, 01:35 PM
Yes I ended up with it. One of our club members bought it from me. So now I was trying to fill out a Bill of Sale.

bob40
11-25-2013, 05:58 PM
The number on the frame.

candbstudebakers
11-26-2013, 12:47 AM
AFAIK, there is no VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) on any vehicles of this vintage. Vehicles were registered by their specific engine number, the problem was, if the engine was changed, the numbers no longer matched. On FoMoCo vehicles, the engine number was also stamped on the hogshead.

AFAIK, the first trucks with VIN's were 1948 Ford/Mercs, the first cars were 1949 FoMoCo's. The VIN registers the complete vehicle.

Les Kelley, the largest used car dealer in the world (Kelley Kar Co., 1225 S. Figueroa St in LA) and a Ford dealer came up with the VIN system. Kelley is far better known for Blue Books.

A VIN tag refers the plate that was riveted to the left corner of the dash, visible thru the windshield. First appearance: 1968 US/Canadian Passenger Cars, mandated by the US Gov't.

There's an SDC member who is the manager of a DMV office. She helped me register a 56J that I bought that hadn't been registered in over 20 years. Previous owner never filled out a Certificate of Non-Op, I shuddered to think what the back fees were gonna be. Out came her blue pencil...and I had a new title, cost me next to nothing.

There is no back fees on an historical or collectors cars most DMV people don't know that and need to be told to read the California Vehicle code book sections 5004 A-3 and 5051 I just went through it on Friday and had $700.00 in fees wiped out. and if the Vehicle in not in the system because it has been sitting longer than the non-opp system then it is quite simple to get new title and cheap.

spokejr
11-26-2013, 01:49 PM
There is no back fees on an historical or collectors cars most DMV people don't know that and need to be told to read the California Vehicle code book sections 5004 A-3 and 5051 I just went through it on Friday and had $700.00 in fees wiped out. and if the Vehicle in not in the system because it has been sitting longer than the non-opp system then it is quite simple to get new title and cheap.

Bob,

As I read those parts of the code, that determines what is a special interest or collectors vehicle, what part of the code exempts these from back fees? The reason I ask is that I am looking at a car that's vintage `78 and 2 1/2 years expired.

Thanks,

Ken

37CoupeE
11-27-2013, 12:14 AM
Look on the bottom side of the frame just under the drivers door.
That is my 37 had the number that matched the title was stamped.

37CoupeE
11-27-2013, 12:20 AM
Check this thread out.
Talk about finding the vehicle number on a 39 Coupe Express
http://forum.studebakerdriversclub.com/showthread.php?67356-chassis-number-1939-coupe-express&p=699839#post699839

WinM1895
11-27-2013, 12:50 AM
The reason I ask is that I am looking at a car that's vintage `78 and 2 1/2 years expired.
If there's no Certificate of Non-Op, late penalty fees apply, and...

CA smog tests all 1976 and newer vehicles. All the original emissions equipment must be present and in good working order.

If the vehicle cannot pass the test, it cannot be registered, there is no waiver if the parts are obsolete. It's fix it...or park it!

In 2008, a goofus I know bought a 1976 F350 Super Camper Special in San Berdoo. Not only didn't he notice that the tag was expired, but that all the smog parts had been removed.

It's sitting in his driveway today undriven because the registration and penalty fees are over 1800 dollars! And he cannot register it until he replaces all the missing smog parts and passes the test.

Basically, he's up the proverbial creek without a paddle.

btw: In CA, the seller is responsible for any penalty fees and that the vehicle can pass the smog test. However, in this case, the seller moved out of state, so goofus is SOL

candbstudebakers
12-12-2013, 01:23 AM
Bill in the case you mention is not old enough to be exempt from any thing , the ones that are older than 25 years and a classic, historic, or special interest car are exempt just for that reason.VC section 5050 Legislative findings is the start of it all, and it reads like so," The legislature finds and declares that constructive leisure pursuits by California citizens is most important. This article is intended to encourage responsible participation in the hobby of collecting, preserving, restoring, and maintaining motor vehicles of historic and special interest, which hobby contributes to the enjoyment of the citizen and the preservation of California's automotive memorabilia."
section VC 5051 is the Definitions.
section VC 5004 is Vehicles of historic value.
section VC 9562 is waiver of penalties and registration fees.

when going into the DMV let them get all the paper work done and when they ask you for the fee for penalties if any that is when you show them the codes and most are not even aware of them and will go ask a supervisor. they can not charge for back fees and penalties.